please teach me how to suck less with the AR15

Toss a red dot on it and take up action shooting. Two inches at 25 yards is great if you can do it fast.

All joking aside, I know it's heresy, but an optic will show you exactly what you're doing wrong. I could never catch a flinch or a trigger slap with irons, but with an optic, the dot moves, and it's obvious what you did.

Put another way, with irons, you eventually get good enough to call your shots. With an optic, you have to work pretty hard to avoid calling them.
 
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TheRoland said:
Put another way, with irons, you eventually get good enough to call your shots. With an optic, you have to work pretty hard to avoid calling them.
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Or you could always look at your target. Your target is your best friend; it'll never lie to you, and it'll show you what you're doing wrong, too.
 
Not for nothing but my friend was looking thru the apeture and lined up on the left side ring not the post once and s while. He wasn't use to the small aperture . Not saying that what your doing just throwing it out there
 
dwarven1 said:
Or you could always look at your target. Your target is your best friend; it'll never lie to you, and it'll show you what you're doing wrong, too.
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what good is stopping to look at your target, you need to know where the bullet went before it even gets there. The target only shows the end result, the sights will tell everything
 
dwarven1 said:
Or you could always look at your target. Your target is your best friend; it'll never lie to you, and it'll show you what you're doing wrong, too.
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I had a target lie to me once. It was deeply disturbing and I've never quite recovered.

Don't trust them, Dwarven, once they get inside your head they'll crush you like a bug.

It has taken years of therapy to recover.

:-)
 
richc said:
I had a target lie to me once. It was deeply disturbing and I've never quite recovered.

Don't trust them, Dwarven, once they get inside your head they'll crush you like a bug.

It has taken years of therapy to recover.


:-)
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B@$tards. It's why I shoot them when I see them.
 
I shot again today, same ammo and position. This time, I got those red sticky dot type targets and shot against that. My best group was 1", so aiming at a smaller target definitely helped.

Still trying to adjust to the aperture sight. As I said before, this is my first and only gun I've ever owned or shot that had aperture sights, so it is taking some getting used to.
 
sevenMMmag said:
considering going.

So I can bring my own AR and ammo? What else do I need?
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http://appleseedinfo.org/as_prepare.html

Note that the list below doesn't cover the "Winterseed" event... like today at Harvard Sportsman's, for example. I stopped by and saw at least 5 dedicated shooters on the line in the freezing rain.

What to bring to an Appleseed Event


Not everything listed here is necessary. This list was compiled from the experience of those who have attended an Appleseed. It includes those things that did or would have made their experience more enjoyable. Remember that you need to bring whatever it takes to learn to shoot better.
Personal items

* A teachable attitude (most important thing) **
* Ear protection Muffs and plugs **
* Eye protection **
* Elbow pads or shooting Jacket
* Ground cover (Rug remnant will work)
* A hat
* Little notebook (those little 2.5 X 3.5 work well)
* Pen
* Sun Screen
* Lots of water (Must stay hydrated)
* Light Lunch
* Snacks
* Folding Chair (not necessary but nice)
* Wet wipes
* Bug spray
* Aspirin or Ibuprofen
* Necessary clothing for any kind of weather

** Very important things
Rifle specific preparations

* Rifle preferably zeroed for 25 meters
* 400+ rounds of the same type and brand of ammo (if you're in New England, plan on 1000+ rounds)
* Sight adjustment tools
* GI style web Sling (as seen here at the The Appleseed Store)
* Four mags. 10 rds. each. Bring extra mags if you have them.
* Gun cleaning supplies and lube
* Instructions for your rifle (if you have them)
* Know your rifle
* Something to cover your rifle to keep blowing sand or rain off it.
* Staple gun
* Staples
* Know the laws of the State you are going to and only bring that which is within the law
* Back-up rifle (if you have one)

