My brand new shiny shiny M&P .45 and my disappointment - another update post 75

When I was looking for a 45, I rented one at Manchester Firing Line (the M&P full size 45). I really didn't like shooting it at all, I remember it had a strong tendency to snap up and to the side IIRC. The grip was comfortable, that was the only thing I liked about it. The slide didn't lock back 75% of the time (granted it was a rental), and I thought the barrel was very high and it didn't handle it well. Then I shot a G21 and that was it for me. I found one, bought it, and installed a 3.5lb connector and it is head and shoulders better to shoot IMO. You are welcome to try mine out let me know, I'm on the south shore.
 
Yea it sucks. Thanks for the offers to let me check out the firearms owned by others. I appreciate it but I think I'll not impose upon you and just bug the hell out of S&W when they open. I was thinking a bout a G21 but you know... this is Mass.... A brand new M&P 45 is half the cost of a used G21. So it kind of made the choice easy. But hell - I'll probably end up with the G21 anyway, so this little adventure has basically cost me more money.

I should have followed my own advice... Buy once & cry once.... Otherwise you just cost yourself more getting what you should have gotten in the first place. I'll update again after speaking to S&W and again upon the firearms return to me. After this latest adventure with this brand though I think i'll never buy another S&W again.

I don't care for my Ruger SR45. The grip is too big for my hands. But at least the damn things works. Never a failure to feed, accurate, and mags go insert without issue. Not to mention the Rugers (SR1911 and SR45) are the most accurate pistols I have. God dang it, I really wanted to like this pistol. Its just so nice and lite and comfortable.
 
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ThePreBanMan said:
Yea it sucks. Thanks for the offers to let me check out the firearms owned by others. I appreciate it but I think I'll not impose upon you and just bug the hell out of S&W when they open. I was thinking a bout a G21 but you know... this is Mass.... A brand new M&P 45 is half the cost of a used G21. So it kind of made the choice easy. But hell - I'll probably end up with the G21 anyway, so this little adventure has basically cost me more money.

I should have followed my own advice... Buy once & cry once.... Otherwise you just cost yourself more getting what you should have gotten in the first place. I'll update again after speaking to S&W and again upon the firearms return to me. After this latest adventure with this brand though I think i'll never buy another S&W again.

I don't care for my Ruger SR45. The grip is too big for my hands. But at least the damn things works. Never a failure to feed, accurate, and mags go insert without issue. Not to mention the Rugers (SR1911 and SR45) are the most accurate pistols I have. God dang it, I really wanted to like this pistol. Its just so nice and lite and comfortable.
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If the P226 fits your hand why not try a P220? .45 and probably similar ergos as the P226.

SIG is also making a couple MA compliant 1911's now.
 
I can't believe S&W replaced your M&P with a Glock
[packing up m&p]
[yelling at wife] WHERE IS THE GOTDAMN BUBBLE WRAP!!??
 
Wow, I'm really sorry to see that you're having this many problems with a new pistol. You could have just gotten a 'Monday' gun. I took a factory tour once and they racks full of M&P slides ready for assembly. I'd never thought about buying one until I used one of the M&P .45's at Smith's range in Springfield in 2010. The pistol was a natural. I ran several hundred rounds through it there without an issue. I then bought one of the plain Jane's and have run hundreds of rounds of everything from cheap steel to excellent high performance ammunition through without a hiccup. Period. Yep, my trigger is a slight bit slower than S&W's range model, but nothing a hand grip exerciser won't help. I have several M&P's in different calibers and haven't had a dog in any of them. Maybe I'm just fortunate. I'd say give S&W the opportunity to make it right. I sent a 3rd Gen .45 (CS-45) back to them a few years ago and they did a phenomenal job on it. Just be sure to get a tracking number from S&W and check in regularly.

Best of luck to you.
 
Call S&W. Sounds like you got a bad one. They will make it right.

Every M&P I've had has been flawless and ditto for everyone else I know with one. I love M&Ps!
 
