No Springfield armory firearms in ma?! now what...(first purchase)

You can name him if you want.[/QUOTE]

OK, Didnt know, some forums are not cool with dropping names, But I plan on going to Mass Firearms School as much as possible and taking more and more of their courses. I plan on sitting with them and testing and running through everything for at least a few hours when I do make a final purchase.


Also Stumpthumper, I do love the looks and sound of that firearm on paper. Everyone says it feels like a full size. I have had my hands on the fullsize and it felt nice, have yet to see a compact in the wild though. So who knows, Like they are saying I could pick it up and HATE it.

Messed around recently with a P22 and it was fun and size of frame was not an issue for me, seemed to do what I wanted, but I do want to steer clear from 22 for now until it becomes a bit easier to find.
 
Roxor said:
The MP is a MA model. I loved the palm swells and how easy it was to take down. Would a MP 9 C be a decent compromise between the shield and the mp full size? that one day I will be able to carry easier?
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The gun is not going to lose any meaningful performance going from the full size M&P to the compact, and you can use full size magazines with an X-Grip Magazine Adapter (a sleeve for the part of the mag that sticks out the bottom of the grip) in the compact, so you'll get the benefit of a full size grip.

However, the shorter, lighter barrel may allow for more felt recoil, and the shorter sight radius may make you marginally less accurate.

So it really depends on the operator. Some people notice no difference going from a full size to a compact model. However, others see their groups go to hell with a smaller gun. It really depends on the size of your hands, how the gun fits, and how sensitive you are to recoil. Only way to find out for sure is to shoot the two side by side.
 
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The MP9c is a reasonable compromise. You really do need to fix the trigger on a MA M&P. It makes a huge difference.

OK, now I understand more about your desire for a thumb safety. The first issue is don't use a holster with a thumb strap. You don't need a thumb strap to keep it in the holster, as a good leather or kydex holster will keep the gun in the holster. If you think you need a retention holster (you don't, but if you insist), get a Safariland - their ALS retention system does not use a strap. Please don't get a Serpa holster.

As for your friend shooting himself in the hand while holstering, I've got a few things to say about that. First, working with a holster is something for which you need specific training. A typical handgun safety class does not cover drawing and holstering.

Second, when you holster you do it with one hand. Your support hand should be on your belly, not anywhere near your holster. Remember the safety rule about keeping your gun pointed in a safe direction? If he shot his support hand while holstering, then he was pointing the gun at his support hand, violating the first rule of firearms safety - your support hand is not a safe direction.

Third, there is no prize for fastest holstering. Take your time holstering. Pay attention to what you are doing. Be in the present, not thinking about something else. Double check the position of your trigger finger before holstering.

Fourth, I don't know your friend. But the fact that he has law enforcement training and experience doesn't mean he was well trained or that he followed that training. Many police officers are poorly trained and many are just unsafe. Some have been handling their duty gun for a long time and become complacent. Don't get me wrong - I compete with some cops and they are very safe and excellent marksman, but they are not typical of police officers. I know the firearms instructor for a small suburban police department - about 20 officers. When they get a new officer, he takes them on a tour of the station, showing them the three places where officers have had negligent discharges. The cops that I know typically say that about 10% of their colleagues are gun guys who know what they are doing with their gun. The other 90% range from indifferent to downright unsafe.

Can a manual safety reduce the chances of a negligent discharge while holstering? Yup, it sure can and that is a logical reason for desiring a manual safety.

But you can still shoot yourself while drawing or holstering using a gun with manual safety. Search YouTube for Tex Grebner.
 
M1911 said:
Really?

I'm an IDPA SO. I have competed regularly in IDPA for the past three+ years and occasionally in USPSA. I've never seen someone fumble their safety.
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This, I see lots of other fumbling (usually during reloads) but never with safeties, and in USPSA there are a shitload of 1911 variants around. The only time someone is "fumbling with their safety" is if the gun is broken (like a plunger tube with one of the stakes sheared off) or the safety wasn't fitted right. Even the old school non-extended colt safeties are pretty easy to disable. I used to carry Colt officer's mods, and neither one of them had an
extended safety- and both were easy to disengage on the fly.

-Mike
 
M1911 said:
For a while, Kimber and S&W made 1911s with Swartz-style firing pin blocks which are activated by depressing the grip safety, but as far as I know, both have returned to a Series 70 style action.
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Well, Smith has really only done this for the E-series. The rest of their 1911s still have that Swartz crap in them. Even the PC1911s have that system in
them.

Krapber I think has both- it depends on the model you buy, but I could be wrong and they could all be S70 at this point.

-Mike
 
M1911 said:
But you can still shoot yourself while drawing or holstering using a gun with manual safety. Search YouTube for Tex Grebner.
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I ****ing love that video, where he talks through the incident. "And then my training kicked in - I called my parents." Hysterical.

As for Roxor's LEO friend, regardless of the safety mechanism of his firearm, he violated Rule #2 (or Rule #1, depending on how your count them) in a major way - he had the gun pointed in an unsafe direction, specifically at himself. I have no idea how someone holsters a gun AND has the barrel pointed at their hand, but somehow he f*cked up big time. Let this be a lesson that no matter how "professional" you are, nor home much training you've had, the safety rules ALWAYS apply.
 
That makes sense. The serpa has horrible reviews from what Ive seen and read due to that release being right over the trigger guard, you almost want to PUSH the button in and that causes a curl in the finger. I am looking right now into crosbreed for an IWB due to rave reviews and having that bit of leather cushioning me.

