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M&P 45...Man is it sweet
- Thread starter weerwolv
- Start date
- Joined
- Jul 1, 2005
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Your right.
I know, I know...
I kind of assumed though, the dealer would call you and ask for you to return it, no? Not that you would or should, just curious how this whole mess is working? If the MP45 is not suppose to be sold yet per some crazy AG regs, what happens to dealers who already sold them?
calsdad
NES Member
Yes it is. However if the state holds me up from buying an M&P .45 I will just have to do what I have done in response to all of other dumbass regulations and threats of regulations I have seen over the last couple of years.
Buy more guns.
So I can't get an M&P - fine - I will buy 4 other guns to take it's place.
Is there a new AWB coming? Fine. I will buy as many "assault weapon" type rifles as I can humanly afford.
Ban on high cap mags? Fine and dandy. I will buy as many high cap mags as I can find in state and on sale at the gun shops.
Ammo bans and new rules? Fine once again - I will just buy as much as ammo as I possibly can afford and sit on it.
We have tried all of the political routes and obeyed all the rules and in the end it always boils down to one thing. Money talks. Wage an economic war - buy as much as you can. It will make the local gun shops stronger - if I buy every stinkin high cap mag they have in stock - they will scour the country to find more. New AWB coming - buy as many AR's and AR parts as you can - the stores will sell them - the manufacturers will ramp up to produce them and AR lowers will be buried here there and everywhere.
This is a war they cannot win. There are way more of us than there are of them - and for the moment at least - we have more money.
Somebody told me today that one of the new Ruger pistols that has come out recently ( I believe it was a carry sized gun) - has sold 87,000 since it was introduced. And this was recently. This is a war of numbers - who buys carry guns - except people who are thinking of carrying? Sooner or later the stats will force the issue in our favor.
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+1 calsdad, You got that right! If the AG blocks the M&P45 then I am buying two evil guns.![[smile]](/xen/styles/default/xenforo/smilies.vb/001.gif "Smile [smile]")
You know what makes me even more angry is the fact that these and other guns are blocked from sale for the reason of "child safety", putting aside the fact that I am a responsible adult and follow all safe storage rules I don't even have kids!
It is a sad state of affairs when our government does not trust us, you know Mrs. AG the 80,000,000 gun owners who didn't break the law today and won't tomorrow!
You know what makes me even more angry is the fact that these and other guns are blocked from sale for the reason of "child safety", putting aside the fact that I am a responsible adult and follow all safe storage rules I don't even have kids!
It is a sad state of affairs when our government does not trust us, you know Mrs. AG the 80,000,000 gun owners who didn't break the law today and won't tomorrow!
You got that right. Unfortunately most of us don't have any other way to get info. I have a friend who works for S&W but I don't like to keep bothering him b/c he does not work in the retail or legal dept.
kevin9
NES Member
WTF is right...
Can someone explain exactly what happened to cause this? If you're going to say "The AG are FOS, blah blah blah" I agree but please don't bother. I'd like to know the exact exact exchanges between the AG and S&W that caused this.
No one but the AG and S&W are privy to that.
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No.
![[devil]](/xen/styles/default/xenforo/smilies.vb/015.gif "Devil [devil]")
![[wink]](/xen/styles/default/xenforo/smilies.vb/002.gif "Wink [wink]")
Well...I was interested in the .45 M&P, now I will have to wait and see what happens, and enjoy those guns I acquired prior to October, 1998, or the ones with post 98 trigger jobs. I do have a question here: It seems like there is something foul going on in the AG's Office and that S&W is attempting to use its corporate legal assets to resolve the issue. At the grass-roots level there are a lot of unhappy campers right now. Is the time right to make a serious move to get this ridiculous AG policy voided? Is this something that GOAL could take the lead on, or maybe even the NRA itself?
Mark L.
Mark L.
calsdad
NES Member
I have wondered if there is something going on behind the scenes for a while. Way back when Coakley took office a friend of mine said that there was some questions to her about the AG's firearm regulations - and she responded by saying it was something she had to look at.
The way I see the problem is this: if she rescinds the regulations she admits they were wrong - and risks a lawsuit. If she actively enforces the regulations and pushes for more - she pisses more people off, and risks a lawsuit. The current Heller case - and the increasing evidence that civilian gun ownership reduces crime - and the ongoing violent crime in places where the govt. has tried to restrict gun ownership - only add more fuel to that fire because that evidence gives more ammunition for anybody who might try to sue MA.
