My brand new shiny shiny M&P .45 and my disappointment - another update post 75

ThePreBanMan

ThePreBanMan

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Picked it up from Mass Firearms School. Got the last one. Initial impressions - build quality seems high, trigger is the worst I've seen in. In goes the Apex duty/carry action enhancement kit - before I even took it to the range for the first time. Trigger is much improved but reset is still a little weak.

But I was excited. If anyone read my Ruger SR45 review you know I've been searching for a .45 to replace my Sig 226 in .40 that I keep by my side when on the home front. When I heard Mass state police were dumping the 226 in 40 for the M&P in 45 then I figured I had to have a winner. I like the aesthetics, and the ergonomics. It fits my hand well with the small back strap. I really wanted to like this gun.

So yesterday I took out my brand new M&P .45 and a couple hundred rounds of Winchester white box. And I was let down pretty quickly. First is that I had consistent failure to feed issues. It looked like it was jamming as the cartridge was half fed, with the back of the case failing to slide behind the extractor. I field stripped it and hand fit an empty case between the slide and extractor. Fit seems way too tight between the extractor and the opposing edge on the slide. Also had great difficulty sliding the cartridge into place. So something must be out of tolerance. So I'm going to have to reinstall the factory trigger and send it off to S&W.

Sadly that wasn't my only issue. A couple of occasions when inserting a magazine it seemed to jam up on me half way in. Field strip again and inserted the mag watching it go in and out. Discover that if you apply slight pressure on the magazine during insertion a certain way that magazine binds up and gets caught on the mag catch. There is no way to "send it home" as the mag catch overhangs the lip of the magazine. Performing such would actually cause damage. So I have to ease off the magazine and then reinsert applying pressure only directly under the magazine.

So this is what the state police are dumping the 226 for? I don't know about the problems the state police are having with the 226 but mine is about 15 years old, has seen about 7k rounds and has never jammed on me once, ever. Never ever - yea I mean never ever. The thing is a garbage disposal.

So I clearly got a lemon. I'm expecting S&W will make it right. But man, what a disappointment from a gun I really wanted to like.

Oh - it's not as accurate as my Ruger SR45 is either. But that damn gun won't fit my hand well and I don't like the trigger.

I've now tried 3 different 45s in an effort to replace the 40 by my side. (Ruger sr45, ruger sr1911, and the m&p 45). Each and every time when it comes to reliability these guns have been found wanting compared to my sig.

I know some here think sig has gone down the toilet. Maybe your right. Mine is a bit older and I've had it for a long time. But these are my experiences folks. Take them for what they are worth. YMMV. I'm not a brand loyalist. I just want what's best for the purpose it will fulfill. Maybe I'll have to take out a second mortgage and just get the rare Gen4 Glock 21 in Mass. Jury is still out on the M&P, and I'll report back how S&W handles it.
 
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Re: My brand new shines M&P .45 and my disappointment

I've said the same thing in other threads. Im not in love with my M&P 45

Sent from my XT907 using Tapatalk 2
 
I have an MP 45 and have never had any issues with it as far as reliability or accuracy. I have installed the apex kit and that took care of the trigger. I did have a finish issue when the gun was brand new before I fired it and Smith Wesson replaced the slide promptly. Gun has been great. I also got an SR 1911 and it has been great also and very accurate. I have not had any reliability issues with either. Smith Wesson will make it right for you and I hope it works out. Good luck with it and don't give up on it yet.
 
I'm not giving up on it. I really want to like it so I'm giving S&W a chance to fix it up. Assuming the slide is the problem with the failure to feed, and the frame is the problem with the mag insertion as opposed to the mag catch itself, I may require an entirely new firearm. I hope a slide and mag catch does it. I don't want to have to deal with changing firearms and dealing with the head aches that come from getting a new serial number in this state. Would I fa10 the old one back to S&W and then fa10 register the new one. How would that work? I don't even know..... Can they send it directly to me or do I have to deal with a dealer?

My SR1911 has failed to feed on me once (hollow points). It's seen a couple hundred rounds. Could have been the ammo, but the jury is still out. Until I know for sure, the old faithful garbage disposal will remain by my side.

To me a failure is a failure. I don't dismiss it as oh well it was a failure to feed, like it doesn't count or something. Each failure requires an investigation to determine the cause so corrective action can be taken.
 
