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Winter Warrior 2022-2023 Postal Match for Iron Sight Military Rifles
- Thread starter Mountain
- Start date
Looks like on Saturday AM I might finally have a chance to beat my lowest temp day. Forecast calling for minus 11 F. Coldest range day so far for me is minus 7.
Most normal lubricants like RemOil and WD40 will get very gummy at these temperatures. I run Mobil 1 synthetic grease in my M1's and it was GTG at minus 7. For AR's I have found Marvel Mystery Oil to work well at super low temperatures.
Most normal lubricants like RemOil and WD40 will get very gummy at these temperatures. I run Mobil 1 synthetic grease in my M1's and it was GTG at minus 7. For AR's I have found Marvel Mystery Oil to work well at super low temperatures.
45collector
NES Member
I'll be putting a target up at some point this weekend. Saturday looks like it's going to be a beautiful day for a long hike in the woods. 
I took advantage of some free time and fresh snow fall this morning. I brought along my Egyptian Hakim and Spanish FR8. The Hakim shot pretty well but the FR8 sight was off about a foot high. I forgot my adjustment tool and just winged it. Temp was 28 degrees and sunny.
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Made it out this morning. A balmy -4 in Hanson. I brought a new to me m1 carbine and century FAL. The carbine didn’t perform and all failure to fires with light primer strikes. I have headspace gauges and a new firing pin coming so that will hopefully get sorted. The FAL has a 16” barrel and I was shooting DAG 94 surplus.
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I was shooting DAG 94 in the Fal. The m1 carbine was reloads I made up. I bought it minus a bolt and tracked down a correct flat slide bolt for it. The fireing pin that came with it is under spec and I believe that’s causing it but I might as well run some gauges through it for comfort.
97-2X
Finn M39 shooting decently now that I replaced that missing nut. Hornady .312" projectiles and Varget. Light was crap at the range. Only needed 2 sighters, 8 and an X.
"MM" scratched on stock from WWII? Stock is an original though beat wartime stock.
Didn't get there early enough to best my -7F range day but it was still wicked cold.
About 40F when I shot this a month ago...1901 Brescia M91/93 Carcano Cavalry. Rebuilt by F.A.T. (Terni) in 1947. Retired and stored in Italy. Acquired by RTI a couple years ago. First Carcano I've had that actually shot well. A friend told me the Italian's saying about the 6.5 round..."it never killed anyone on purpose."
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45collector
NES Member
I didn’t put up a target this weekend but I put 20 rounds through the Finn capture M91/30 Sunday, just ringing gongs at 100 yards.
Saturday I hiked in the woods and dunes in Wellfleet for a few hours. I covered about 7.5 miles. When I left the truck it was -6 and when I got back it was a nice balmy 8.
Saturday I hiked in the woods and dunes in Wellfleet for a few hours. I covered about 7.5 miles. When I left the truck it was -6 and when I got back it was a nice balmy 8.
Took my favorite rifle out to 200 yards today. This is a 1943 Springfield M1 Garand CMP special rack grade with a criterion barrel I've had for a few years now. The throat is offically in "you've shot this too much" territory with a gauge reading of 4+, but the muzzle and rifling still look good. By far my favorite rifle I own, and the one I've shot the most. Learned how to shoot on this rifle, learned how to reload and care for wood and metal through trial and error. I shot 125gr hand loads this morning, because 150s and 168's look more like buck shot down range than any semblance of a group. Might take another crack at loading up Sierra match king 168gr HPBTs this week and figure out a load, but after a few years tinkering with loads on this rifle I always settle on 125gr Speer TNTs. Nice crisp morning at HSC, temps about 28-29F according to my car. I've been waiting to take this M1 out for this competition, because I didn't want to lose my brass in the snow!
First target looks to be about a 90 1X on my home made 200 yard target. I forgot to put markings for each ring on it, but I took measurements from the NRA book and made a "poster" in power point then printed it out and taped it together.
