takin the plunge...getting an m1a

LORD of WAR

LORD of WAR

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ive decided that i need to add an m1a to my arsenal but i dont know what to get

i love the tactical look of the socom 16 and will probably get one eventually but for now i want the full size more traditional rifle...however...to the horror of some purists im leaning towards getting the black synthetic stock over the wood[shocked]

so my questions are as follows:

should i get a standard rifle or an upgraded one?
whats the difference between "loaded" and "national match"?
would one of these over the other be beneficial?
blued or stainless barrel?
ive seen a few prebans floating around online...should i try and get 1 or just stick with the newer production ones?

TIA!
 
It's kinda hard to answer if you don't tell us what you want to do with it. The ones you listed are very different.

If you just want an informal shooter, just get a basic GI type.

B
 
i want something i can shoot out to 500 yards with no problem...not looking to compete or anything with it...just something that is gonna give me good accuracy out to that range consistently

and i do plan on putting glass on it at some point
 
You used the word consistently in the same sentence with accuracy when referring to an M1A. :-P

The GI one should be fine. The NM one would probably be a little more accurate with match grade ammo but not as good as a super match. The loaded one is just a NM one without a bedded stock. Kind of hard to make use of the upgrades if the stock is not bedded.

B
 
If the standard one is $1300, I would get the upgrades for a NM, but I would be hard pressed to spend that kind of jingle on one. YMMV.

I think you could get a lot more gun for that $1500 with an AR-10 or the LR-308.

B
 
Get the M1A - there's just no comparison with AR-10's FAL's etc...It's a different animal altogether.

Defining your need/purpose will yield you the perfect rifle. Sure a Loaded, National Match, Super Match, Whitefeather will get you the greatest accuracy. However, they can be finicky about Milsurp ammo - you may be relegated to shooting match grade ammo or handloads. The Standard makes more sense in my opinion if you want a 22" barrel - the Scout in my view is the ideal at 18" - being more compact, handy and still accurate as hell. Though unitizing gas cylinders, bedding stocks, NM trigger and piston has it's benefits, there's also a downside - especially bedding a stock. First it's not cheap and second, field stripping the rifle breaks down the bedding. For many, that's no biggie - especially match shooters.

If you buy a Standard or a Scout and make simple changes down the road like adding a Sadlak spring guide, reaming out the FS, swapping out the piston, etc - you can see marked increases in an already accurate rifle. Not to mention you could go hog wild and mount the action in a JAE or Troy, (which are tension bedded) and make further gains. Just the addition of the Troy MCS has made tremendous gains in accuracy in my SOCOM. I can only imagine what it would do for an 18-22" M1A/M14

If it were me, I'd go for a Scout, then a Standard. If you fall in love with the rifle, (which you will) you can make improvements as you go along. Springfield Armory has the best price point, plus a lifetime warranty. However, Fulton Armory builds some sweet rifles, as does LRB, Ted Brown, Smith Enterprises Inc, (awesome) etc...The sky is the limit. I've seen NIB Standards for around $1300 - Loadeds for $1550. Scouts are so popular that I've not seen a new one in a while.

Don't try to resist the force Luke...M1A, M1A, M1A..... [wink]
 
Good choice! Especially on getting the full length. Classy. I've seen your gun closet and you'll have time for a shorty later. [cheers]

You can do a lot better than 1300 for a standard. You should be paying that much or less for a loaded and closer to $1100 for a standard. The NM price sounds about right. Springfield ran dry ([angry2]) on both of the models I wanted for months when I was buying them, so I got them both very lightly used.

I think the loaded is a very good upgrade over the standard for not much $$$. For me, the jump from standard to loaded was definitely worth the $$$, while the jump from loaded to NM wasn't.

The match trigger and front sight are the biggest improvements you'll notice if you fire them side by side. They help the feel of each shot big time. Standard front sight is about the width of a 275m silhouette, while the NM front sight is about the size of a 400m silhouette. It also has a match barrel, match flash suppressor, and .5 MOA windage adjustment (instead of 1 MOA on the standard).

The Match rifle on top of that adds a hood to the rear sight that you can flip to make .5 MOA elevation adjustments (standard and loaded only do 1MOA). It also has a match gas system and spring/guiderod. The hood and the spring/guiderod you can replace on your own very easily if you ever feel like they'll make a difference for you. There are ways to unitize the gas system on your own too that are not as simple as replacing a part, but I haven't gotten good enough to really get into that yet.