THe trigger on the 9c would happen, it would be something that would happen definitely, and I do have MFS that say they will install and a few others around the area.

And I agree 100% that a rule of safety was broken during the incident. There is no doubt about that because it would not be possible to hit yourself or anyone else if the firearm is pointed in a safe direction.

And yes MFS was great and they just were generally awesome guys. My fiance came with me as well. I asked her to at least take the course to become more familliar, if I am going to have a LTC and she lives with me, I would prefer she be familiar around firearms as well. If something should happen to me and I should need to be rushed to the ER or anything, I would want her to be able to safely remove and store a firearm, or if somethign would happen while I am at work, be familiar with them to protect herself.

I will say that she was NOT comfortable racking the slide on the glock 17 training guns, They were from the factory and still pretty stiff. She also was very upset with revolvers as she had a hard time with the trigger pull. The instructor took almost 45 minutes after the class to take her into the shop to make sure that she saw there were other options and find firearms that she was able to rack and fire with ease. He didnt want her to be discouraged and said he would NEVER let a student walk out the door if they were still uncomfortable with what they learned.

They offer many concealed carry classes including specialized self defense and instructor rentals, and their prices are fair. So I will be making as much use of that as I can.
 
Roxor said:
That makes sense. The serpa has horrible reviews from what Ive seen and read due to that release being right over the trigger guard, you almost want to PUSH the button in and that causes a curl in the finger. I am looking right now into crosbreed for an IWB due to rave reviews and having that bit of leather cushioning me.
Click to expand...

I have a crossbreed and it is a great IWB holster. But I suggest that you also get an OWB holster -- they are much more convenient for practice than an IWB holster. With an IWB holster you will spend all your time tucking your shirt back in.

I will say that she was NOT comfortable racking the slide on the glock 17 training guns, They were from the factory and still pretty stiff. She also was very upset with revolvers as she had a hard time with the trigger pull.
Click to expand...

Yeah, that can be an issue for some women. Technique can help, but some of it is simply down to strength. Revolvers can be improved greatly with trigger jobs. She might like my K-frames.
 
Also found aliengear last night looks just like the crosbreed but has adjustable clips for cant and ride height... half the price. I will be getting an out waist too, Iwear peacoats in the winter (business casual work attire most days) and that would fit me well.

So I shot both the SR9c and the M&p 9c and picked up and handled a shield last night. I really wanted to love the SR9c but the fact was I didnt have enough grip in the back towards the bottom of my palm, it was amazing to shoot, BUT the slide lock was TERRIBLE to engage. what a trigger break though, great shot groupings!

The M&p 9C was great as well, like you said heavier trigger, but just fit my hand well and was getting amazing shot groupings even with the heavier trigger. again both the instructor and one of my buddies that shoots said that it was that I anticipate too much but with the heavier trigger he said I was even more accurate. Loved the placement of the slide lock and takedown is great. grip was amazing.

So I think the mp 9c is the one for me, I really really enjoyed that gun. and it really fit my hands well.

On a side not, I shot my first 45 last night, buddies remington 1911 r1. Keyholed my first 3 shots from about 15 - 20 yards. What a gun! That will be my present to myself after I feel I get more time under my belt.
 
Funny, but I saw literally THOUSANDS of "real" Springfield Armory guns yesterday.

Springfield Armory Museum Megathread

The guide/ranger guy made a point to say there is a company calling itself "Springfield Armory", which makes guns, but is not the real Springfield Armory.

Anyhow, thought I'd throw that in, because I just went yesterday, and it just sounds so funny to hear the words from the title of this thread.
 
I guess that thumb safeties just come down to personal preference.
Personally I don't see the need, but it MHO.

Well on a brighter note, I hope everyone has a great Easter, God Bless.
 
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drgrant said:
If this is non negotiable there is only one choice, really, and that's a 1911, run in condition 1. The rest of them are not nearly as intuitive to disable under stress. Using the shield or SR9 with a safety on is horrendous- that lever is small and hard to actuate. If someone told me I had to carry one of those guns with the safety on I'd leave it at home and put a rock in my pocket instead.

-Mike
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Those of us that don't have baseball mitts for hands have no problem with the thumb safety on the shield. [smile]I practice drawing with the safety on and I can undo it the second it leaves the holster.
 
falcon123 said:
Those of us that don't have baseball mitts for hands have no problem with the thumb safety on the shield. [smile]I practice drawing with the safety on and I can undo it the second it leaves the holster.
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True this. Although I leave the manual safety off.

Sent from my XT897 using Tapatalk
 
See I didnt mind the shields safety, it lined right up with my right hand (im righthanded) thumb right at the knuckle so activating and deactivating the safety went really smooth for me, I mean it was really a perfect fit. BUT after a few words of advice from a few experienced shooters, the mp 9c will be a much comfier fit for a new shooter
 
M&P 9c brand new is $400 on clearance at four seasons right now. I put the money down Wednesday for my 40c, waiting for my ltc too.

Sent from my SPH-D710 using Tapatalk
 
joshk1025 said:
Coyote33: I think he actually meant this, we are just cruising: View attachment 101782


jk
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Careful.

Fredo.jpg
 
No, I got that dumb joke, but was wondering if there was some other, inside joke.

I was really wondering if you guys were both getting the PPQ or the M&P 40c.
 

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