Does anyone know of any Gunsmithing apprenticeships in or around Massachusetts? Doesn’t seem to be too much information online and the .gov site. Any recommendations / experience on how to get into that field? Thanks in advance.
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Gunsmithing Apprenticeship (MA)
- Thread starter ARedJuul
- Start date
Golddiggie
NES Member
Why would it be on the .gov site for the PRM when they (the .gov) hates firearms? Better off contacting some of the known good gunsmiths near you to find out IF they're taking any apprentices or not. Or you can go to sites like SDI or MGS (add the .edu) and look at their offerings. IMO, the online option can be a better option for a good number of people. Especially if they don't want to device to something full time. Such as already having a full time job and just wanting to get into gunsmithing as either a side gig, or moving over to it.
SDI has gotten a good amount of flak over the past couple of years. With people calling it a scam, or worse. Not really seen anything like that mentioned about MGS. Then again, MGS is significantly less money compared with SDI.
I would also look into what it takes to get your gunsmith FFL where you're living. That's one of the reasons I'm not going after one myself. Between things needed from the town, state, and finally the federal levels, it's just not viable here (renting). I'm hoping that I can either get a different place where it will be viable (if renting again) or get my own home where it won't be an issue at all, down the road a bit.
SDI has gotten a good amount of flak over the past couple of years. With people calling it a scam, or worse. Not really seen anything like that mentioned about MGS. Then again, MGS is significantly less money compared with SDI.
I would also look into what it takes to get your gunsmith FFL where you're living. That's one of the reasons I'm not going after one myself. Between things needed from the town, state, and finally the federal levels, it's just not viable here (renting). I'm hoping that I can either get a different place where it will be viable (if renting again) or get my own home where it won't be an issue at all, down the road a bit.
I appreciate the reply, thank you. I’m definitely leaning towards just contacting local gunsmiths and seeing if they would take on an apprentice. I’ve also read some not great things about SDI. Although online is tempting, as you said, it gives you more flexibility especially if it’s not full time. I’m a full time sheet metal guy. This would more than likely be for personal knowledge and possibly to find a small spot to operate out of in the future. I know in MA you cannot do a home-based FFL. That would make things much harder for sure. Thank you for the information.
Golddiggie
NES Member
If you already have a full time job, I'd lean towards the online route (MGS). Unless you can get the local gunsmith to pay you the same that you're making now during the apprenticeship. I'd look to go that route IF I wanted to dick around with different firearms more. At this point, getting a gunsmith level FFL would allow me to do more for my Cerakote work. As it stands now, there's just not enough demand to justify going that route.
I will definitely take a look into MGS, thank you. I do not want to switch jobs as I’m part of the union but would like to be competent in Gunsmithing for possible side work. More than anything I’m purely interested in learning and getting experience working with anything I can get my hands on.
Pardon the brashness, but why on earth would any gunsmith waste their time teaching you "for side work". That's not what apprenticeship is all about. It's for teaching you the skills with expectation it will provide a long term value to their shop. I'd be pretty bullshit if I paid good money for smithing and they gave it to someone there just to "get there hands on things". You're a Union guy, you should know what apprenticeship is for.
IMHO, you should be looking at schools such as:
gunsmithing.nra.org
www.pewpewtactical.com
IMHO, you should be looking at schools such as:
NRA Gunsmithing Schools
Explore how Gunsmithing is a craft that has long been a part of American history and culture.
7 Best Gunsmithing Schools: Hobbyist to Professional
Want to potentially make money from your firearms hobby? Check out our favorite gunsmithing schools that will get you prepared.
www.pewpewtactical.com
If you were already a skilled machinist with good tooling and tight tolerance machines, branching out to be a 07FFL as a sideline would be an easy step with some training. But learning the skill without the machinery that goes with it, along with the eyes, hands and brains is expensive and more than you'll ever make back in the PRM.
Learning how to work on your own stuff by watching videos and doing some easy trigger work on your own stuff is a start.
But if you take in anyone else's gun or parts to work on, you are crossing a fine legal line between hobbyist and FFL/ FFL07/ FFL07SOT
Learning how to work on your own stuff by watching videos and doing some easy trigger work on your own stuff is a start.
But if you take in anyone else's gun or parts to work on, you are crossing a fine legal line between hobbyist and FFL/ FFL07/ FFL07SOT
Yes, I didn’t word that great. I wanted to be able to learn a skill thoroughly. I primarily want to know for my own knowledge. I see where you’re coming from, there’s no reason for a gunsmith to teach a guy like me just for “side work” or “to get my hands on stuff.” It makes complete sense. The online courses seem to be the way to get started then. But at some point, to validate those skills, I would have to use them in the “field” right?
Golddiggie
NES Member
Gunsmith falls under the 01 FFL.