I have no info on SS vs regular barrel. I don't like the aesthetics of the SS so I never looked into it much. Match barrels are not chrome lined, so they're not as durable as the standard barrel in field situations. And the "match" accuracy over the standard barrel only lasts ~5000 rounds (probably just about the same time one would get good enough to notice the difference!)

M1As are not the easiest things to scope well. The short answer is to get a mount that is steel (not aluminum) and attaches to three points... both side mount screws and the stripper clip guide. Anything less won't keep zero. Make sure you get a scope with long eye relief too. Most mounts won't allow you to mount the scope further back (I had to get a $$$$$ GDI TA70 mount with an extended rearward rail for my IOR Valdada... It'll be here by the weekend) Try to get a mount that has a channel to see the irons through as a backup... none of the good ones quick-detach. The rifle stock is meant for the very low irons and you'll need a cheek rest to get any weld at all with a scope (even jaw weld doesn't usually work without one). Lots of people are making drill-on kydex

M1A junkies are all about having all GI parts. Early commercial Springfields were put together with GI parts on a commercial receiver. As GI parts started drying up, Springfield started making their own cast ones which aren't always as good. I never really got into this too much. I suppose I would if my rifles stopped working, but they run fine and they're probably not 100% GI. A preban gun would get you more GI parts. And I suppose if you ever wanted to put a pistol grip on it you'd need it to be preban too, but it doesn't sound like you want to with this one. (the Socom has a brake instead of a suppressor, so you'd be fine with putting a pistol grip on like Mark did)

The only problems I've had with my rifles have been mag related. Luckily, you missed the days when GI mags were $50 a pop. CMI just started making USGI ones again by the assload and most of the country is getting brand new ones from them for less than $25. The market for preban ones is $20-$25 now. At these prices, don't bother with $15 Taiwanese ("Just like USGI!" my ass) or any other ones that are not USGI. They just don't feed 100%. Zero of Ten of mine worked right when I got them. I replaced all the springs with +10% Wolff springs and now maybe 7 of 10 work. Besides, they're pitted and blued instead of parkerized like USGI ones. I'd trade all 10 of them for 4 USGI ones now (I've since gotten a bunch of USGIs and the T57s just sit around). Feh.

Come to an appleseed and you can get some hands-on time on mine. I have a loaded and a scout.
 
The last time I saw someone shoot a SOCOM at any real distance (600 YDS) he did so poorly it was embarrassing. He barely kept them on a 45 X 45 inch target frame.

If you want consistently good accuracy out to 500 yards, I'd stay away from a SOCOM.

B
 
I got lucky and a friend sold me he M!A Service grade for $700.00. Even after six thousand rounds, it shoots great. One problem with the bolt roller clip coming off. SAI repaired free of charge.
 
Matty - crak made some excellent points! I also forgot to add about the hooded rear sight on the NM's - they make great target sights, but poor battle sights. Crak - is the Loaded the place to stop as far as ammo sensitivity? I've read a lot of threads about NM's and above being very finicky with standard ball - does your Loaded feed Milsurp well? I ask, as it's on my list of things to buy, (a Standard) and wondered if the upgrade to Loaded would limit my ammo choices.

As for SS barrels - I'm not a fan - for no other reason than the looks. I understand that SS barrels can be finished to look black, but I'd want the carbon color barrel personally....
 
1) More of a fan of the FAL than the M1A but do appreciate the trigger and more adjustability of the M1A's sights. Biggest regret on the FAL is the trigger pull.

2) SS barrels or chrome-moly barrels are more accurate than CM barrels with chrome lining in them. The trade off is accuracy versus corrosion protection. A match barrel's accuracy loss starts at the distance, not up close. You know it's time to replace the barrel on your competition gun when the rifle starts opening the grouping at 600yds. The rifle will still shoot good at 300yds or closer for awhile more. Most guys will use this barrel on the short course ranges.

3) You need to figure out what you want to do with the rifle before you pay the cash. I consider the M1A the 1911 of rifles. It's good out of the box but you could spend that much more again just getting it to shoot the way you want. The only thing I have done to my SAR-48 ( FAL ) is the DSArms scope cover I put on it. I have an Aimpoint on it right now but could put any optic on I want to later.

Spend the money wisely and you get it right the first time and not keep spending looking for the perfect rifle.

Joe R.
 
No problems loading SA and Australian surplus with USGI mags (somewhere between 2000-3000 rounds). That's all I ever feed it. When I run out that's going to be the kick in the ass I need to get all this reloading stuff I bought set up.
 
