Wow, seems time consuming...

[Preachers Sheets]

I have watched a bunch of videos of people reloading step by step. A seperate machine for each step and it seems like making a decent amount of ammo would take a very long time.

Then I have seen these all-in-one machines that seem to cut down the time a ton. Are the all-in-one machines as good as they say or are these videos not showing everything else done before the all-in-one machine is used?

For example it seems like the all-in-one machine will prime, measure powder, dump powder, press bullet and crimp bullet all within one machine.

 

[Lucas McCain]

You are describing the difference between a single stage press and a progressive one. Even with a single stage press you can load 50 - 100 rounds per hour if you are good. With a progressive, the setup time is longer but once it is set up, you can really crank out the rounds.

 

[DukeInFlorida]

• It's important that you understand what is being done in each step, so you can set the tooling properly.
• Especially things like powder measuring
• It "looks simple" when you watch a video, but to set things up (either a single station press, or a multiple station press) takes time.
• The multi-station presses have tons of extra things going on at the same time the basic steps are being done. Lots of tweaks that the machines require to work properly.
• It's best, if you have no experience doing this, to get some help with understanding the process before investing in equipment that can get you hurt.
• Don't forget.... what you build with the equipment is ammo.
• The factory spends tons of $$$ making sure theirs is safe.
• YOU are the one responsible for making sure yours is safe.
• How long it takes, and which kind of machine you should buy depends on a few factors
• How much ammo do you currently shoot? 50 per week? 50 per year?
• 1,000 per week?
• How's your budget? A single station setup could be gotten for less than $200, including virtually everything you need.
• The multi-stage machines can get upwards of $1500 before you are done.

 

[Dick]

I have watched a bunch of videos of people reloading step by step. A seperate machine for each step and it seems like making a decent amount of ammo would take a very long time.

You don't really need a separate "machine" for each step using a single-stage press - you just change the die. So, you would decap and resize all the cases that you plan to load using the resizing die, then switch to bell the case mouths (for pistol ammo), then switch to the seating/crimping die, after dropping powder into each of the cases. That's the overall process - there are variations for different calibers or if you use a separate crimp die, etc. For most rifle ammo only two dies are needed.

Yes, it can take some time but some folks find it relaxing, some don't shoot enough to justify the expense of a better setup, and those trying for ultimate accuracy generally feel they can fine-tune their loads better on a single stage.

Then I have seen these all-in-one machines that seem to cut down the time a ton. Are the all-in-one machines as good as they say or are these videos not showing everything else done before the all-in-one machine is used?

There are other steps, such as case-trimming, that are done off the press, but progressive presses do save tons of time, particularly for high-volume pistol shooters. The machines can be a bit temperamental, as a survey of some of the Dillon vs. Hornady threads here will show.

For example it seems like the all-in-one machine will prime, measure powder, dump powder, press bullet and crimp bullet all within one machine.

Yes, as well as size and deprime first. The idea is generally to produce one finished round with each pull of the handle.

 

[Preachers Sheets]

I have always found the more simple I keep things the easier it will be on stay focused and pay attention to every detail of each step since I am spending more time.

I will likely shoot 200-300 rounds every other weekend (.223 and .45 ACP).

I would like to get into the hobby for a few hundred bucks and see how things go from there.



I am really thinking a single stage is a better way to get into the hobby and I can take it from there. One thing I have always liked is an automatic way to measure and dump the powder instead of doing it by hand for every round. I could just test 1 out of every 10 rounds to make sure nothing has changed.

Does anyone know of a really complete kit with everything from a cleaning tool for the empty cartridges, primer tool, de-burr tool, dies etc...? RCBS seems to have good kits.

 

[ochmude]

I have always found the more simple I keep things the easier it will be on stay focused and pay attention to every detail of each step since I am spending more time.

I will likely shoot 200-300 rounds every other weekend (.223 and .45 ACP).

I would like to get into the hobby for a few hundred bucks and see how things go from there.



I am really thinking a single stage is a better way to get into the hobby and I can take it from there. One thing I have always liked is an automatic way to measure and dump the powder instead of doing it by hand for every round. I could just test 1 out of every 10 rounds to make sure nothing has changed.

Does anyone know of a really complete kit with everything from a cleaning tool for the empty cartridges, primer tool, de-burr tool, dies etc...? RCBS seems to have good kits.

Lee Breech Lock Challenger Reloading Kit

I own this press as my single stage (in addition to a Dillon 550) and am definitely a fan.

 

[DukeInFlorida]

When I was buying equipment for my reloading classes (so that I can handle 4 students, each with their own press), I found that eBay had a BUNCH of cheap used machines. The press is only one of the tools that you will need for the process.

I have always found the more simple I keep things the easier it will be on stay focused and pay attention to every detail of each step since I am spending more time.

I will likely shoot 200-300 rounds every other weekend (.223 and .45 ACP).

I would like to get into the hobby for a few hundred bucks and see how things go from there.



I am really thinking a single stage is a better way to get into the hobby and I can take it from there. One thing I have always liked is an automatic way to measure and dump the powder instead of doing it by hand for every round. I could just test 1 out of every 10 rounds to make sure nothing has changed.

