New York woman shot, killed by homeowner after car she was in pulled into wrong driveway

fencer said:
This guy is an absolute ass hole. I hope they bury him under the jail.
I can't wait to hear his defense.

Why, for the love of God, would he fire into the vehicle? There has to be something seriously wrong with this guy.
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Agreed.

I’ve read many posts here over the years saying it’s fine to shoot trespassers. I’ll be curious to see whether any of those posters show up here.
 
Okay here's my hot take on this after arguing with liberals for hours on twitter.

What are the chances that the cops are telling the whole story and not holding on important facts? What are the chances that the DA is doing the same thing? What are the chances that the media is playing with the truth?

Let's be honest with ourselves. We live in a blue state. This guy did too. Even if we dotted every i and crossed every t what are the odds that we'll end up in a jail cell even with a 100% solid perfect justification of use of force? Would, you or I or anyone else on here believe for a single microsecond that we would receive a fair shot at acquitting ourselves? Or would the state use every single legal trick and trap as a means of defeating even the most perfect justification of the use of force? Do you think the liberals in this state wouldn't want any of our heads on a stick?

Let me make this clear. I'm not justifying what was done. I'm not making excuses. It's very likely that this guy could have been a hot head and fired needlessly. But it begs the question. If this guy never broke the law in his life how much of a hothead could he be really? I've been around the block long enough now to see how DGU works. Any defensive gun use no matter perfect the justification and the shooter is an automatic villain no matter what.

My point in all of this is the pig pile. We all do it. I've been guilty of it myself, plenty of times. The point being that we play right into the hands of the left. Jump to conclusions without having all of the facts. The left doesn't care even if the justification is 100% perfect. The fact you, a plebe, used a gun, is what matters to them not the justification.

They are patterning us and it seems like far too many people of the gun don't see this. They want to create just enough doubt that in the moment that a gun is the most useful ever, we don't pull the trigger, we hesitate, and consequently accept our fate. The left realizes that they can't come after the guns so instead they're going to come after self defense. I'm not even saying that this was a self defense incident, it could be paranoia and stupidity. But in the end the left is now realizing that gun grabbing is done and guns are here so go after the reason for them to exist at all. I can see the pivot out there. It's subtle but it's there.
 
VetteGirlMA said:
Okay here's my hot take on this after arguing with liberals for hours on twitter.

What are the chances that the cops are telling the whole story and not holding on important facts? What are the chances that the DA is doing the same thing? What are the chances that the media is playing with the truth?

Let's be honest with ourselves. We live in a blue state. This guy did too. Even if we dotted every i and crossed every t what are the odds that we'll end up in a jail cell even with a 100% solid perfect justification of use of force? Would, you or I or anyone else on here believe for a single microsecond that we would receive a fair shot at acquitting ourselves? Or would the state use every single legal trick and trap as a means of defeating even the most perfect justification of the use of force? Do you think the liberals in this state wouldn't want any of our heads on a stick?

Let me make this clear. I'm not justifying what was done. I'm not making excuses. It's very likely that this guy could have been a hot head and fired needlessly. But it begs the question. If this guy never broke the law in his life how much of a hothead could he be really? I've been around the block long enough now to see how DGU works. Any defensive gun use no matter perfect the justification and the shooter is an automatic villain no matter what.

My point in all of this is the pig pile. We all do it. I've been guilty of it myself, plenty of times. The point being that we play right into the hands of the left. Jump to conclusions without having all of the facts. The left doesn't care even if the justification is 100% perfect. The fact you, a plebe, used a gun, is what matters to them not the justification.

They are patterning us and it seems like far too many people of the gun don't see this. They want to create just enough doubt that in the moment that a gun is the most useful ever, we don't pull the trigger, we hesitate, and consequently accept our fate. The left realizes that they can't come after the guns so instead they're going to come after self defense. I'm not even saying that this was a self defense incident, it could be paranoia and stupidity. But in the end the left is now realizing that gun grabbing is done and guns are here so go after the reason for them to exist at all. I can see the pivot out there. It's subtle but it's there.
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No need to go there. You don't end someones life for the mistake of accidentally pulling into your driveway.

Always remember that at the end of the day there are scumbags on both sides of the aisle.
 
HARRYM said:
No need to go there. You don't end someones life for the mistake of accidentally pulling into your driveway.

Always remember that at the end of the day there are scumbags on both sides of the aisle.
Click to expand...

