Trigger suggestions for Sig P365 X Macro?

It is an EDC with a somewhat plebian FCU layout. What kind of improvement you seek in an EDC trigger? It is supposed to have noticeable travel, well defined wall and long-ish reset... We shoot stock FCU's at the EDC matches and they are adequate to the point where folks are not much slower than shooting their "real" CO and LO guns except on stages where mag capacity matters. So what more do you require?
 
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It is an EDC with a somewhat plebian FCU layout. What kind of improvement you seek in an EDC trigger? It is supposed to have noticeable travel, well defined wall and long-ish reset... We shoot stock FCU's at the EDC matches and they are adequate to the point where folks are not much slower than shooting their "real" CO and LO guns except on stages where mag capacity matters. So what more do you require?
Not feeling like im trying to clean up mushy vomit when I pull it?

Op macarbo and a spring kit will make it palatable.

But if you dont like the 320/365 triggers there is nothing you can do to fix them.

Micro compacts are coming in droves wait til u find one you like and switch
 
It is an EDC with a somewhat plebian FCU layout. What kind of improvement you seek in an EDC trigger? It is supposed to have noticeable travel, well defined wall and long-ish reset... We shoot stock FCU's at the EDC matches and they are adequate to the point where folks are not much slower than shooting their "real" CO and LO guns except on stages where mag capacity matters. So what more do you require?
Just a cleaner/smoother feel and not so much wall before the break. Maybe a lighter pull overall.

My other EDC is creamy smooth and has a consistent pull until it just breaks.

Require? Nothing.
Want? Everything.

Just figured I’d ask and glean the benefit of others’ experience before getting into the woods with it.
 
Not feeling like im trying to clean up mushy vomit when I pull it?

Op macarbo and a spring kit will make it palatable.

But if you dont like the 320/365 triggers there is nothing you can do to fix them.

Micro compacts are coming in droves wait til u find one you like and switch

Thanks, I’ll check that out. Palatable is way better than unpalatable. [wink]
 
I think I did a writeup on this somewhere here, probably a few years ago though.
The big problem I've had with the 365 triggers (and with many other guns) is basically excessive sear engagement, aggravated by not very smooth engagement surfaces. It just creeps along way too long before the break, bumping and grinding the whole way. I've played with a bunch of different 365 models, while they're all a bit different/better/worse they're still universally shitt-eh triggers, even with the 'fancy' models. By my standards anyway...

Easy enough improvement to just polish up surfaces but still way too much travel... this fortunately also has a relatively easy remedy. It's just a little lathe turned tube/sleeve that slides over the pin in the fcu which functions to alter the sear height/position relative to the striker. No permanent modification to the stock parts at all, just some disassembly/finagling/reassembly. A side effect is also much reduced pull weight, I typically end up at 3 - 3 1/2lbs.
Striker still has that weird "twoink" on the break though, lol.

With minimized engagement the problem of the rough surfaces is also minimized and may not even necessitate polishing. A downside is it's not really 'adjustable' and some trial and error is necessary to get just the right amount of engagement for desired feel and solid function. I usually attempt to make a sear to be screw adjustable but many/most designs don't make it easy or reasonably possible. I'll tune sears until failure and then back off some but when grinding on a sear (as opposed to turning an adjustment screw) this unfortunately means you need more than one. Then some manufacturers won't sell you one and have no aftermarket options, gets tricky/nerve wracking. In this case a few various size tubes can be swapped out to get the best result, just a pain to keep taking apart and putting together multiple times. And again, 100% reversible.

Some time later I found that there's someone (company name is escaping me) selling a product with the same function but uses a spring as the tube/sleeve, so the wire diameter is the factor controlling the amount of sear engagement. Sold as a few springs in different sizes, pricey from what I remember considering it's probably a ten cent spring, lol.
Smart idea, easy/cheap to produce and even to 'roll your own'. Though for me the solid sleeve allows me to tweek the dimensions on a finer level and without having to find a bunch of different wire sizes in .001” increments...
From memory I think the tube dimensions were .125" od x .096 id x .2" lg as a good starting point, .136" od being near the "hairy edge".
The wall thickness is really the only critical dimension, assuming the id is big enough to fit over the pin. So doing the math, winding a spring you'd want something around .015" to .020" wire, the larger diameter potentially pushing it.
 
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I think I did a writeup on this somewhere here, probably a few years ago though.
The big problem I've had with the 365 triggers (and with many other guns) is basically excessive sear engagement, aggravated by not very smooth engagement surfaces. It just creeps along way too long before the break, bumping and grinding the whole way. I've played with a bunch of different 365 models, while they're all a bit different/better/worse they're still universally shitt-eh triggers, even with the 'fancy' models. By my standards anyway...