Adjusted the elevation down 1 click and windage to the right 2 degrees and took 10 more shots, 93 1X or maybe 94 1X if that round at 3 o clock is touching the 10 ring (very close). Definitely need some more practice, especially at 200 yards. This rifle is much more accurate on a lead sled than these groups and I was getting quite sore contorting my body around a sling while prone.
First target looks to be about a 90 1X on my home made 200 yard target. I forgot to put markings for each ring on it, but I took measurements from the NRA book and made a "poster" in power point then printed it out and taped it together.
Adjusted the elevation down 1 click and windage to the right 2 degrees and took 10 more shots, 93 1X or maybe 94 1X if that round at 3 o clock is touching the 10 ring (very close). Definitely need some more practice, especially at 200 yards. This rifle is much more accurate on a lead sled than these groups and I was getting quite sore contorting my body around a sling while prone.
Buck shot groups are hard to diag.
Probably a bit of fine tuning of the rifle and some practice on fundamentals. If you where struggling with prone position with the sling your sling tension was most likely inconsistent along with your head position behind the rear sight which will lead to inconsistent sight picture.
Getting them in the black is a start now work on shrinking it dow closer to the 10 ring.
Also start calling and logging your shots it does help.
HSC is that holbrook?
Maybe come over to pembroke for a little more practice.
I will add to those shooting a M1
They all seem to toss 1st cold shot.
My JCG match rifle will almost always toss the 1st shot low and right.
At some point take some time to have someone spot for you and log your shots with out them telling you. Just shoot for groups.
Take a few 10 round groups and compare shot to shot.
You might see a particular pattern and pick up on what your doing .
They all seem to toss 1st cold shot.
My JCG match rifle will almost always toss the 1st shot low and right.
At some point take some time to have someone spot for you and log your shots with out them telling you. Just shoot for groups.
Take a few 10 round groups and compare shot to shot.
You might see a particular pattern and pick up on what your doing .
Good tips, thanks for that. So buck shot groups as I called it was shooting from a lead sled, and the rifle is weighed down pretty well. It's my go to load development set up. For whatever reason, the groups won't come. Tried many different M1 powders (4064, 4896, H4895, Varget, AA2495) and it's really all the same. Different bullets, different brass, different seating depths. Never really saw anything that pointed to a good group being close. I am somewhat confident in my reloading techniques, because I can load very accurate ammo for everything else I have just not heavier bullets in the M1. I also have a mark on my stock for cheek weld, but I admit that is inconsistent at best. Could be the culprit for poor performance prone sling.
In regards to uncomfortable sling, I was using an M1917 style sling and with my winter jacket and layers I couldn't find a good length that wasn't too loose or too tight. May try a GI web sling next since that has better customizability.
HSC is Harvard Sportsmans Club, and I am hopefully going to attend some Pembroke matches this upcoming season.
Anyways, practice makes perfect. I'll be out there pretty much every weekend with 40 rounds and a target.
Good shootin'!
![[cheers]](/xen/styles/default/xenforo/smilies.vb/018.gif "Cheers [cheers]")
I hear ya regarding losing brass in snow. I've found some of my own brass a couple springs after a bigger snow winter. Not that we've had a ton of snow, but somebody left me over 40 pcs of once fired PPU .30-06 this winter. That's a full set for a CMP match, LOL.
You sure that Criterion barrel is a 4+? Though many USGI barrels can actually gage at ~1 even when new, a Criterion usually starts as a '0'. A 4+ would be a metric shit ton of wear on a Criterion. If indeed that's the measure, scoring in the 90's at 200 yards is very good.
If you have a chance to borrow a proper service rifle sling and can set it up and use it correctly, that should tighten up your group quite a bit, not that a score in the 90's is bad- but you just might bump that into the high 90's.
As mentioned by Mac, there is some fine tuning for Garands that can tighten up the groups as well.
Guess I need to drag out one of my Garands over the next few days. Probably will be the National Match clone I cobbled together a few years ago.
Actually a GI web sling works pretty good- almost as good as a top shelf service rifle sling.