Again I want to state the obvious that seems to be zinging over people's heads. I hear lots of people say "can't trust the media, they lie" and yet here we are trusting them implicitly while hearing only one side a story.

I swear critical thinking is dead and buried in the corn field. We deserve our fate now. We earned it.
 
VetteGirlMA said:
Okay here's my hot take on this after arguing with liberals for hours on twitter.

What are the chances that the cops are telling the whole story and not holding on important facts? What are the chances that the DA is doing the same thing? What are the chances that the media is playing with the truth?

Let's be honest with ourselves. We live in a blue state. This guy did too. Even if we dotted every i and crossed every t what are the odds that we'll end up in a jail cell even with a 100% solid perfect justification of use of force? Would, you or I or anyone else on here believe for a single microsecond that we would receive a fair shot at acquitting ourselves? Or would the state use every single legal trick and trap as a means of defeating even the most perfect justification of the use of force? Do you think the liberals in this state wouldn't want any of our heads on a stick?

Let me make this clear. I'm not justifying what was done. I'm not making excuses. It's very likely that this guy could have been a hot head and fired needlessly. But it begs the question. If this guy never broke the law in his life how much of a hothead could he be really? I've been around the block long enough now to see how DGU works. Any defensive gun use no matter perfect the justification and the shooter is an automatic villain no matter what.

My point in all of this is the pig pile. We all do it. I've been guilty of it myself, plenty of times. The point being that we play right into the hands of the left. Jump to conclusions without having all of the facts. The left doesn't care even if the justification is 100% perfect. The fact you, a plebe, used a gun, is what matters to them not the justification.

They are patterning us and it seems like far too many people of the gun don't see this. They want to create just enough doubt that in the moment that a gun is the most useful ever, we don't pull the trigger, we hesitate, and consequently accept our fate. The left realizes that they can't come after the guns so instead they're going to come after self defense. I'm not even saying that this was a self defense incident, it could be paranoia and stupidity. But in the end the left is now realizing that gun grabbing is done and guns are here so go after the reason for them to exist at all. I can see the pivot out there. It's subtle but it's there.
Click to expand...
to your point....

in the article I couldn't help but notice the homeowner said he has a wide driveway and there is a gate at the end of it. The gate either open or closed implies that it is not a road.
and with GPS today, assuming they had it and were using it, not that it is totally accurate, it is accurate enough to know you are not on a road.

Additionally, the girl was in the car with three other people.

Immediately upon driving up that road and seeing a dwelling should have immediately told you that you are in the wrong area and then back out.

Of course I do not know all the circumstances, but you are right....blue states and a justified response with a gun will most likely end up with the homeowner in jail.

Because law is implemented and justice is served based on sentiment and not facts.
 
VetteGirlMA said:
Again I want to state the obvious that seems to be zinging over people's heads. I hear lots of people say "can't trust the media, they lie" and yet here we are trusting them implicitly while hearing only one side a story.

I swear critical thinking is dead and buried in the corn field. We deserve our fate now. We earned it.
Click to expand...
Sorry, but the critical thinking didn't happen when the moron blew away a 20 yr old for pulling into his driveway. 4 people in the car and he opens up on them from his porch. How was his life in danger exactly? How did he even know who was in the car? He could have simply asked them "how can I help you folks?"

Standing on his porch, with people sitting in their car, is clearly not a life or death decision for the shooter. Nobody should expend a breath of air defending this POS.
 
HARRYM said:
Sorry, but the critical thinking didn't happen when the moron blew away a 20 yr old for pulling into his driveway. 4 people in the car and he opens up on them from his porch. How was his life in danger exactly? How did he even know who was in the car? He could have simply asked them "how can I help you folks?"

Standing on his porch, with people sitting in their car, is clearly not a life or death decision for the shooter. Nobody should expend a breath of air defending this POS.
Click to expand...


Again I ask the question, what are the chances that we are being given bad information, misinformation, disinformation or even partial truths for either the media, police or DA? How many of these incidents that we see in the media where the information turns out to be straight up fabrication?

Do you find it odd that someone who lives an entire life with no criminal record suddenly snaps one night out of the blue at the presence of a car in the driveway? Does that seem logical or not?
 
HARRYM said:
Sorry, but the critical thinking didn't happen when the moron blew away a 20 yr old for pulling into his driveway. 4 people in the car and he opens up on them from his porch. How was his life in danger exactly? How did he even know who was in the car? He could have simply asked them "how can I help you folks?"

