Stopped by S&W today.. tested the M&P .45

[Lugnut]

Dropped off the 1911 for some work. While I was there I had to shoot a gun... sooo I tested the M&P .45. I was more impressed with it this time around. Very similar to the other FS M&Ps. I still hate that the stock M&Ps have virtually no reset... well one that you can feel anyway! Slapping the mag in caused a round to chamber though... didn't like that. I find it strange that my 9mm and .40S&W M&Ps all shoot a tad high... and this one did too. Must be me or the way I'm seeing the 3 dot sights is causing me an issue. Is the frame bigger on the .45? This was bigger than mine (I use med grip swells) but maybe it had large swells. I was told the barrel is slightly longer than the 9 and .40.

Great gun for the money- no question.

 

[TonyDedo]

The trigger reset is the one thing I'm still struggling with, in regards to my M&P 45. It feels like it has two resets - one click for the trigger safety, and another click for the trigger itself - and both are very subtle. I find that when I try to reset the trigger, I reset to the first click, but miss the second. Then I pull the trigger, nothing happens, and I have to reset again. Very different from the reset on my XD or my 1911.

 

[vellnueve]

Get a Burwell trigger job done on it?

 

[TonyDedo]

Get a Burwell trigger job done on it?

Considering it, but I have a couple firearms waiting for trigger jobs, and I'm trying to decide who goes first. I'm thinking of sending the XD out for some work instead.

 

[Fooped]

I've got one as well, and it's maiden voyage to the range was this past Sunday.

I couldn't hit the broad side of a barn with it.

Something about how the gun sights/shoots that I have yet to figure out. Admittedly, I have very little trigger time with it, but I switched back to my H&K USP and had no issues.


Hmmmmmmm........

 

[Chris]

Deleted.

 

[Tiktock]

You could also do the trigger job yourself. i just did one on my M&P and its a different gun! No double reset clicks, much crisper and smoother pull, and breaks much further in the pull than stock and has a much shorter reset.

not for the faint of heart though, you gotta pull the sear out and file/polish it down, polish the plunger, etc etc.....no part of it is rocket science and if you take your time and take of a little at a time, its hard to screw up....

 

[Lugnut]

I've got one as well, and it's maiden voyage to the range was this past Sunday.

I couldn't hit the broad side of a barn with it.

Something about how the gun sights/shoots that I have yet to figure out. Admittedly, I have very little trigger time with it, but I switched back to my H&K USP and had no issues.


Hmmmmmmm........

Yeah that's strange. Maybe I should take it for a week to check it.

I'm sure your are familiar with the 3 dots. The front site dot should be over the intended target with the front post squared up in the rear site notch. My M&Ps shoot a tad high.. where did your shots go?

 

[Reptile]

"Slapping the mag in caused a round to chamber though... didn't like that."


I'm not an expert but that sounds dangerous. The only time I'd want a round to chamber is if I rack the slide. If I wanted, how could I carry this gun without a round in the chamber.

This idea of having a round unintentionally chambering is even more deadly that a Glock with out a Ma**h*** .


Reptile

 

[pdm]

"Slapping the mag in caused a round to chamber though... didn't like that."


I'm not an expert but that sounds dangerous. The only time I'd want a round to chamber is if I rack the slide. If I wanted, how could I carry this gun without a round in the chamber.


Reptile

You could always drop the slide before inserting the magazine. I've had the slide of my M&P 9mm snap forward a couple of times as I inserted a new magazine. Never happens consistently, though, so I can only surmise it's a mix of gunk on the parts, how I insert the magazine and dumb luck.

 

[Len-2A Training]

"Slapping the mag in caused a round to chamber though... didn't like that."


I'm not an expert but that sounds dangerous. The only time I'd want a round to chamber is if I rack the slide. If I wanted, how could I carry this gun without a round in the chamber.

This idea of having a round unintentionally chambering is even more deadly that a Glock with out a Ma**h*** .


Reptile

Matter of opinion. I look at this as a "feature"!

I NEVER want to have a gun with mag but no round in the chamber! Very unsafe for the "carrier" to carry an unloaded pistol. The entire reason to carry a gun is to be READY in case you need it, not to pull a Barney Fife routine as you are either sliced and diced or shot by a perp.

In at least one of the defensive handgun courses I took, this "feature" was pointed out to us. I do it whenever possible with my Glock and a few other guns.

YMMV

 

[Lugnut]

Matter of opinion. I look at this as a "feature"!
YMMV

Well it's in inconsistent and unreliable "feature" though. It didn't happen all the time. Honestly this would bug me if it did this on my guns unless it was designed to do that everytime.

 

[Len-2A Training]

There is a "technique" to make this more predictable. Not sure if it works on an M&P however. I only shot one in .45 at S&W. As soon as they hit the EOPS List, I'll be able to tell you better!