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I guess I have been pretty lucky as far as any reliability issues or anything with most firearms I've ever owned. Only pistol that gave me any issues was a Ruger P90 which would fail to chamber constantly. Went with a heavier recoil spring and issues went away. I would let someone else try the pistol out just for the fun of it. It's the first thing I do and recommend to anyone having issues. Magazine issue you are having is strange though, never heard of anything like that with the MP line. I think Smith Wesson will sort it out for you.
 
fishhawk357 said:
I guess I have been pretty lucky as far as any reliability issues or anything with most firearms I've ever owned. Only pistol that gave me any issues was a Ruger P90 which would fail to chamber constantly. Went with a heavier recoil spring and issues went away. I would let someone else try the pistol out just for the fun of it. It's the first thing I do and recommend to anyone having issues. Magazine issue you are having is strange though, never heard of anything like that with the MP line. I think Smith Wesson will sort it out for you.
Click to expand...

Well they will have an opportunity to make it right. I suppose I've been pretty lucky too. But when you deal in numbers sooner or later a dud comes up. Stacked tolerances in mass production are a reality really. Sometimes when two mating parts are at opposite extreme ends of those tolerances bad things happen.
If this gun were for fun I would let someone else try it out, maybe try to fix it myself by replacing the extractor and mag catch first. But eff that, this thing is brand new and such things should not be required. Being a candidate for a self defense gun, such failures are completely unacceptable.
 
If you are local I can let you try a 21 before you buy. It's cheaper then buying first and possibly regretting later. That's if you are thinking of getting one. You can try my MP 45 also for comparison. Sometimes a year or two or three can be a huge difference in manufacturing tolerances. Mine was not without issue though it was a finish flaw.
 
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I have had my M&P 45 for a couple of years now (I currently have 4 M&P's) I had the Apex system installed by John at Remsport within a week of picking it up. The gun has been awesome. The one state trooper I know tod me that they are very popular.
I do think that when things go wrong you hear about it more and with more passion than when things go right. My take on issues people are having with the M&P is a combination of the volume of guns S&W are pumping out and the huge increase of inexperienced employees that S&W has brought in to keep up production.
Sure the factory trigger sucks, even the non Massachusetts ones. And it sucks getting the first one made on Monday morning or the last one made on Friday afternoon by a 22 year old high school drop out whose previous job was slapping together a double Whopper with cheese at BK. When things get back to normal and a core of employees is established then I think we will see fewer lemons getting by QC. In the mean time S&W will fix the issues some people are having in what I think is an outstanding line of pistols.
 
It's not a fascination with the police gun. I intended to get it anyway. Upon learning that the state police will be using it, it just added to the pedigree. But that had no bearing on my decision to buy it.

My 226 I bought because its a good quality firearm.
My 92fs I bought because its a good quality firearm.

It just so happens that the long arm of the law or the military chooses them for the same reason. Personally I don't give a flying **** what they use. I buy what I like and what works and what is reliable. Turns out they largely do the same. So we often arrive at the same conclusions.
 
Re: My brand new shiny shiny M&P .45 and my disappointment

ThePreBanMan said:
It's not a fascination with the police gun. I intended to get it anyway. Upon learning that the state police will be using it, it just added to the pedigree. But that had no bearing on my decision to buy it.

My 226 I bought because its a good quality firearm.
My 92fs I bought because its a good quality firearm.

It just so happens that the long arm of the law or the military chooses them for the same reason. Personally I don't give a flying **** what they use. I buy what I like and what works and what is reliable. Turns out they largely do the same. So we often arrive at the same conclusions.
Click to expand...

If you like the p226 then maybe a p227 might be right up your ally.

Sent from my SPH-L710 using Tapatalk 4 Beta
 
Remember price is a major consideration in government purchasing. When you buy a big lot of $500 guns vs. $800 guns it adds up. Supposedly the MSP didn't have the greatest experience with their Sig's either though. It is nice that they are using a MA made product (although I am not the worlds biggest m&p fan).
 
I have a M&P 45 with an out of state trigger plus the Apex kit. It has never had any failures to feed or eject, with about 400 rounds through it by now.

Definitely get Smith and Wesson to make it right.
 
My brand new shiny shiny M&P .45 and my disappointment

Anyone who knows anything about what the government purchases and why should have the good sense to avoid same at all costs 90% of the time. Not that the M&P is a bad gun, but don't fool yourself into thinking MSP got them because of some significant tactical advantage.

