No Springfield armory firearms in ma?! now what...(first purchase)

[Roxor]

I am new to shooting and looking for a conceal carry option, I have really taken a liking to the 1911 platform but would prefer a 9mm and something compact for my first purchase, to both keep costs down and personal preference.

Others I am looking at are the SR9c (Buddy of mine said they are really stiff) and the M&P 9 mm shield. I know I will be bashed but for my own piece of mind my first carry MUST have a thumb safety.

 

[mac1911]

Why so dead set on Springfield Inc. Buy a carry gun for what it is a carry gun.
Don't discount DA/SA pistols.. as much as I love my 1911 and carried it for axlong time. I switched to a sw4013tsw it has a fat grip that I can grab with authority, it points well on a draw and can be carried hammer down in DA. It has a decoker which I like....it gets the job done. The trigger is a bit stiff on that DA pull but SA is nice... my secound favorite carry is sw 38spl hammerless revolver...

 

[retroLS1]

SR9c is a great gun with the exception of the cheesy loaded chamber indicator. Shield is a nice gun as well - slimmer, lighter, but holds less rounds. Shot a friends with an Apex trigger job (before and after) and it is a MUCH better gun with the new trigger. Factory one sucks. SR9c trigger is very nice from the factory.

 

[rocket500]

If you like 1911 style guns and want a carry 9mm the Sig p938 is now MA compliant. Essentially a tiny 9mm 1911.

The Shield is a fine gun, as is the SR9C. The SR9C is a good balance between concealability and shootability. Both are reliable and pretty low cost.

 

[Roxor]

mac I think the reason for the 1911 platform is the grip safety on top of thumb safety, Im one of those guys that If I have it Ill never need it, but if I Dont have it Ill constantly need it. I do love the look and sound (and price tag) of the SR9c, also dont mind the loaded chamber indicator. As far as the M&P's go, I love the compact but it has no thumb safety. I did shoot the M&P 9 full size and it was a great gun.

 

[drgrant]

I know I will be bashed but for my own piece of mind my first carry MUST have a thumb safety.

If this is non negotiable there is only one choice, really, and that's a 1911, run in condition 1. The rest of them are not nearly as intuitive to disable under stress. Using the shield or SR9 with a safety on is horrendous- that lever is small and hard to actuate. If someone told me I had to carry one of those guns with the safety on I'd leave it at home and put a rock in my pocket instead.

-Mike

 

[TonyDedo]

There are plenty of Springfield firearms in MA, you just have to purchase them via private sale (as opposed to an FFL).

 

[Coyote33]

I am new to shooting and looking for a conceal carry option, I have really taken a liking to the 1911 platform but would prefer a 9mm and something compact for my first purchase, to both keep costs down and personal preference.

Others I am looking at are the SR9c (Buddy of mine said they are really stiff) and the M&P 9 mm shield. I know I will be bashed but for my own piece of mind my first carry MUST have a thumb safety.

Get one of these:

http://www.thetruthaboutguns.com/2010/06/brett-solomon/gun-review-springfield-armory-emp/

http://www.shootingreviews.com/springfield-armory-emp-review/


... or Ruger, Glock, Timber Wolf, S&W 3913, etc.

 

[xcom]

If this is non negotiable there is only one choice, really, and that's a 1911, run in condition 1. The rest of them are not nearly as intuitive to disable under stress.

QFT

 

[M1911]

I know I will be bashed but for my own piece of mind my first carry MUST have a thumb safety.

If you look at my handle, you'll see that I have no problem with a thumb safety. That said, if you think you must have a thumb safety for your own piece of mind, I think what you need more than a thumb safety is more training.

As for Springfield, meh. There are plenty of other 1911 manufacturers that I would get before another Springfield (yes, I do have one).

 

[mursenary4]

i like my lc9. if you want to run with a manual safety i wouldnt go with the shield only because it is difficult to disengage the manual safety, unlike the lc9. the sr9c is not concealable for me. i can pocket carry the lc9 and i am a skinny dude who wears slim cut jeans. good luck

 

[Roxor]

I did see the XDs and the EMP, I like the EMP alot. I also saw the springfield ultra compact 1911 in 9mm and fell in love with it. Did NOT know I could private sale outside of "the list". SR9c I think I would be fine carrying as I have a bit of a bigger frame and wear looser jeans.