Standing on his porch, with people sitting in their car, is clearly not a life or death decision for the shooter. Nobody should expend a breath of air defending this POS.
Click to expand...
And BTW he fired on the car as they were leaving. Then the moron shooter initially refused to exit his house when police arrived.

You make a choice to kill, you had better be correct in that it was your life or the victims life when all is said and done.
 
HARRYM said:
Sorry, but the critical thinking didn't happen when the moron blew away a 20 yr old for pulling into his driveway. 4 people in the car and he opens up on them from his porch. How was his life in danger exactly? How did he even know who was in the car? He could have simply asked them "how can I help you folks?"

Standing on his porch, with people sitting in their car, is clearly not a life or death decision for the shooter. Nobody should expend a breath of air defending this POS.
Click to expand...
I don't go to my door unless it's an invited guest that I'm expecting. Nope for all others.
 
VetteGirlMA said:
Again I ask the question, what are the chances that we are being given bad information, misinformation, disinformation or even partial truths for either the media, police or DA? How many of these incidents that we see in the media where the information turns out to be straight up fabrication?

Do you find it odd that someone who lives an entire life with no criminal record suddenly snaps one night out of the blue at the presence of a car in the driveway? Does that seem logical or not?
Click to expand...
History is littered with no criminal record folks that up and go postal.
 
pupchow said:
I don't go to my door unless it's an invited guest that I'm expecting. Nope for all others.
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He had the right to step onto his porch armed with a 12 ga. He held the high hand and easily could have settled everything with a quick discussion. Firing indiscriminately into a vehicle EXITING your driveway will rightly earn this POS a lengthy prison sentence and god willing dies there.
 
Not enough facts here. People responding to what mainstream media tells you is top tier lemming behavior.

The same people telling you he shot them for no reason are the same people that told you the Hunter laptop was fake, vaccines were good and Biden got 81M votes and is more popular than Trump or Obama.
 
xtry51 said:
Not enough facts here. People responding to what mainstream media tells you is top tier lemming behavior.

The same people telling you he shot them for no reason are the same people that told you the Hunter laptop was fake, vaccines were good and Biden got 81M votes and is more popular than Trump or Obama.
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Upstate NY police ain't NYC Police, not even close.
 
The shooter went after a church after they put up lights on their basketball court claiming the lights were actually an attempt to light up his house an harass him.

I am indeed a quick to judge person. 68 years of hard knocks has honed my judgement to a fine point. I'll stand on my track record.
 
HARRYM said:
Some got all over me when out of the gate I said Arron Hernandez was guilty.
Click to expand...

I don't know anything about that story but I did say before that I raise my hand and assume 100% guilt for jumping into the pig pile in the past and judging people based on what the press and 'officials' decide to dole out as information. I've been proven wrong on the pig piles before. You might be 100% right and this guy earns a life sentence in prison. I'm just saying that it just doesn't seem to add up. Critical information is missing here.
 
VetteGirlMA said:
I don't know anything about that story but I did say before that I raise my hand and assume 100% guilt for jumping into the pig pile in the past and judging people based on what the press and 'officials' decide to dole out as information. I've been proven wrong on the pig piles before. You might be 100% right and this guy earns a life sentence in prison. I'm just saying that it just doesn't seem to add up. Critical information is missing here.
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I don't want anyone killing another human unless their own life is in real and immediate danger. The poor girl was only 20 yrs old and wasn't even the driver. I am street smart and have run into more head cases in my life that I can possibly remember. Yes, my life experiences has led me to become a quick judger but it has served me well in my soon to be 69 years. This guy is a just because I'm paranoid doesn't mean people aren't out to get me type and I have seen many of em. He fired into a car of people leaving his property as he was standing on his porch is the story today and it will be the story tomorrow, next week and beyond.
 
HARRYM said:
I don't want anyone killing another human unless their own life is in real and immediate danger. The poor girl was only 20 yrs old and wasn't even the driver. I am street smart and have run into more head cases in my life that I can possibly remember. Yes, my life experiences has led me to become a quick judger but it has served me well in my soon to be 69 years. This guy is a just because I'm paranoid doesn't mean people aren't out to get me type and I have seen many of em. He fired into a car of people leaving his property as he was standing on his porch is the story today and it will be the story tomorrow, next week and beyond.
Click to expand...
I can post plenty of stories of young groups of people that include young women roaming around and robbing/murdering people in rural areas. There is a famous case of exactly this happening in NH.
 