Another update...

So I took it to the range again yesterday - for shits and giggles really. I knew what to expect, but I wanted to see if replacing the extractor at least made some difference... Nope (pic below of failure to feed)

IMAG0189.jpg

Then a new problem emerged. On an empty mag the slide wouldn't lock back. Investigation revealed the magazine follower somehow was getting past the slide catch... I don;t know how this was happening because with the slide off and an empty mag I couldn't get it to happen by manipulating it with my fingers... Check it out below and look in the top left area of the mag follower... yea - where is the slide catch that the follower should be pushing up on... It's jammed between the follower and the side of the slide. Which also made ejecting the mag very difficult too.
IMAG0195.jpg

Sometimes when it happens the slide will lock back - barley...
IMAG0191.jpg IMAG0192.jpg

At least my groups tightened up with it though... (10 yards w/ about 1 sec between shots) This group would have had a few more holes were it not for a failure to feed... [thinking]
IMAG0190.jpg



So last night I removed the Apex duty carry kit and installed the factory parts. When S&W gets back to work on Monday I'll be sure to hit them up and get this thing into them.


On another note I brought the Glock out at the same time. Nothing eventful to report there... My groups opened up quite a bit. I've got to learn how to handle this new club framed pistol of mine. The grip is freaking huge. So far it has my shots going left. I would like to see if there is something I can do to get a better grip on it too. After a few shots I had to reposition my grip on it.

One other thing I noticed too in shooting the Glock right after the S&W is that the Glock recoils straight back and up and the nicely returns to target. The M&P recoils up and to the right and doesn't return to target as nicely for me. I've learned to deal with it - and honestly didn't even notice the difference until side by side with the Glock.

But I'm still holding out hope for the M&P. Its really comfortable, fits my hand well, and I apparently can shoot it well, despite its faults. Hopefully S&W fixes it right the FIRST time.

This thing was absolutely a Monday Morning Special. Or someone got forced to work overtime and was pissed off or something. But I do believe that the slide not locking back and the mag catch blocking mag insertion are related to the same core issue - and out of tolerance frame. *Could* even be the cause of the failure to feed too, but I'm more skeptical of that. I think that has to do more with the slide based on my previous pictures showing how the slide jams the cartridge case and doesn't hold it flush.
 
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I sold my G17 because I was constantly shooting left and it didn't fit my hand well. My hopes were/are to replace it with an M&P45 ... and maybe an M&P 9. I shoot my shield much better than the G17.
 
my M&P 45 had the same FTF issues. I filed my extractor some but the issue still arose intermittantly. I ended up removing a coil from the extractor spring and now it feeds everything. I read about the extractor spring issue on the S&W forums. When you get a FTF like you have pictured, try pressing on the rear of the extractor on the outside of the slide. If the round slides in and the slides closes, then you have too much spring tension on the extractor. The weird thing is, mine was flawless for the first 1k rounds of WWB. When I tried a bunch of diff. brands of ammo I started having issues.
 
s&w should make it right, sucks i have to send my ruger sr1911 back for the second time for the same thing. You won't be sorry with the g21
 
Thanks Joe. But because of the other issues I think I'll have to send it in anyway. So I'm inclined to just let them deal with it. Based on the combination of all the issues I'm really expecting they'll just give me an entirety new firearm.
 
Got it back from S&W this Friday. took it out to the range today. Its still not right... I loaded 1 cartridge into a mag and sent it down range. The slide failed to lock back on an empty mag. The slide catch still jammed between the mag follower and slide. I also still hit the mag catch when inserting a mag..... In other words, they didn't fix a damn thing...

They replaced the extractor - which I had already tried.
They replaced the slide catch
They "modified the barrel"

All in all though - it still has EVERY single problem I sent it to them to fix... Plus I was able to reproduce the failure on the very first cartridge. 1 round and a failure... That is just terrible. I mean really - don;t they check their repair work. What kind of quality control is that?