Thank you for the information here.Pardon the brashness, but why on earth would any gunsmith waste their time teaching you "for side work". That's not what apprenticeship is all about. It's for teaching you the skills with expectation it will provide a long term value to their shop. I'd be pretty bullshit if I paid good money for smithing and they gave it to someone there just to "get there hands on things". You're a Union guy, you should know what apprenticeship is for.
IMHO, you should be looking at schools such as:
NRA Gunsmithing Schools
Explore how Gunsmithing is a craft that has long been a part of American history and culture.7 Best Gunsmithing Schools: Hobbyist to Professional
Want to potentially make money from your firearms hobby? Check out our favorite gunsmithing schools that will get you prepared.
Golddiggie
NES Member
Only reason I knew this was due to looking into what it would take to be able to take in serialized items to Cerakote without the owner being here. Or, rather, to 'take possession' of the item to do the work. Did some more checking into it and figured out it wouldn't fly with where I currently live (renting as I mentioned). If I can get enough 'extra' $$ each month, I'd look to rent a small work space for Cerakote work. Not interested in doing any real gunsmith work. Partially due to liability, not having the knowledge needed for the more popular items. Plus not really wanting to get the machinery needed to do it at the level needed when people are paying you for the work.
If you're just wanting to learn for your own "hobby" use, maybe instead of paying for classes, get some basic equipment and build some stuff?
There are all sorts of basic designs, and even some kits, for various single-shot pistols & rifles that do not require fancy tooling.
I'm no professional gunsmith - just a self-taught hobbyist, and I've built a bunch of fun toys.
KMM696
NES Member
You can validate all the skills you want, if you own what you're working on. Buy a couple junker guns with multiple problems. Clean them up, fix their issues. Figure out where to find their missing parts. Modify them with typical gunsmith work. Bedding rifles, mounting scopes, triggers, adding brakes, refinishing, checkering. Whatever.
Take a loooong look at what you've accomplished, and decide if a customer would be happy to pay for it.
Do it again.
Read more on the work you're doing. Watch more videos of the work you're doing.
Reevaluate customer appeal of the work you're doing.
Do it again.
Repeat.
At some point in this process, you'll discover you have enough skills and tools to do the customer work.
Good luck. I'm on my third or fourth trip through the cycle, and haven't gone pro yet. Still enjoying the game, though!
Agnotology
NES Member
If you understand what SDI is offering, it's a very basic introduction to gunsmithing. Most of the information they will cover on there is readily available information. It's for people who don't have a different way into gunsmithing. You will not walk out of their courses ready to open a gunsmithing shop.
Golddiggie
NES Member
Similar to what KMM696 posted, I first got into spraying Cerakote over a decade ago. Did it for a bit, then had to stop for a few reasons (life got in the way). Decided to get back into it not that long ago. I had learned a few things from the previous time doing it. Applied it to a few things of my own, then made a couple of changes to the setup. Better spray gun helped more than you might think. Setting up the degrease tanks a bit differently also helped. Not to mention needing to make one for things over 18" like bolt action rifles. Using a different blast cabinet this time compared with the previous time too. Plus I actually bought a proper cure oven, instead of using the one I had made. This has made a significant difference in the process. Yes, people still get by with their own made ovens. But there's something to be said for getting one made for the task. The spray booth I made just over a year ago now is different enough from my previous one that it's also significant. Not to mention how I exhaust the booth. Also moving to the new method for mixing the parts for the formulas has helped. Old method was using a graduated cylinder. That was OK for the time, but now it's done by weight. Luckily they have a calculator page on the Cerakote site to make it easy for you. You just need a scale that's precise enough for the task.
I also watched a few videos for different effects. Posted by other people applying Cerakote as well as from Cerakote. Did some practice to make sure I could do the job reliably and it's all good.
Bottom line, you can get good at something like this IF you devote the time to it. Or you can take one of their classes (two locations last time I looked) if you have money to burn. IIRC, it's a few days dedicated to things. That can shorten some of the time to get good at the task. But, IMO, you'll still need to devote time to applying Cerakote to different things to really get good.
I also watched a few videos for different effects. Posted by other people applying Cerakote as well as from Cerakote. Did some practice to make sure I could do the job reliably and it's all good.
Bottom line, you can get good at something like this IF you devote the time to it. Or you can take one of their classes (two locations last time I looked) if you have money to burn. IIRC, it's a few days dedicated to things. That can shorten some of the time to get good at the task. But, IMO, you'll still need to devote time to applying Cerakote to different things to really get good.
Thank you guys. Looks like I’ll be doing my homework on online school as well as some build kits/ guns that need some tlc and go from there. Putting together an AR platform rifle peaked my interest in Gunsmithing as a whole. I do understand ARs are stupid simple, as a YouTube video and minimal hand tools can get the job done. the mechanics behind firearms in general are very interesting. Time to plan a couple builds!