And yes I know I need more training. This is just for peace of mind while training. I grew up in a non gun friendly family, I am now out on my own with my fiance and always have that "what if" mind set. I know I am being picky about it, and I am sure I will eventually muster up the courage and acquire the training to carry without a thumb safty. I do have a facility in mind for training and will be going back to them as I took my LTC class through them and they were beyond excellent. THanks for the patience guys, Im just trying to get a feeler for what else is out there.

 

[retroLS1]

You can buy pretty much any handgun on or off "the list" in private sale in MA. Only thing is if it's an "off list" gun, you are going to be paying a high MA premium for it (read: $800 for a used newer Glock, etc.) If you are OK with that, go for it. I personally carry a 4.25" S&W E-series 1911 and love it. Not the easiest thing in the world to conceal but I don't really care. If someone sees it, they see it.

 

[M1911]

Why do you think a thumb safety makes a gun safer?

Do you realize that most 1911s are not drop safe? That is, most 1911s will discharge if dropped from a relatively modest height on to a hard surface. In contrast, all Glocks are drop safe.

I'm trying to understand just what scenarios you have in mind that you think a thumb safety will protect against.

Have you had any training working from a holster?

Rather rushing out to buy a gun which you think will be a panacea to an undescribed problem, let's first examine in detail exactly what you think that problem is.

I also grew up in an anti gun home. I bought my first gun after age 30. It was a Glock. The fact that I grew up in an anti gun household has absolutely nothing to do with my views on thumb safety or the price of tea in China.

I like 1911s. I have 7. Maybe after examining your concerns and shooting some guns you will still decide that you want a gun with a thumb safety. But it appears to me you are jumping into this without much reflection.

Frankly, if you are really afraid of having a negligent discharge during training, then get a revolver and only shoot it double action.

 

[Kisspik002]

As your first gun get a striker or DA/SA. I have talked with many shooters who see new shooters get fixated on thumb safety's. Unless you plan to practice everyday and keep your skills sharp...get a shield. Love mine, it's small, slim, with good defense ammo. Best of luck

 

[Cap]

Roxor - I would take the time to shoot some different guns to get comfortable with how they operate. Go green and a bunch of NESers will happily let you try theirs. Then you will have a better understanding of what you want/need in a carry gun.

The sr9c is a great gun, but it was a bit too small for me (grip length). I changed to a glock 19 which is perfect (for me). Modern firearms are perfectly safe if you understand their operation/limitations.

 

[ColdDayInHell]

Roxor - I would take the time to shoot some different guns to get comfortable with how they operate. Go green and a bunch of NESers will happily let you try theirs. Then you will have a better understanding of what you want/need in a carry gun.

The sr9c is a great gun, but it was a bit too small for me (grip length). I changed to a glock 19 which is perfect (for me). Modern firearms are perfectly safe if you understand their operation/limitations.

This. I understand hard ons for certain manufacturers but try a bunch. I recently fell in love with FN handguns, the FNS/FNX are awesome and I have the SR9c and Glock 17/19 along with the XDs 45 (CCW).

The only handguns I know I'll never buy are the M&Ps. Not worth it to spend extra cash just to un**** the horrible trigger and if I'm going through the hassle of getting an off list gun I am certainly not going to buy a damn M&P .

 

[joshh]

I am new to shooting and looking for a conceal carry option, I have really taken a liking to the 1911 platform but would prefer a 9mm and something compact for my first purchase, to both keep costs down and personal preference.

Others I am looking at are the SR9c (Buddy of mine said they are really stiff) and the M&P 9 mm shield. I know I will be bashed but for my own piece of mind my first carry MUST have a thumb safety.

look for a good deal on a used KAHR PM9. they arent cheap (get what you pay for) but its the smallest 9mm and they make a version with a safety that has a better factory trigger than any other compact 9mm.
Who cares if people talk shit about a safety, i pocket carry my pm9 and wouldnt NEVER pocket a gun that didnt have a safety. i do carry some bigger pistols IWB and they dont have a safety "switch" but i dont think thats an issue with a proper holster.
Never carry something YOU arent comfortable with as nerves can lead to clumsiness and thats not good.