Anyway I'll be calling them again on Monday - and sending it back to them....again... This time I'm basically going to tell them this is unacceptable and I want an entirely new firearm or a 100% cash refund, including tax. We'll see how that goes...
 
ThePreBanMan said:
Not impressed with the mag capacity of the 220, or the weight. I don't think we can get the 227 in mass. Plus it's 10 pounds! Looks sharp though. I like the slender grip. Looks like it would fit my hands pretty well. Don't think I can get one though so its a moot point.

im kind of sad about that though. I would like to hold one at a minimum and get a feel for it. I'm open minded and certainly can be convinced.
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I don't get this. S&W M&P's are 10 rounds. If you want more magazine capacity, go with a Glock 21 SF with some pre-bans mags. The Sig P220 is 8+1 with aftermarket 10 rounders available...

As far as triggers go, even with an apex kit, my M&P40 trigger still felt like crap compared to the single action of the DA/SA Sig. I couldn't wait to get rid of the M&P... hated the .40 cal round and hated the trigger. Shooting my Sig P220 is night and day compared to the S&W.
 
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mav said:
I don't get this. S&W M&P's are 10 rounds. If you want more magazine capacity, go with a Glock 21 SF with some pre-bans mags. The Sig P220 is 8+1 with aftermarket 10 rounders available...

As far as triggers go, even with an apex kit, my M&P40 trigger still felt like crap compared to the single action of the DA/SA Sig. I couldn't wait to get rid of the M&P... hated the .40 cal round and hated the trigger. Shooting my Sig P220 is night and day compared to the S&W.
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Honestly I'm strongly considering just dumping the M&P. I have a Glock 21 now and I'm really just not into dealing with this crap anymore. It will do until I can get hands on a 227.
 
Don't you just love the glock 21sf such a nice gun. I love mine :)

Though i kinda want a glock 30sf now and want to try the sig 227 as well
 
I don;t have the 21 SF. I've got the full size frame. It doesn't fit my hand too well, but with some decal grip tape on the grip I can manage it. I also put in an extended slide catch so I can reach that too, and an extended mag release. Top it off with a ghost 3.5 trigger bar and its a pretty sweet firearm.
 
ThePreBanMan said:
I don;t have the 21 SF. I've got the full size frame. It doesn't fit my hand too well, but with some decal grip tape on the grip I can manage it. I also put in an extended slide catch so I can reach that too, and an extended mag release. Top it off with a ghost 3.5 trigger bar and its a pretty sweet firearm.
Click to expand...

If you don't want to get a 21SF just get a reduction done, it makes a big difference.

-Mike
 
DMWB said:
Anyone who knows anything about what the government purchases and why should have the good sense to avoid same at all costs 90% of the time. Not that the M&P is a bad gun, but don't fool yourself into thinking MSP got them because of some significant tactical advantage.

Just because they drive Crown Vics and Explorers doesn't mean those vehicles are a particularly good choice for you or me.
Click to expand...

It was likely either:

A) Someone's relative cut a deal

or

B) Someone got their pockets lined for cutting a deal



Why not just get a good, old fashioned P-220, or a Ruger P-90 or a S&W 4506?
 
I had feeding problems with my M&P 40 right from the get go. I bought it new from FS, cleaned it, and heat treated it with FrogLube. Later that week when I shot it for the first time (shooting 165gr PMC and 180gr Fiocchi) I had at least 5 failure to feed with both brands of ammo. I shot 100 rounds of each and the FTFs each time was the round not fully chambering or jam somehow on the feed ramp. I plan to polish the feed ramp this week, hoping this will fix the problem but if not then I'll be calling S&W. Also the jams occurred in both magazines that came with the firearm so its probably a firearm issue and not the mag or ammo. It sucks even more because this is my first handgun and I chose it over the P226 and Glock 22.

Update: I also shot 200 rounds of Winchester white box and American Eagle yesterday with the M&P40 and still had 1-2 jams with each ammo.
 

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