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Pistol for wife
- Thread starter GaryO
- Start date
dwarven1
Lonely Mountain Arms
My niece, who is about 5'2" or so and very slim, liked Nickle's 1911 and shot it very well when she tried it out... when she was 15!
Check out the M&P 9mm compact.
Maybe I was thinking of Walther.
A small 1911 is still pretty big for a compact gun, isn't it? I'd imagine a 1911 9mm shouldn't be all that bad, even if more compact than a standard 1911. Of course, I forgot that these might not be available in MA.
- Joined
- Feb 26, 2005
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I have a German PPK/s. Nice gun, but recoil spring was much too much for my Wife. I think the recoil would be too sharp also.
Got a bunch of 9mm guns. Would only get another if my Wife really liked one for herself. Waiting <impatiently> on the M&P .45 to make the EOPS List.
Got a bunch of 9mm guns. Would only get another if my Wife really liked one for herself. Waiting <impatiently> on the M&P .45 to make the EOPS List.
My 120 pound daughter likes to shoot my .45 Para-carry, and does so with no trouble. On the other hand, she grew up handling guns and knows how to be safe with a semi-auto. With new shooters (male or female) the vast majority prefered the simplicity of a revolver while starting in shooting.
A woman shooting a 1911 is one thing, carrying it is another.
My wife can shoot the bejeebles out of a 1911 or even my 44mag but she'd never carry one.
I tried to get her to carry a hammerless jframe but she can't manage the heavy pull and keep it on target. She just plain doesn't like the DA jframe S&W.
I got the Charter Arms .32 Undercoverette (in the July acquisitions thread) and she loves it, nice smooth light trigger. Sure, a .32 is a little on the puny side, but at least she's apt to carry it.
That said, the .32mag is a powerhouse, (ballistics show it near a .38+p). I have one, but it's a SW hammerless that she doesn't like. I'd rather she carry that but it's whatever floats HER boat that counts.
What counts is what SHE likes and is likely to shoot well and carry often.
Let her decide, even if it's a .32.
My wife can shoot the bejeebles out of a 1911 or even my 44mag but she'd never carry one.
I tried to get her to carry a hammerless jframe but she can't manage the heavy pull and keep it on target. She just plain doesn't like the DA jframe S&W.
I got the Charter Arms .32 Undercoverette (in the July acquisitions thread) and she loves it, nice smooth light trigger. Sure, a .32 is a little on the puny side, but at least she's apt to carry it.
That said, the .32mag is a powerhouse, (ballistics show it near a .38+p). I have one, but it's a SW hammerless that she doesn't like. I'd rather she carry that but it's whatever floats HER boat that counts.
What counts is what SHE likes and is likely to shoot well and carry often.
Let her decide, even if it's a .32.
JimConway
Instructor
Why not a revolver?
This year alone we have trained quite a number of women. Given a choice, I would prefer to train a woman over a man any day. They normally do not have the bad habits and sometimes mind set issues that plague most male shooters. With that said, you can not train a woman the same way that you would train a man. The biggest issue with training women is that they do not process information the same way that a man does. Neither is better, just different. If any of you want more info on this point, check out either of Vicki Farnam's books on training women. Yes, she is John Farnam's wife and is a quality trainer in her own right.
To quote Rob Pincus of Valhalla, there are 3 phases of learning to shoot well: Safety, Comfort and Competence.
From a comfort perspective, I try to start a woman with a small caliber gun with little on no recoil. Obviously the gun must fit her hand. When recoil and flinching is not an issue, It is time to focus on the basics and is fairly easy to have most women shooting reasonably well in a short time. I suggest that the time for her to try larger calibers is only after she has a good grasp of the basics.
One other point is worth mentioning. Most women have less upper body strenght than a man. I have found the most women can learn and use the Weaver position easier than any of the other positions. The reason is that the Weaver position, brings the firearm closer to the body and is thus easier and less tiring to shoot.
I started this response to address a question of "why not a revolver". I believe that it is not a good thing to teach anything, that could be detremental to good defensive shooting techniques. For most beginners, the way to shoot a revolver is to cock it before every shot and many never learn to shoot it double action, claiming the trigger pull is too heavy to shoot accurately. We all know that this is not true, BUT...
This year alone we have trained quite a number of women. Given a choice, I would prefer to train a woman over a man any day. They normally do not have the bad habits and sometimes mind set issues that plague most male shooters. With that said, you can not train a woman the same way that you would train a man. The biggest issue with training women is that they do not process information the same way that a man does. Neither is better, just different. If any of you want more info on this point, check out either of Vicki Farnam's books on training women. Yes, she is John Farnam's wife and is a quality trainer in her own right.
To quote Rob Pincus of Valhalla, there are 3 phases of learning to shoot well: Safety, Comfort and Competence.
From a comfort perspective, I try to start a woman with a small caliber gun with little on no recoil. Obviously the gun must fit her hand. When recoil and flinching is not an issue, It is time to focus on the basics and is fairly easy to have most women shooting reasonably well in a short time. I suggest that the time for her to try larger calibers is only after she has a good grasp of the basics.
One other point is worth mentioning. Most women have less upper body strenght than a man. I have found the most women can learn and use the Weaver position easier than any of the other positions. The reason is that the Weaver position, brings the firearm closer to the body and is thus easier and less tiring to shoot.