Maybe I'm just old, but I simply can't learn to do something by just watching a video.
If you could convince a good gunsmith to let you work with him, you'll see dozens of guns for free that you would have to buy to actually work with them. If you could find an older guy who won't look at you as competition, rather the future, I think you'd have more luck.
But I really don't know how that side of things work, just me thinking in type...instead of out loud, where you can't hear me.
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I am pretty interested in guns and how they work. I have no professional experience in this area, but I definitely understand wanting to get more knowledge. Here are a couple of my thoughts.
I currently believe that SDI is a scam. This does not mean that no one learns anything from their courses, but it does mean that the value is low and the cost is very high. What convinced me that they are a scam is statements from hiring managers in the industry saying that they would only hire SDI graduates for entry level jobs that require no experience. In other words, the SDI certificate had the same value as a high school diploma in terms of getting hired.
To me, the big difference between a real gunsmith and an armorer is machining. If you are not comfortable in a machine shop, then learning those skills is an important step to becoming a real gunsmith. It may not scratch the itch to have your hands on guns, but it is still an important step on the journey. Also, there are often adult education courses available to learn basic machining skills, so this may be easier to find than a gunsmithing apprenticeship.
If you have not already had your hands inside lots of different guns, then that is important experience. You could try looking for poor condition guns that interest you and try to improve them. Guns listed as "needs work," "gunsmith special," or even "parts only" may have both educational and entertainment value.
I currently believe that SDI is a scam. This does not mean that no one learns anything from their courses, but it does mean that the value is low and the cost is very high. What convinced me that they are a scam is statements from hiring managers in the industry saying that they would only hire SDI graduates for entry level jobs that require no experience. In other words, the SDI certificate had the same value as a high school diploma in terms of getting hired.
To me, the big difference between a real gunsmith and an armorer is machining. If you are not comfortable in a machine shop, then learning those skills is an important step to becoming a real gunsmith. It may not scratch the itch to have your hands on guns, but it is still an important step on the journey. Also, there are often adult education courses available to learn basic machining skills, so this may be easier to find than a gunsmithing apprenticeship.
If you have not already had your hands inside lots of different guns, then that is important experience. You could try looking for poor condition guns that interest you and try to improve them. Guns listed as "needs work," "gunsmith special," or even "parts only" may have both educational and entertainment value.
Bodhisattva
NES Member
Must be in the water. I’ve been looking into getting further into it. I’ve been expanding my collection of tools, more specifically the specialized tools. A friend of mine has built custom 1911s for decades, and eventually opened a shop. He’s since retired his full time gig, sold the shop and barely does any smithing. He’s enjoying his time now. Shoots a lot of shotgun, especially since he’s become a snowbird. I recently talked to him about apprenticing when he is in the shop. His recommendation was to take a couple of classes in order to how to properly learn how run a Bridgeport and lathe. Not many shops have that ability or those tools and it makes your services more marketable as you can do a hell of a lot more.
Golddiggie
NES Member
I've had my own milling machine since 2019 now. I had a small lathe before that too. Plan to get another lathe once I have the space for the one I want. Getting a decent milling machine can help you learn a lot there too. IIRC there are some additional learning classes for running them that you can take. Well, if you don't have friends to help you with the basics. The find online sources for the additional info you need to do more. Biggest advise I can give around a mill, and/or lathe, is to NOT go cheap or small. The Grizzly I bought isn't small, but it's not a knee mill (not enough room for one). After that, you'll end up spending a good amount of money on work holding, measuring, and cutting tools. A good vice is almost worth it weight in gold when it comes to these things. Using cheap cutting tools is OK for practicing, but you'll want good ones for serious work.
DROs are also almost a requirement for more than just dicking around in a mill. Hell, even just dicking around they're more than worth getting.
If you can, find someone with a machine setup that you can get in front of and see how it's set up and how it runs before you start going down that rabbit hole.
General rule is also that you'll spend about the same that you did on the mill in both work and tool holding again. I'm pretty sure I have. More if you count the DROs. Had I known what I know now, I would have bypassed a few purchases and ended up spending less overall. Which is why I mentioned getting in front of a setup to see what involved.
DROs are also almost a requirement for more than just dicking around in a mill. Hell, even just dicking around they're more than worth getting.
If you can, find someone with a machine setup that you can get in front of and see how it's set up and how it runs before you start going down that rabbit hole.
General rule is also that you'll spend about the same that you did on the mill in both work and tool holding again. I'm pretty sure I have. More if you count the DROs. Had I known what I know now, I would have bypassed a few purchases and ended up spending less overall. Which is why I mentioned getting in front of a setup to see what involved.