On an optimum day with bright and consistent light, with my eyes working their best, and shooting my most accurate iron sight milsurps with their best load the best groups I can shoot range from 1.125" to ~1.25" at 100 yards. That's about the limit of my ability and equipment with iron sights. I think I have shot maybe three barely sub-moa iron sight groups at 200 yards over the last 8 years, give or take; but never below moa at 100 yards. Under 3 moa will net you a 'clean' target, so long as those shots are properly centered LOL.
Oh, if you are anywhere near the Mt. Wachusett area you can join me sometime for a Pembroke warm-up shoot.
In God We Trust
NES Member
Hey is that one on the bottom the one you got from me? If so, glad it’s getting some use!Very happy and friendly looking guy, huh?
Not so friendly to the Russian Army!
I think my first entry is going to be the Finnish Mosin. Back when "Sweaty Ben" bought out a big collection of Finnish Mosins I bought two from that outfit. One was a "hand select" Sako and it actually met the criteria. A very nice looking rifle with an arsenal rebuild stock. The second was a VKT (Valmet) "luck of the draw" and looked like I got the short straw. Stock is original but looked like it had been caged up with a beaver on crack. I planned to keep the best shooter and yep- the fugly one held the best groups.
Here's how the beater shoots at 100 yards with factory Hornady. I can cook up loads that shoot the same:
Maybe the VKT isn't so bad if you look at the other side...
Official target to follow once I have a chance to hit the range.
No, yours is in much better shape than this one. The bottom one came from Sweaty Ben at Classic. I was pissed about the condition until I shot it, now I just joke that it spent time in a cage with a beaver on crack. There are some very large chunks of stock missing here and there, but it's a good shooter so I'm OK with that.
Good shootin'!
I hear ya regarding losing brass in snow. I've found some of my own brass a couple springs after a bigger snow winter. Not that we've had a ton of snow, but somebody left me over 40 pcs of once fired PPU .30-06 this winter. That's a full set for a CMP match, LOL.
You sure that Criterion barrel is a 4+? Though many USGI barrels can actually gage at ~1 even when new, a Criterion usually starts as a '0'. A 4+ would be a metric shit ton of wear on a Criterion. If indeed that's the measure, scoring in the 90's at 200 yards is very good.
If you have a chance to borrow a proper service rifle sling and can set it up and use it correctly, that should tighten up your group quite a bit, not that a score in the 90's is bad- but you just might bump that into the high 90's.
As mentioned by Mac, there is some fine tuning for Garands that can tighten up the groups as well.
Guess I need to drag out one of my Garands over the next few days. Probably will be the National Match clone I cobbled together a few years ago.
Yah, I just checked again. I don't have anything to compare it to, and this CMP gauge my be a little off, but it's right at 4, maybe a bit over. It has been through a metric shit ton of shooting, I bought 500 rounds of PPU M1 150gr rounds when I got it and have reloaded them a few times. In addition a few spam cans of HXP and that brass is now on reload #4. I keep brass separate for each rifle so I have a rough estimate of round count. It's definitely above 3,500 for this rifle.
I just did my annual strip, inspect and clean on this rifle. Everything is in spec, but I suspect the mainspring will need replacing next winter. It's a bit compressed (20.25 inches last year, 20 inches today, about 600? rounds this year) compared to the measurement I took last winter, but still in spec. Re-peened the front sight grooves on the barrel as well, so it's nice and snug with no slop. That being said, next week I'll put 40 or so rounds through it to re-settle the action in the stock. After that, I'm thinking I'm going to go after 168s again with some LC68 brass I have. That brass is really good, heavier and thicker than most brass I have on hand and really consistent in all my bolt guns, so maybe it'll show me something different in the M1.
The accuracy of this M1 does frustrate me, especially compared to how the rest of collection fairs, but there is definitely room for improvement in my technique.
Re: Pembroke: Sounds good, I'm out in a burb of Boston but my parents live around the 2/495 interchange. I make the trip out to that area every weekend for HSC anyways...