I started this response to address a question of "why not a revolver". I believe that it is not a good thing to teach anything, that could be detremental to good defensive shooting techniques. For most beginners, the way to shoot a revolver is to cock it before every shot and many never learn to shoot it double action, claiming the trigger pull is too heavy to shoot accurately. We all know that this is not true, BUT...
Jim, I respect what you are saying, but... to say you can not train a woman the same as a man is not true. Uncle Sam didn't train me any differently than they did my male counterparts. We may process things differently,but you can still train us the same. Uncle isn't going to do things any differently for a male or female when it comes to weapons training. Out of the whole company of females I think only 2 didn't qualify and were recycled.
JimConway
Instructor
MrsWildweasel
I can not comment on your training. I have no doubt that a course could be eveloped and taught that would work for both sexes but the men would get more detail than they needed. I recently trained a female cowboy action shooter. Her husband told me that she had trouble understanding a sight picture even though a number of other shooters had explained it. I gave her a detailed explanation and her shooting improved with 30 minutes. BTW, the sight picture is an item mentioned numerous times in Vikki Farman's books
I can not comment on your training. I have no doubt that a course could be eveloped and taught that would work for both sexes but the men would get more detail than they needed. I recently trained a female cowboy action shooter. Her husband told me that she had trouble understanding a sight picture even though a number of other shooters had explained it. I gave her a detailed explanation and her shooting improved with 30 minutes. BTW, the sight picture is an item mentioned numerous times in Vikki Farman's books
In Ma. It's used. Don't know when it was made.
Patriot
NES Member
Dennis,
You have the 432PD don't you? The trigger pull on this is pretty awful. Is this
the MA mandated trigger pull? I haven't measured it yet, but I think it is going
to peg my 10 Lb scale. (Thanks Len!)
TBP
You have the 432PD don't you? The trigger pull on this is pretty awful. Is this
the MA mandated trigger pull? I haven't measured it yet, but I think it is going
to peg my 10 Lb scale. (Thanks Len!)
TBP
I have the 332 (TiSc) version. It's a bit lighter than the 432.
Yup, the trigger is tough. Whether it's the Ma problem or not, I don't know. I've shot other recent jframes like the 642 (5 yr old or less) and they're all harder than I'd like.
The Charter (1980's I think) is pretty smooth and light enough so it's about what you'd expect to feel when you use a DA gun.
Yup, the trigger is tough. Whether it's the Ma problem or not, I don't know. I've shot other recent jframes like the 642 (5 yr old or less) and they're all harder than I'd like.
The Charter (1980's I think) is pretty smooth and light enough so it's about what you'd expect to feel when you use a DA gun.
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FWIW, I teach PEOPLE... this morning, I had kids, and adult males & females go through a Valhalla "Intro to Dynamic Shooting" the group had little to no experience and they were all knocking down reactive targets in a dark scary maze with distractions. It was fun.
My staff and I had to coorect on a specific level for individuals, but we never change our approach, terminology or anything else from men to women... we do use smaller words for those who may not have the vocabularly for the normal presentation (including, but not limited to, young children).
-RJP
My staff and I had to coorect on a specific level for individuals, but we never change our approach, terminology or anything else from men to women... we do use smaller words for those who may not have the vocabularly for the normal presentation (including, but not limited to, young children).
-RJP
The problem with military firearms training, as with almost everything else there, is the one size fits all paradigm. Good training recognizes each student as an individual with a unique collection of experiences, preferences, capabilities and problems. After a while you'll notice that that some of these are more likely to appear in some groups than others. You don't blindly assume, but it seems to turn out that way.
Ken
Ken
I started with a revolver because that was the gun used in the basic training class and I had to use one to qualify at Moon Island. The idea of a pistol made me nervous until I handled one and learned how to make sure it wasn't loaded. I bought a Walther P22 to continue my training. I love it. I own a S & W 642 that must have had a 13 pound trigger. After firing ten rounds, my hand would shake from the stress of trying to "squeeze" the trigger. I had a trigger job done and what a difference it has made. I can fire dozens of rounds, accurately and without fatigue.
The S & W MP 9mm is a sweet shoot. I had a problem with the location of the mag release. My thumb kept hitting it causing a jam. This is my issue and not a fault of the gun. I was fine during regular target shooting but drawing from a holster under stress, my grip would position that thumb where I didn't need it to be. If I didn't have this issue, I'd buy the MP.
Perhaps the Walther P 99 would be a good choice for me.
The point I'm trying to make is despite your best intentions, do not buy a gun for your wife unless she has tried it on to make sure it fits her grip comfortably and safely. You would be wise to take advantage of the generous offers made in this thread to sample several guns or go to a shop that lets you try before you buy. You would not want your loved one to be in a life or death situation when she finds out that her thumb hits a mag release when she fast draws her pistol.
Best Regards.
The S & W MP 9mm is a sweet shoot. I had a problem with the location of the mag release. My thumb kept hitting it causing a jam. This is my issue and not a fault of the gun. I was fine during regular target shooting but drawing from a holster under stress, my grip would position that thumb where I didn't need it to be. If I didn't have this issue, I'd buy the MP.
Perhaps the Walther P 99 would be a good choice for me.
The point I'm trying to make is despite your best intentions, do not buy a gun for your wife unless she has tried it on to make sure it fits her grip comfortably and safely. You would be wise to take advantage of the generous offers made in this thread to sample several guns or go to a shop that lets you try before you buy. You would not want your loved one to be in a life or death situation when she finds out that her thumb hits a mag release when she fast draws her pistol.
Best Regards.