Ready your equipment
1. Be prepared for blowing sand and dust, rain, mud — all those weather conditions a rifleman would have to generally put up with.
2. In event of blowing sand and dust, you'll need to totally degrease your rifle. Any lube should be a dry lube, like graphite. Be ready to protect your rifle with a plastic rifle bag or a simple waterproof wrap for the action.
3. Be ready to protect ammo and mags from the same weather. Ziplock bags are great for this.
4. Again, be prepared. You should function-test your rifle and, if possible, have it zeroed for 200 yards; but if you don't or can't, adjust your sights so your group prints 3" above point of aim at 100 yds, and mark your sights with paint, magic marker, or fingernail polish. Doing so will leave you properly sighted for the 25m AQT.
5. It's a good idea to get down into the prone position and dry-fire ten shots "by the numbers" (click here to print out the steps from Fred's Web site). If you will do this three times a week, you'll be way ahead of everyone else. Hey, while you're at it, put a GI web sling on your rifle, and get it adjusted so it supports the rifle in prone, too.
6. Practice at home is a GREAT way to prep for arriving at the range. By doing so your range time will be FAR more productive.
7. If, after thinking you couldn't come, you find at the last minute that you can, call (336) 879-2144 during the evening and we'll get you a spot on the line.
Click to expand...
 
SevenMM
Please check out the Appleseed forum in the training section - your Q's can be best answered there - once you read the standard questions feel free to ask away on specifics.

also - I consider you local to me and I'm willing to take you to the range as my guest - we can work on rifle skills together - call it a primer to Appleseed stuff - you bring your rifle and ammo. PM me for more info

Best regards
 
MrTwigg said:
A 'scope will help one see better, it will not necessarily help you shoot better.



[wave]What he said. The Appleseed program has its' haters here because the course is taught mostly using .22lr at 25 meters. There are full distance centerfire events at full distance out to 400 yards and they sell out fast.

Click on the link in my sig line for more info. I need to return to instructing again.



Ever hear the old joke about "How do I get to Carnegie Hall ? Pratice man, pratice."

If someone were to ask me what the most important aspects of shooting accuratly were I'd say learn what a natural point of aim (too much info for part of one post, click link in sig line) is and how to use it,

and the six steps of firing a shot.


Lastly, I'd suggest snapping into various positions and dry firing. Lots of dry firing.
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+1 (lots of practice and the shot should be a surprise)
 
Is your front sight nice and black, or is it more grey-ish? That always made a huge difference for me when it came to keeping the front sight clear and in focus.
 
If there is one thing the Appleseed curriculum teaches well is how to use the sights that have been standard issue on US military rifles since 1936.

Go to one.
 
Jose said:
If there is one thing the Appleseed curriculum teaches well is how to use the sights that have been standard issue on US military rifles since 1936.

Go to one.
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Hell has officially froze over! I have a new sig line! (If Timber agrees it could be TEOTWAWKI!)[wink]
+ Another for Appleseed. Hopefully I will be able to make the next one and I will personally help you if you like. It will give you the best bang for you buck, and you will learn some cool history too. Where you take it from there is up to you.. but it will give you the fundamentals.

Mr. Twigg's advice is right out of the AS program, practicing them is a good thing. Just make sure you are teaching yourself good habits, that is much easier than unlearning a bad one and re-learning a good one.

Another thing to consider is getting a .22 conversion for it. This will let you shoot A LOT more while saving some serious cash. NOT the same as 100+yds shooting, but the basics are the same and you can practice a lot more and save money in the process.

Another option is invite an experienced NESer to shoot and offer beer for after the shoot in exchange for advice. [wink]
 
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I have no problems recommending an Appleseed to a n00b so long as that person understands that even coming out of there with a "Rifleman" patch is NOT going to let you own that 500 yard "rifleman's quarter mile".

It takes a hell of a lot more than even a red hat to own 500 yards. Trust me.
 
I'm definitely not a pro, so take what I say with a grain of salt. When I first started shooting mine, after I zeroed it, it started to become second nature and habit as to where this sight picture ought to be. After a while, my brain stopped trying to figure out where to line it up and it just clicked. So I guess: practice helps.
 