 

[Roxor]

I understand the views on thumb safety and the fact it causes a heated debate. I have heard both sides of the argument and can understand both sides opinion. I have mine and at this time, I choose at this time that my first firearm have one, I will be practicing weekly as I have a range within 2 miles.

After I gain experience I will reconsider my options and the available firearms. I wish to be come more comfortable around firearms and different safeties. I also do have a budget, I must stay under $500-600 at this time. I am looking into getting into training soon.

I personally have shot a few revolvers and don't care for them as much, that is a second option right now.

I will actually be shooting an sr9c tonight as I am going to a shop/range.

 

[Mark from ?]

The sr9c is a good gun. I used to carry mine without the safety on. But its not that hard to thumb sweep it if you train to get used to it. That said, i feel it safer to carry a glock than any cocked and locked configuration


The other advantage is the sr will be under your price range and have a great trigger.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[ColdDayInHell]

The sr9c is a good gun. I used to carry mine without the safety on. But its not that hard to thumb sweep it if you train to get used to it. That said, i feel it safer to carry a glock than any cocked and locked configuration


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I hate safties and I find the SR series to have obnoxious size thumb safties, it ruins the profile. I mean trigger safety , LCI, manual saftey... JFC Ruger! I love the trigger but damn it's overkill.

 

[M1911]

I understand the views on thumb safety and the fact it causes a heated debate. I have heard both sides of the argument and can understand both sides opinion. I have mine and at this time, I choose at this time that my first firearm have one, I will be practicing weekly as I have a range within 2 miles.

1) Practicing isn't the same as formal training from a good instructor. Seriously. I know a fellow who has been practicing since he served in Vietnam and he scares the crap out of me.

2) Mechanical safeties can't substitute for safe gun handling. If you don't trust yourself to handle a gun without a manual safety, then why do you trust yourself to handle a gun with a manual safety?

3) I'm still trying to understand what problem it is that you think a manual safety solves. What is that you think a manual safety will protect you from?

4) Guns with manual safeties can be handled unsafely. Guns without manual safeties can be handled safely. And vice versa.

I'm not trying to convince you to buy gun X instead of gun Y. Instead, I'm trying to get you to explain your reasoning so perhaps we can provide better suggestions.

 

[joshh]

I understand the views on thumb safety and the fact it causes a heated debate. I have heard both sides of the argument and can understand both sides opinion. I have mine and at this time, I choose at this time that my first firearm have one, I will be practicing weekly as I have a range within 2 miles.

After I gain experience I will reconsider my options and the available firearms. I wish to be come more comfortable around firearms and different safeties. I also do have a budget, I must stay under $500-600 at this time. I am looking into getting into training soon.

I personally have shot a few revolvers and don't care for them as much, that is a second option right now.

I will actually be shooting an sr9c tonight as I am going to a shop/range.

im no fan of a small revolver either although i do like to shoot a full size one.
if the range has a pm9, give it a try too but it'd be tough to find one under $500. ive seen em go around $600 tho. the shield is a decent gun and is more comfortable to carry than the sr9c. both have garbage factory triggers but the shields can be made pretty nice.
sounds like you are doing the right thing and trying some out. comfort in shooting, handling & carrying are all equally important and you will eventually find what suits you the best. good luck

 

[Roxor]

With a manual safety I have a second step I have to perform before pulling the trigger. Being someone with both adhd and mild ocd, as well as high anxiety, the manual safety gives me a more methodical checklist of :unholster,acquire sites, place finger on side, remove safety, place finger in trigger frame, fire.