Easy enough improvement to just polish up surfaces but still way too much travel... this fortunately also has a relatively easy remedy. It's just a little lathe turned tube/sleeve that slides over the pin in the fcu which functions to alter the sear height/position relative to the striker. No permanent modification to the stock parts at all, just some disassembly/finagling/reassembly. A side effect is also much reduced pull weight, I typically end up at 3 - 3 1/2lbs.
Striker still has that weird "twoink" on the break though, lol.

With minimized engagement the problem of the rough surfaces is also minimized and may not even necessitate polishing. A downside is it's not really 'adjustable' and some trial and error is necessary to get just the right amount of engagement for desired feel and solid function. I usually attempt to make a sear to be screw adjustable but many/most designs don't make it easy or reasonably possible. I'll tune sears until failure and then back off some but when grinding on a sear (as opposed to turning an adjustment screw) this unfortunately means you need more than one. Then some manufacturers won't sell you one and have no aftermarket options, gets tricky/nerve wracking. In this case a few various size tubes can be swapped out to get the best result, just a pain to keep taking apart and putting together multiple times. And again, 100% reversible.

Some time later I found that there's someone (company name is escaping me) selling a product with the same function but uses a spring as the tube/sleeve, so the wire diameter is the factor controlling the amount of sear engagement. Sold as a few springs in different sizes, pricey from what I remember considering it's probably a ten cent spring, lol.
Smart idea, easy/cheap to produce and even to 'roll your own'. Though for me the solid sleeve allows me to tweek the dimensions on a finer level and without having to find a bunch of different wire sizes in .001” increments...
From memory I think the tube dimensions were .125" od x .096 id x .2" lg as a good starting point, .136" od being near the "hairy edge".
The wall thickness is really the only critical dimension, assuming the id is big enough to fit over the pin. So doing the math, winding a spring you'd want something around .015" to .020" wire, the larger diameter potentially pushing it.
Could you please post a picture, it would help to visualize what you explained above.
I can try to 3d print it in nylon, it may work.
 
Could you please post a picture, it would help to visualize what you explained above.
I can try to 3d print it in nylon, it may work.
I'd have to disassemble the fcu to get a meaningful view of what's going on and even then it would take a few angles with circles and arrows along with the description.
I'll attempt a more detailed description. Would help to be looking at an uninstalled fcu while reading, the cavity where the tube is installed is sort of up and in there looking from underneath...


The sear is a laid down ‘L’ shaped arrangement, the longer leg sitting/pivoting horizontally towards the rear, the end of which engages the striker. It pivots from it's 'elbow' on one transverse pin, then utilizes a second pin sitting just under and a bit to the rear (of the first/pivot pin) that functions as a stop against the inside lower leg of the ‘L’. This pin also has other functions, the specifically shaped end of it has to do with the 'semiautomatic' slide takedown mechanism.
The placement/diameter of this pin is one thing that sets the amount of sear engagement with the striker and making it a larger diameter by installing the tube over it has the effect of pulling the sear down away from the striker, lessening the amount of engagement.
Installation involves pulling said pin and inserting the tube into the cavity that part of the pin and sear leg sits in then reinserting the pin through the tube. Tweezers help...

I don't see any reason why a printed nylon tube wouldn't work, other than potential failure/wear, you could make one snipping off a piece of an appropriate sized coffee stir straw or whatever. It's job is basically just a shim/spacer where only one side is performing the necessary function, the tube shape is just what holds it in place. If you could affix a strip of paper between the sear leg and pin it would work, somewhat...
I can't recall why I didn't just put an adjustment screw on the sear leg, I'm assuming not enough real estate.
 
Another thing...
If the gun has a safety, it won't engage after doing this mod until you stone off an appropriate bit of the nub on it that comes up and blocks the sear.
This is non reversible other than welding material back on.
 
Just a cleaner/smoother feel and not so much wall before the break. Maybe a lighter pull overall.

My other EDC is creamy smooth and has a consistent pull until it just breaks.

Require? Nothing.
Want? Everything.

Just figured I’d ask and glean the benefit of others’ experience before getting into the woods with it.
What is your EDC that is better?

I stopped by the Sig Pro Shop when I had a a P365. They had a Gray Guns trigger for the P320, which the store employee said was an improvement, but that there wasn't much that could be done with the minimal metal and design of the P365.
 
What is your EDC that is better?