A .22lr conversion will help you get more practice, $150 from Ciener Firearms. A $100 drop in trigger job, from RRA (Rock River) 2 stage, will help, too. Are you wearing good eye and ear protection? Have someone load (or not load) the gun, dropping the bolt, with the mag catch held over, so you won't hear it click, with their back to you, and then hand the AR to you, for you to attempt to fire. If you KNOW it's not loaded, you won't flinch, understand? Watch the sights carefully, and have him watch YOU (and maybe even video you with a cell phon). If the sights move, or if your eyes blink, you are flinching a bit. Not badly, or you couldn't get the groups you say you get, but some. Dummy rds can be mixed with live ammo and loaded into the mag, with your eyes shut, so you don't need a helper to detect flinching, and fix it, too. :-) Orange "targ dots" help you aim more carefully. Self adhesive. Also, The 2 wings of the peep sight are for shooting at different ranges. The small hole one is set higher above the line of bore, to allow for more bullet drop at long range.
 
To all those who have advised the OP to "practice", I have one question for you?

PRACTICE WHAT?

Have you all not been paying attention? The guy has absolutely zero idea about how to shoot a rifle properly. He does not understand sight alignment, sight picture, and a consistent head position on the rifle.

If you do not know what you are doing, practicing is a complete waste of time that only serves to firm up bad habits and incorrect procedures.

He needs training. Period.
 
Harvard, MA One day Appleseed - Jan 16, 2011

Date:
Sunday, January 16, 2011 at 8:30 AM (ET)

Location:
Harvard Sportsmen's Club
Littleton County Rd
Harvard MA

There are some coming up in Pelham, NH also
 
Gee, wonder how I ever shot my way into AA class at IPSC without all these vids, and classes? Wonder who trained the trainers? :-) He can get the books for free, thru his local library's Interlibrary Book Loan system. He can take notes, zerox the most important pages, and then return the book in 2 weeks. I think that a 1 week "extension" can still be had, too. Use the Library's "books in print" reference work to get the ISBN #'s, authors, etc needed to order said books. Look in "Subjects" for: " survival, shooting, defense, hand to hand combat, martial arts, survivalism, military-science, camping, hunting, fishing, backpacking, hiking, walking,gardening, food preservation, emergencies, disasters, shelter-making', EMT, Paramedic", etc.
 
walkit said:
Gee, wonder how I ever shot my way into AA class at IPSC without all these vids, and classes? Wonder who trained the trainers? :-) He can get the books for free, thru his local library's Interlibrary Book Loan system. He can take notes, zerox the most important pages, and then return the book in 2 weeks. I think that a 1 week "extension" can still be had, too. Use the Library's "books in print" reference work to get the ISBN #'s, authors, etc needed to order said books. Look in "Subjects" for: " survival, shooting, defense, hand to hand combat, martial arts, survivalism, military-science, camping, hunting, fishing, backpacking, hiking, walking,gardening, food preservation, emergencies, disasters, shelter-making', EMT, Paramedic", etc.
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How will reading about gardening help someone improve their marksmanship with an AR? Is that some sort of Zen technique?
 
Notice that I included "shooting" in the topics to search? I put the other topics there for people, like you, who can't conceptualize/orgnanize their thinking. No, AA is the top 10% ranking at the World Shoots, and the US Nat'l shoots. Since there are almost no serious combat pistol competitors from overseas. AA is not officially recognized, but Kenny Hackathorn and many other instructors recognize it for what it is.
 
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beaker said:
If you can't see your front sight post (it is blurry) you may need glasses. I have a similar problem. I have great distance vision (20/12 and 20/15), but because of that, as I get older my near vision is getting worse. I have a hard time focusing on the front sight post, and it gets worse during a shooting session. I don't need glasses, but my eye Doc told me to get a pair of cheater glasses (a 1.5 or 1.7) for reading, and they make a huge difference. I plan on trying the cheater specs while shooting with irons and i think it will help a great deal. With a red dot or a scope I have no problems at all.
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Same problem here. I use 1.5 for reading but only a .5 for shooting. Brings the front sight in nice without completely blurring out the target. Joblot and the other dollar stores reading glasses start at 1 power but look for a pair of computer glasses. They start at .5 power
 

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