HARRYM said:
I don't want anyone killing another human unless their own life is in real and immediate danger. The poor girl was only 20 yrs old and wasn't even the driver. I am street smart and have run into more head cases in my life that I can possibly remember. Yes, my life experiences has led me to become a quick judger but it has served me well in my soon to be 69 years. This guy is a just because I'm paranoid doesn't mean people aren't out to get me type and I have seen many of em. He fired into a car of people leaving his property as he was standing on his porch is the story today and it will be the story tomorrow, next week and beyond.
Click to expand...


Yes only *you* have life experience. The rest of us? Well we're all idiots. How dare I question such absolutism that only one person wields the truth.
 
VetteGirlMA said:
Yes only *you* have life experience. The rest of us? Well we're all idiots. How dare I question such absolutism that only one person wields the truth.
Click to expand...

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=syV2LkGpQB0


The amount of times context and reading comprehension is lost here is the one thing I struggle with the most here. Some of it is the Internet and I get that but other times Jesus Mary and Joseph....

NOWHERE IN MY POST, AND I MEAN NOWHERE......did I question anyone's life experiences or call anyone an idiot. I simply gave my strong opion of the moron and how indeed all my life I am quick to judge but MY experiences have led me to do this and that my track record is pretty good at it.....most of the time.
 
xtry51 said:
I can post plenty of stories of young groups of people that include young women roaming around and robbing/murdering people in rural areas. There is a famous case of exactly this happening in NH.
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irrelevant.

I read a story about young people that include young women roaming around and robbing/murdering people in rural areas so the next time someone pulls into my driveway I'm going to kill them. ............

Situational awareness folks. Can we get a hold on that? Sure, be alert if someone pulls into your driveway if you want but if you are not in danger don't kill them as they are driving away.

I have a wide driveway and its newly paved. It's now become a magnet for every car, delivery truck looking to turn around on my street. Annoying for sure but I don't jack a 12 gauge round into my shotgun every time someone does it. I get the rural thing but Tewksbury does have a lot of B&E break ins from Lowell folks but we all have a responsibility not to over-react or shoot someone who is leaving the scene.

I hate it when police shoot people in the back and I don't make exceptions for rural morons who shoot people it the back.

If this is a difficult concept for some so be it.
 
AFAR/PFAR said:
Not condoning it at all, but I can see it happening.

Rural area, night time, no real police presence, no penalties if the cops do catch someone, no cell coverage, long driveway where you don't go up except on purpose, increasing crime everywhere.

Folks are on their own and on edge. Anything short of blue/red lights coming up the drive is a threat.

That doesn't mean you go out blasting Joe Biden style, but I'm not surprised it happened.
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based soley on the article that i read (and my assumption that the girl did not exit the vehicle, approach the home or even interact with the shooter) i'm on the other side and shocked that it happened.
 
xtry51 said:
I can post plenty of stories of young groups of people that include young women roaming around and robbing/murdering people in rural areas. There is a famous case of exactly this happening in NH.
Click to expand...

There are lot of posts in this thread where people are viewing this through the lens of a suburban utopia with officer friendly camped out at the corner Dunks whether they live there or not.

It doesn't make this particular shoot any better, but man some folks in here are just begging to be taken advantage of.

It's a dangerous world out there folks. Someone unexpectedly pulling down your middle of nowhere no cell service driveway at night doesn't get an open door, a smile and a can I help you. It shouldn't have you leaving the safety of the house and shooting up the car either, but you should damn well better be prepared to.
 
AFAR/PFAR said:
There are lot of posts in this thread where people are viewing this through the lens of a suburban utopia with officer friendly camped out at the corner Dunks whether they live there or not.

It doesn't make this particular shoot any better, but man some folks in here are just begging to be taken advantage of.

It's a dangerous world out there folks. Someone unexpectedly pulling down your middle of nowhere no cell service driveway at night doesn't get an open door, a smile and a can I help you. It shouldn't have you leaving the safety of the house and shooting up the car either, but you should damn well better be prepared to.
Click to expand...
Don't straddle the fence, take a position. A 20 yr old girl is dead, shot in the back of the neck while driving away.

Focus on this one shooting and this one shooting only.

And they never got out of their car either.
 

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