I also have a family friend who is missing a finger due to a firearms accident, 30 years using them (LEO and professionaly trained) and he was simply reholstering from one to another, while holstering the leather caught the trigger and activated it. he shot himself in the hand. Should his firearm have been equipped mith a manual safety, this MAY not have happened. I understand equipment maintenance and safe handling practices are key. I also understand that regardless of how much training, persistence and preventative maintenance happens, human error is still always there.

Also I will be receiving professional training and logging hours upon hours at a certain location with a highly trained instructor (Dont know how this forum is about dropping business names). It wont be just some joe schmoe

 

[exo]

Do you realize that most 1911s are not drop safe? That is, most 1911s will discharge if dropped from a relatively modest height on to a hard surface.

Is that true even in series 80 type models? Or is that what you mean by "most" (I'd have thought there'd be more series 80 types out there now)?

 

[hillman]

I always love hearing the "if you feel you need a manual safety, you're an idiot who shouldn't have a gun!" Especially when half the people saying it are 1911 zealots! The simple fact is, CRAP HAPPENS! You can not control everything, no matter how careful you are. One added extra safety feature can give you that extra sense of confidence so that you actually have the gun with you when you need it, rather than leaving it at home. Practice your ass off getting that safety off on the draw so it becomes natural (just like all you 1911 people do).

Here's a scenario. Man with an unknown heart condition and three kids, carrying a Glock because he loves his family enough to protect them, has a heart attack and falls to the floor, out of it. Oldest kid runs off to find help. Middle kid cries her eyes out. Little one...well little one sees daddy's toy hanging out of his Crossbreed and grabs it. BANG! Middle kid takes it right in her crying left eye!

Yes it's extreme but still possible. I'm not saying everyone should have the manual safety, not everyone needs one, not everyone has kids, pets, ignorant but helpful neighbors, etc... I'm just saying there is no reason to mock someone who feels more comfortable with that extra safety feature. I prefer it. I have a three year old that has already gone through Eddie Eagle and is pretty good about not touching my gun, he knows to not touch it, he knows to come get me. He has passed every test I've given him with training guns. But still... you never know. You just can't control every aspect of life all the time. It's not hard to flip that safety off when you draw. It doesn't add ANY time to the draw.

Also, I have both the SR9c and the Shield, the SR9c is hands down easier to shoot, has a higher capacity, has a hella-better trigger, but OH NO you have to ignore the LCI! AAAH! The trigger on the Shield sucks dino-dink, but yeah it's slim.

 

[Roxor]

I actually found a Preowned shield for 320 with 2 mags. Going to look at it today to check it out. Hoping the guy will hold it until I get the card in.

 

[drgrant]

Here's a scenario. Man with an unknown heart condition and three kids, carrying a Glock because he loves his family enough to protect them, has a heart attack and falls to the floor, out of it. Oldest kid runs off to find help. Middle kid cries her eyes out. Little one...well little one sees daddy's toy hanging out of his Crossbreed and grabs it. BANG! Middle kid takes it right in her crying left eye!

Seriously? Yeah and right after that a meteor will come down from the sky and kill them all, making the whole issue moot. The odds are about the same.

If it makes you "feel good" (which is all this crap is about, nothing more) by all means carry a gun with a safety.

I'm just saying there is no reason to mock someone who feels more comfortable with that extra safety feature.

I'm not mocking the OP, by any stretch. I will however mock anyone that tries to tell me that in general terms, it's "necessary" or a good idea.... it usually isn't. In most cases on many guns, it's a feel good crutch, that on a good day doesn't hurt anything and on a bad day, slows you down.

It's not hard to flip that safety off when you draw. It doesn't add ANY time to the draw.

May or may not be true, depending on ergonomics of the firearm and a given person's dexterity (or lack thereof) and hand size. Some of the safety levers in use are small and difficult to deactivate. That's why I suggested a 1911. Even though the platform is flawed in a lot of other ways, if someone's gotta have a manual safety, it is by far one of the best implemented designs out there.

-Mike

 

[warwickben]

What about no springfields in mass lol .
I carry this or my 1911 .
If you keep your trigger finger off the trigger you don't need a safety .
The 1911 I take the safety off with out thinking now.

 

[warpig]

I carry my SR9C all the time. No complaints here.