 

[TonyDedo]

Well it's in inconsistent and unreliable "feature" though. It didn't happen all the time. Honestly this would bug me if it did this on my guns unless it was designed to do that everytime.

Agree - in a situation where you need to reload quickly, not having to rack the slide or hit the slide stop to chamber a round could be very beneficial.

However, it's too inconsistent, and because of that inconsistency, I'd just as soon it didn't drop the slide automatically at all. When I reload a magazine, I find myself instinctually reaching to rack the slide, only to find (sometimes) it's already dropped. This causes me to pause and breaks the rhythm of my reload. I can't stop to look at the slide and decide if I need to rack it or not.

 

[dreppucci007]

Matter of opinion. I look at this as a "feature"!

There is a "technique" to make this more predictable. Not sure if it works on an M&P however.

I agree with the "feature" argument...I almost always do it with my Walther P99, and yes...It has become a matter of technique, and I can control it very well.

 

[TonyDedo]

There is a "technique" to make this more predictable. Not sure if it works on an M&P however. I only shot one in .45 at S&W. As soon as they hit the EOPS List, I'll be able to tell you better!

What's the "technique?" 'Cause I'm sitting here in my living room, slapping a mag full of dummy rounds into my M&P, and I can't get the slide to consistently fall.

And Tana thinks I'm nuts...

 

[dreppucci007]

Like Len said...Perhaps, neither of us know if it works on the M&P.

What I can say, from experience with my Walther P99, is that I can consistently choose what I want to happen, and it really had become a matter of technique, and it's easily controllable.

 

[chuck9899]

I have the M&P .40 and i can get it to champer a round or not depending on what i want to do. it all depends on how you insert the mag. if you give it a nice slap when its almost all the way inserted it will champer one. if you do it in one smooth motion and gently push it into place it wont.

I find it consistent and can control it easy enough.

 

[drgrant]

I own a few guns which do that, but only once in awhile, it's so rare it's not
even worth worrying about. And if I am slapping my mag in a gun I am
about to load it anyways, so it makes little difference. Even on the guns
where it does do it, I've found it will only do it if you slap the mag with a
good amount of force, and even then it's not consistent.

I've had it happen on Glocks, HK's, and, back when I had one, the SW99.

Never had it happen on any of my numerous sigs, or either of my 1911s or
the S+W 945.

Not a bother to me one way or the other.... The trigger reset on the M+P,
however, is an issue... its too easy to short stroke it if you can't feel
it there.

-Mike

 

[iodonnel]

Ah, nice ot have met you now that I know it was you (lugnut) whom was shooting the M&P in the range that day, I was the RO out there with you and the guy shooting the .357. Yea funny thing about the slide going into battery when the mag is slammed in, is that it will happen everytime if done right. Saves killing time (the time you would be killed in that is) and its the pure design of the gun. They didn't intend that to be a part of the gun, but if your in a time of need, every second counts whether in competition or real scenario. Put the mag in slow, don't slam and it won't happen. Same thing can happen with glocks. Also the three dots are a bit off on the vert plane(shooting should be more muscle memory anyway), but everyone that has shot the M&P series has said something different about the gun. Shoots low, shoots left or right, 6'oclock hold, etc. Funny how that is. All I know is that when it comes out I will be buying two of them after seeing the amount of rounds through it and how often they are cleaned(not as much as one would think). Nice to have met you and I probably won't see much of NES's there anymore. Got promoted, and I am entering the real world, with a real paying job with real resonsibility, but I am happy it slapped me in the face so soon out of college!

 

[Lugnut]

Ah, nice ot have met you now that I know it was you (lugnut) whom was shooting the M&P in the range that day, I was the RO out there with you and the guy shooting the .357. Yea funny thing about the slide going into battery when the mag is slammed in, is that it will happen everytime if done right. Saves killing time (the time you would be killed in that is) and its the pure design of the gun. They didn't intend that to be a part of the gun, but if your in a time of need, every second counts whether in competition or real scenario. Put the mag in slow, don't slam and it won't happen. Same thing can happen with glocks. Also the three dots are a bit off on the vert plane(shooting should be more muscle memory anyway), but everyone that has shot the M&P series has said something different about the gun. Shoots low, shoots left or right, 6'oclock hold, etc. Funny how that is. All I know is that when it comes out I will be buying two of them after seeing the amount of rounds through it and how often they are cleaned(not as much as one would think). Nice to have met you and I probably won't see much of NES's there anymore. Got promoted, and I am entering the real world, with a real paying job with real resonsibility, but I am happy it slapped me in the face so soon out of college!

First congrats on the new job! I hate it when I bump into people and don't realize they are on this board till after...anways- nice to meet you. I'll have to play around more with the mags- I honestly do the same thing with my M&P 9 and .40 and have never had that happen.