It would seem to me that legally speaking she is in bit of pickle. Her best bet is to just do status quo and hope something changes down the road and nothing rocks the boat. Depending on what happens with the Heller case the Shiites might still hit the fan. I would think the regulations are extremely questionable because they interfere with legal commerce, interfere with Constitutional rights, are govt. by edict and not by law, etc.
I keep hearing rumors - and there have been postings on this site about this too - that a couple of dealers here in MA have taken the AG to court and won - and consequently are able to sell any pistol that meets the MA lawful restrictions (10 round mag limit, etc). If this is true - and I don't know that it is. That would another problem for the AG if somebody wanted to make a real issue for them.
I've been thinking the same thing the last few weeks and have been trying to come up with key point that is easy to understand and might gain some traction. I was thinking along the lines of the following; due to the "safety" rules imposed by the AG's office there is a larger volume of older firearms on the market being sold. The newer firearms are mass produced (for the whole country) by the firearms manufactuers and are safer then some of these older weapons that are being sold repeatly and have thousands of rounds through them (I know this is mis-leading, a quality well kept firearm should last a lifetime or more, but remember who we'd be making out argument to.).
A second point could be; the firearms produced by the large manufacturer's are put through vigorous quality and safety programs to prepare them for the consumer market. These firearms are meant to be mass produced and have been engineered to be manufactured that way. The "special" MA "safety" versions are "one offs", that is, they take the firearm with the robust engineering behind it and "tweak" it to fit the AG office's requirements (I'm not sure if this is really they way the process works, I'm just throwing this out there) Also, along these lines, if a popular model is mass produced there may be tens of thousands of users, or even a hundred thousand users, any defects, user issues, or safety issues will be discovered earlier because of the larger pool of firearms being used and any problem discovered can be resolved by the manufacturer in an expedious manner. The MA versions have a much smaller pool to gain user information about quality and safety.
I'm pretty much just thinking outloud here and trying to think of ways to bring this to the lawmakers/public instead of "the new versions have mushy triggers" they don't care. Also, these need work, I can think of a bunch of reasons these ideas could backfire, and the grabbers could counter with - example; "we can ban person to person sales of firearms more then 10 years old". Or, by making the requirement even stricter for MA versions due to the smaller data pool.
You are just making an argument for them to ban the transfer of old guns!
![[rolleyes]](/xen/styles/default/xenforo/smilies.vb/042.gif "Roll Eyes [rolleyes]")
haha, I agree with what you where saying. But anytime we say " these new guns are safer than the ones we already have" They think "OMG they have unsafe guns. We need to save them"
Judging by the Glock fiasco at Bass pro shops and this most recent two-step by S&W it would seem to me that the new AG is more then willing to enforce the sales regs. IMO it is a win-win for her no matter what happens, if the regs are abolished for whatever reason she will be able to play the whole "we have no choice and I fear for the safety of the children" bullshit and if the regs stay in place she is just "doing her job".
Bass pro was order to stop selling Glocks or get fined and S&W was so nervous about the AG not accepting the M&P45's compliance they rescinded their claim, seems to me like the AG does not really have much to worry about.
Bass pro was order to stop selling Glocks or get fined and S&W was so nervous about the AG not accepting the M&P45's compliance they rescinded their claim, seems to me like the AG does not really have much to worry about.
- Joined
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- 12
When the m@p45 are for sale again in MA. IT WILL HAVE THE 10LBS. TRIGGER. IMO.
If so, this wouldn't be the first time that the boys and girls down in Springfield have knuckled under the weight of opressive government. I know this is supposed to be the "new S&W"...but maybe the options just aren't there for them, either.
Ho hum, just another day in the Kommonwealth...
Mark L.
What's with the S&W bashing? They were hours away from a mass release of the M&P45 before it got squelched by the government.
S&W makes more of an effort than any other manufacturer to make all their models available in MA. They have compliant models of every handgun they make available here, and compliant models of their EBRs as well.
S&W makes more of an effort than any other manufacturer to make all their models available in MA. They have compliant models of every handgun they make available here, and compliant models of their EBRs as well.