I stopped by the Sig Pro Shop when I had a a P365. They had a Gray Guns trigger for the P320, which the store employee said was an improvement, but that there wasn't much that could be done with the minimal metal and design of the P365.
i do not mind much trigger on my 365, but stock iron sights kinda suck. i did not even try to explore what can fit there and would be better, as stock ones glow at night, so, really lazy to even begin dealing with it. the front one i dislike the most, it would be nicer to make it a bit thinner, i think.
irons on the stock cz shadow are perfect, would be nice to get something like that, if possible.

what was also an interesting recent development, i took a pack of steel tula with me this thursday, and out of 10 there were at least 3-4 light strikes on my 365. old brass ammo i had had no issues, but i had a recollection that it did eat steel ammo fine before - but, apparently, not anymore. and i did not mess with the fcu, from what i can recall. not 100% sure, as i mess with a lot of things, :) , but i do not think i did with this one.
 
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What is your EDC that is better?

I stopped by the Sig Pro Shop when I had a a P365. They had a Gray Guns trigger for the P320, which the store employee said was an improvement, but that there wasn't much that could be done with the minimal metal and design of the P365.
S&W model 64.

I know, I know… Apples and Oranges, or rather, a steel grapefruit wedged between your hip and waistband. It still goes bang when you pull the trigger though. The notion that being an EDC somehow necessitates a sub par trigger makes no sense to me. Higher weight, longer draw may be prudent. Point is, there’s no reason I can imagine that smooth with a clean break wouldn’t be desirable.

The trigger on this 365 is nowhere near the worst I’ve experienced but I think it’s worth chasing some improvement. The response from wcorey above is gold. Just because there’s not a drop in option for a few hundred dollars on the market doesn’t preclude the possibility of gains to be had by other means.
 
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My early production free state 365 trigger is tolerable considering the entire gun is a compromise.
For a deep concealment gun, like my standard 365 with magguts +2 kits for 13rd capacity, it's completely fine.
Other than running a mag through it every week I don't spend much time behind it.
I've avoided the larger 365 variants & other sig striker guns because comparable alternatives have better trigger options.
 
Sig triggers are always spongey/mushy. I don’t have a 365 but have various 320s including the compact. At least for the 320 there are a number of aftermarket improvements depending on how much tinkering you are willing to do. But it’s possible to get a crisper break and little take up and if you compete you can get the trigger pull fairly low (like 3.5). The stock trigger has a ton of take up and isn’t crisp at all. Grayguns, The Sig Armorer, Armory Craft seem to be most popular for the 320 and you can even mix and match components but I note that some components may need to work together, such as the TSA disconnector and modified striker. You might also prefer different trigger shapes (eg straight vs curved or semi-curved). I assume there are options out there for the 365. The only real barrier is money and your patience. I have run tons of comp guns both hammer and striker and have learned, not surprisingly, that it’s 95% your abilities and 5% the gun. You can get most triggers within a range of reasonableness. So it ends up coming down to the overall ergos and feel in your hand and then of course practice practice practice.
 
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How do these affect safety and/or reliability?
Fair question and I don’t have an answer. I only made the changes for competition purposes. I would imagine that if you crisp up the trigger and reduce take up without lightening the trigger to a competition weight, safety wouldn’t be compromised. If you are particularly safety conscious and planning EDC, maybe a gun with a trigger tab is better? I don’t have a sense of how the safety setup on the sigs works and what makes it work as well as other systems. Like, how does it permit the trigger tab to not be needed as a safety mechanism?
 
Fair question and I don’t have an answer. I only made the changes for competition purposes. I would imagine that if you crisp up the trigger and reduce take up without lightening the trigger to a competition weight, safety wouldn’t be compromised.
Reducing trigger take up requires caution. Most modern pistols have a firing pin block safety that is moved during the trigger take up. The firing pin block is what makes it impossible for the pistol to fire without the trigger being pulled. If you reduce trigger take up, the firing pin block may have reduced engagement, or none at all.

The only case I have heard of where a Glock fired in a holster without having the trigger pulled, the pistol had aftermarket trigger parts which had inadvertently disengaged the firing pin safety. I have never heard of an incident like that with a stock Glock, most likely because it is pretty much impossible.

When modifying triggers, it is important to understand how all the parts interact, and how much engagement there is. Also, some modifications may be safe enough for competition, but still closer to the edge than I would want in a carry gun.
 
Reducing trigger take up requires caution. Most modern pistols have a firing pin block safety that is moved during the trigger take up. The firing pin block is what makes it impossible for the pistol to fire without the trigger being pulled. If you reduce trigger take up, the firing pin block may have reduced engagement, or none at all.

The only case I have heard of where a Glock fired in a holster without having the trigger pulled, the pistol had aftermarket trigger parts which had inadvertently disengaged the firing pin safety. I have never heard of an incident like that with a stock Glock, most likely because it is pretty much impossible.

When modifying triggers, it is important to understand how all the parts interact, and how much engagement there is. Also, some modifications may be safe enough for competition, but still closer to the edge than I would want in a carry gun.
Right, but I have heard of no problems with any of the comp triggers that are available for the 320 anyway.
 


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