Can you explain what you mean about the three dots? Most of my combat guns (Sigs, Glocks and now M&Ps) all shoot with the front dot OVER the intended target while the front sight is centered in the rear sight notch and front post top even with rear sight top. The only thing that happens to me (as you might have seen) is sometimes when shooting fast- my rounds drop low left- I know that is me! If I was a betting man I'd say that gun shoots a tad high.... and it wasn't me.

The more I shoot competitively (which I really am just getting into) the more I think I like the idea of a completely plain black rear sight and a dot or fiber front sight.

Then again.. the more I get into this the more a think about everything!

PS- Are you still going to work at S&W? I hope you get the employee discount when they come out!

 

[iodonnel]

Haha, yes I will still be at S&W, can't leave that discount. What I meant with the front sight is that if you are using the three dot system, alinging the three dots in a row, and if you can concentrate solely on lining them up, take a look at the top of the front sight, it will be slightly higher than the rear sight, which at 15 yards would cause a shooter to high about the same as you were. You were putting them consistently in one hole, but an inch high and an inch to the left. The left part could be you or it could be the gun, again, these bad boys have had thousands of rounds through them since we got them in, so at that point things get jumbled loose(mainly the rear sight). You might even be able to see the same thing on the 9 and 40 about the sights. That's why if you look at Sigs and Glocks they tend not to use the three dot. I switched my M&P sights for a Warren Tactical rear sight and had smith put thier night sight in the front. Picks up real nice and is spot on. You can grab the rear sight here http://www.mp-store.com/product_inf...d=168&osCsid=19cf24fbf76b5196fe1acd641c675e97 and just have smith put the front on. It makes a difference. Otherwise, I am a good shooter but I am also human and lose concentration, plus the .45 trigger and frame are much different than the 9 and 40, with regards to the reset, travel and width.

 

[Lugnut]

Haha, yes I will still be at S&W, can't leave that discount. What I meant with the front sight is that if you are using the three dot system, alinging the three dots in a row, and if you can concentrate solely on lining them up, take a look at the top of the front sight, it will be slightly higher than the rear sight, which at 15 yards would cause a shooter to high about the same as you were. You were putting them consistently in one hole, but an inch high and an inch to the left. The left part could be you or it could be the gun, again, these bad boys have had thousands of rounds through them since we got them in, so at that point things get jumbled loose(mainly the rear sight). You might even be able to see the same thing on the 9 and 40 about the sights. That's why if you look at Sigs and Glocks they tend not to use the three dot. I switched my M&P sights for a Warren Tactical rear sight and had smith put thier night sight in the front. Picks up real nice and is spot on. You can grab the rear sight here http://www.mp-store.com/product_inf...d=168&osCsid=19cf24fbf76b5196fe1acd641c675e97 and just have smith put the front on. It makes a difference. Otherwise, I am a good shooter but I am also human and lose concentration, plus the .45 trigger and frame are much different than the 9 and 40, with regards to the reset, travel and width.

That's the kind of rear sight I think I'm going to use. Burwell makes a similar one also as well as a fiber front sight I'm going to try.

Wrt the dots- I think I see what you are saying. But on mine- when the top of the front post is level with the top of the rear sight- the front dot is actually high relative to the two rear dots. Maybe the dot's should be aligned and then the front dot is POA=POI??

Either way for IDPA it won't matter too much. And the plain black sight and front fiber will allow me to acquire the sight picture/front sight quicker... I hope.

 

[DavidC77]

Ya I just bought a M&P 40 S&W with the lovely Mass 10 LB trigger. Boy is it different than the 6.5 trigger on all the other non-Mass guns.

I was going to go with the 45 but it was just alittle bigger and heavier than the 40. I'm useing it as my CC Gun so I wanted to stay alittle smaller. The compacts were to small for my bear paws.

I called S&W and they said to send it to Burwell to have them do a trigger job to it ( S&W won't work on them yet), but I'm going to use John from JDL, lives right here in Springfield (and at S&W ). He's going to do a trigger job on my 1911 also.

 

[iodonnel]

Exactly with regards to the rear and front, which would make it go high, if your only using the three dots and not the tops of the site. Easy fix and worth wonders with keeping you from ripping out your hair in frustration I love the black rear becasue it forces yourself not to rely on paint. I have that system on all my 1911s, only with a gold dot on the front site. Perfecto. Only then is POA=POI, too bad it takes one adjustment.

That's the kind of rear sight I think I'm going to use. Burwell makes a similar one also as well as a fiber front sight I'm going to try.

Wrt the dots- I think I see what you are saying. But on mine- when the top of the front post is level with the top of the rear sight- the front dot is actually high relative to the two rear dots. Maybe the dot's should be aligned and then the front dot is POA=POI??

Either way for IDPA it won't matter too much. And the plain black sight and front fiber will allow me to acquire the sight picture/front sight quicker... I hope.