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Crak is correct about the prices. I bought a Loaded M1A in the black synthetic stock you were thinking about from FS at a little over $1200. I couldn't be more happier with it. Accurate as all hell. Using surplus ammo I can typically hit a clay pigeon at 200 yrds off the bench. Accurate enough for me.
 
Rockrivr1 said:
I bought a Loaded M1A in the black synthetic stock...

Accurate as all hell. Using surplus ammo I can typically hit a clay pigeon at 200 yrds off the bench.
Click to expand...

If it will shoot ball into four inches at 200 thats pretty good!

It might be worth looking into the loaded one.

B
 
bpm990d said:
The last time I saw someone shoot a SOCOM at any real distance (600 YDS) he did so poorly it was embarrassing. He barely kept them on a 45 X 45 inch target frame.

If you want consistently good accuracy out to 500 yards, I'd stay away from a SOCOM.

B
Click to expand...

+1. I just don't see the purpose of a short-barreled M14. I'm not clearing houses with the christly thing. Those things are so loud to others who are shooting nearby, you might get some unkind remarks.

Cruise the gunshops for used rifles. You will still likely pay $1000-$1200 for a used Springfield. If you see a Polytech or Norinco for $700 or less, grab it.

Springfield-good
Armscorp-good
LRB-good
Fulton-good
Smith Enterprise-good
Polytech-good (if inexpensive)
Norinco-good (if inexpensive)


Fed. Ord.-bad
Enterprise-bad (maybe good, but have checked by gunsmith)
Smith Limited-bad
Hesse-bad
others-bad

I would get a standard rifle first. If you decide you want more accuracy, send it here http://www.angusarms.com/
 
PatMcD said:
+1. I just don't see the purpose of a short-barreled M14. I'm not clearing houses with the christly thing. Those things are so loud to others who are shooting nearby, you might get some unkind remarks.
Click to expand...

I respectfully disagree. Set up properly, there's no reason a SOCOM cannot reach out to 500-yards with accuracy. The irons that are stock on a SOCOM are indeed CQB sights, so with the wide blade small target shooting beyond 200-yards is a problem. However, with a Trijicon Tripower on the front deck of my SOCOM, I was easily making center mass hits on a full-sized silhouette target at 400-yards, (407 to be exact) - and I'm no crack shot. I can only imagine what a SOCOM with good optics is capable of and will hopefully soon find out... [wink] They are no louder than a bolt gun shooting .308, (ask me how I know) and many of the rumors of giant flameballs, roaring reports and inaccuracy are largely mythological. It is not by any means a quiet gun - the neighbors will know you're shooting a boomstick, but I have had zero complaints on the range.....
 
ive shot both a standard and a socom 16 and can say that i fell in love with both...i would absolutely buy the socom immediately if i didnt already have a ptr91...i love the socom simply because its so loud!!!!
 
blood hound said:
...i love the socom simply because its so loud!!!!
Click to expand...

2.gif



If you take out your ear plugs, the regular one will be just as loud as the socom.
 
blood hound said:
lrb???
Click to expand...

LRB is the best quality M1A receiver you can get. Forged right here in Long Island (as opposed to cast in Brazil). Best of the best. They even make a version with an integrated scope rail that completely solves the whole problem of farting around with the mob of crappy mounts out there. The whole thing is every M14er's dream come true. $2459 and a decent wait (+$110 for the mount version). I'm going to wait til I wear out my other two before I jump on one, though. [wink]

http://www.lrbarms.com/rifles.html
 
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MassMark said:
They are no louder than a bolt gun shooting .308, (ask me how I know) and many of the rumors of giant flameballs, roaring reports and inaccuracy are largely mythological. It is not by any means a quiet gun - the neighbors will know you're shooting a boomstick, but I have had zero complaints on the range.....
Click to expand...


Accuracy-wize, I think a SOCOM (with optics) may be as good as a full-size, standard M1A. Nowhere near what a purpose-built match M14 can do, though.

As for them being no louder than a bolt gun; I think the report from that SOCOM has rattled your brain pan a little too much. I've shot them and sat next to them being shot. They are way louder than anything else around.
 
PatMcD said:
Accuracy-wize, I think a SOCOM (with optics) may be as good as a full-size, standard M1A. Nowhere near what a purpose-built match M14 can do, though.

As for them being no louder than a bolt gun; I think the report from that SOCOM has rattled your brain pan a little too much. I've shot them and sat next to them being shot. They are way louder than anything else around.
Click to expand...

My M44 says hello.
 

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