Just because they drive Crown Vics and Explorers doesn't mean those vehicles are a particularly good choice for you or me.
 
My brand new shiny shiny M&P .45 and my disappointment

I have one and I am nothing but happy with it. I've been anti MP for the longest time. I'm converted now.
 
I carry a P229 in .40 and have ordered an M&P45 to replace it. with the 4" slide it is the same size as the P229 and 5 ounces less.

I sometimes do find myself tempted just to go to a P226 in 9mm.

Mike
 
Both the problems you're describing are incredibly easy to fix. They also both go away (most of the time) within 200 rounds of ammo and a good scrub down. Ive had an M&P45 and have 3 M&P 40's. All of the ones bought new acted like this until after a good break in with major power factor ammo (I reload) One of the 40's had the same issues you're describing and wasn't resolved with break in. This was quickly fixed in a matter of minutes with a file and some elbow grease.

Not a bad idea sending it to smith and wesson right off the bat. However, if you want to take a crack at it and learn the insides of the firearm, the two parts you have to file cost a combined total of under $10 and can be replaced and kept under warranty by you if you ever need to send it back and are worried that S&W would be mad about the home gunsmithing. I'd be more than willing to come out and walk you through it as well.
 
My brand new shiny shiny M&P .45 and my disappointment

Every gun and makes will have issues. It's not specific to SW. I had a Glock that had all sorts of feeding issues. It's bound to happen. Atleast SW makes it right with their great warranty as do most.
 
partyboy424 said:
Both the problems you're describing are incredibly easy to fix. They also both go away (most of the time) within 200 rounds of ammo and a good scrub down. Ive had an M&P45 and have 3 M&P 40's. All of the ones bought new acted like this until after a good break in with major power factor ammo (I reload) One of the 40's had the same issues you're describing and wasn't resolved with break in. This was quickly fixed in a matter of minutes with a file and some elbow grease.

Not a bad idea sending it to smith and wesson right off the bat. However, if you want to take a crack at it and learn the insides of the firearm, the two parts you have to file cost a combined total of under $10 and can be replaced and kept under warranty by you if you ever need to send it back and are worried that S&W would be mad about the home gunsmithing. I'd be more than willing to come out and walk you through it as well.
Click to expand...

There are a lot of assumptions in your post that may not be correct. Example, you propose filing the extractor. But what if it is the slide and not the extractor that is out of tolerance. Also you propose filing the magazine catch. But what if it is the frame that is out of tolerance? Both of those assumptions could be inaccurate - aside from being what should be completely unnecessary on a brand new gun.

Im completely comfortable with the gun. Installed the apex myself. It's a pretty simple design. But in this case, I would prefer to leave it to the manufacturer. That's what warranties are for... If it ain't right I'm not going to try to fix a brand new gun myself. Let them make it right.
 
Kid Presentable said:
OP have you looked at the p220 or the new p227
Click to expand...

Not impressed with the mag capacity of the 220, or the weight. I don't think we can get the 227 in mass. Plus it's 10 pounds! Looks sharp though. I like the slender grip. Looks like it would fit my hands pretty well. Don't think I can get one though so its a moot point.

im kind of sad about that though. I would like to hold one at a minimum and get a feel for it. I'm open minded and certainly can be convinced.
 
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I have an M&P 45 and I have had no feeding problems. The MA trigger sucked but I just replaced the tigger return spring for $2.75. Accuracy is excellent. The problems you have encountered can be fixed by the factory or a simple break in. Most semi autos I have needed at least 500 to 1000 rounds before they were completely reliable.

A friend of mine is a training officer for the Springfield MA PD. He is a veteran IPSC competitor as well as an experience LE instructor. He loves the M&P 45. He said that they have had no reliability problems and all of the officers shoot this gun well, including female officers with small hands. I was impressed with this endorsement.
 
Unlike the S&W M&P45, Winchester White Box does not enjoy a particularly stellar reputation for product quality. While it has been my primary go-to brand, for range use, over the last fifteen years, I have found many instances of poor quality, including missing primers, too-deeply-set projectiles, and even one with a reversed projectile. The gun forums are full of people reporting excellent performance with their S&W M&P45; these same gun forums are also full of people reporting gun failures with WWB.

Frankly, I wouldn't assume that it's the gun.
 
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