Does anyone know of a really complete kit with everything from a cleaning tool for the empty cartridges, primer tool, de-burr tool, dies etc...? RCBS seems to have good kits.

 

[Preachers Sheets]

I put together a mock setup with everything I THINK I would need. The kit is a Lee Breech Lock kit. There is a safety/instruction course I could take. I think that would be alot of fun and drive safety into my noggin. Does this kit look complete or am I missing something?




Empty cases (duh)

Boxes, bins, buckets & bowls to sort brass in (different cartridges, and different stages of processing)

Load data books (downloadable from most powder makers)

Press (single-stage recommended for beginners)
105.00

Dies (cartridge-specific): Sizing/decapping, Seating, Expander (for most handgun cartridges, usually not required for rifles), Crimp (optional depending on cartridge and weapon type, i.e. usually required for revolvers, recommended for autoloading rifles)
Kit of four = 68.00

Shellholder (cartridge-specific but interchangeable among most single-stage presses - progressive presses use shell carriers, turntables, etc., specific to the brand & model of the press)
Part of press kit

Case lube (not required for straight-wall cases with carbide dies) (Hornady One Shot spray lube is highly recommended)
Pad and lube = 17.50

Calipers (accurate to .001" or better; typical 6" spread is sufficient but you usually need at least 4")
Electronic = 29.00

Case trimmer or file-trim die (for rifle cartridges after sizing - usually not required for straight-wall handgun cases)
Part of press kit

Case-mouth deburr/chamfer tool (for rifle cartridges after trimming - usually not required for straight-wall handgun cases)
Part of press kit

Priming attachment for press, or separate priming tool (use correct size punch, Large or Small)
Part of press kit

Powder scale (accurate to 0.1 grain - there are 7,000 grains in a pound)
Part of press kit

Powder funnel (probably not required if you have a powder measure)
Part of press kit

Primers (determined by published load data)

Powder (determined by published load data)

Bullets (determined by published load data)

Bullet-puller (to disassemble and salvage inevitable errors)
Puller = 16.00

Things you want:

Loading block
Block = 10.00

Powder measure
Part of press kit

Case tumbler & tumbling media
Tumbler kit = 59.00

Tumbling media separator
Part of tumbler kit

Primer-pocket brush (Large/Small)
Brush = 14.00

Chronograph
Chrono = 100.00




It looks like it would be 418.50 plus all of the other things I need like primers, powder, bullets, buckets, bowls, bins and a bench. It would be a pretty penny to start but if I shoot enough it would pay for itself and I think I'll take more pride in shooting my own ammo.

 

[Preachers Sheets]

Duke - Sell me a complete setup from your class room! Take the headache out of it for me

 

[ochmude]

I put together a mock setup with everything I THINK I would need. The kit is a Lee Breech Lock kit. There is a safety/instruction course I could take. I think that would be alot of fun and drive safety into my noggin. Does this kit look complete or am I missing something?

<snip>

If you are really interested, I highly recommend you read The ABC's of Reloading cover to cover. It's a fantastic resource and answers most beginner questions.

 

[Preachers Sheets]

The book is a great idea but even after reading it I would want to take a course under supervision to make sure I'm not making stupid mistakes...I found this one:

Metallic Cartridge Reloading
RL01:Metallic Cartridge Reloading
Reloading ammunition can be both cost effective (typically ½ or less the cost of store bought ammunition), and on par or better with regard to accuracy. One of the significant advantages of reloading is the ability to build custom loads that would not otherwise be available at retailers.

With the current shortage of ammunition in the market place, especially for handgun ammunition, reloading offers you the opportunity to keep your inventory of ammunition up to whatever level you desire, without worrying about the retailers’ shelves being empty. It’s a great time to start reloading.

Weaponcraft’s Metallic Cartridge Reloading Class (RL01) is designed to develop a confident level of proficiency for reloading both pistol and rifle cartridges.



Topics include:

Safety techniques
Equipment needed
Where to get supplies and components
Reference data materials
Bullet designs and options
Handling and storage of supplies
Types of reloading presses
Custom option considerations
Statistical control of the process
Hands on experience
The class is 6-7 hours long, and includes class discussion with questions/answers, guided reloading of ammunition, test firing of reloaded ammunition, and a wrap up session. We provide brass, bullets, powder, primers, equipment, and the knowledge that will keep you safe and confident while reloading. You will choose a pistol and rifle cartridge (in advance, subject to some limitations), and we will provide materials for you to reload 50 pieces of each. We will test fire some of the reloaded rounds in your gun(s), to prove the safety of the reloads, and test the guns for cycling and function. You will bring home the remainder of the reloaded rounds. Students will receive a copy of a reloading book written by one of our instructors

 

[ochmude]

I took the NRA Metallic Reloading course and the Shotshell Reloading course. Lots of good info.

 

[Dick]

+1 on the ABCs of Reloading - best book out there for a beginner, and pretty good even for those who've been doing it for a while.

With regard to your equipment list, I'm not sure what you mean by a "kit" of 4 dies. If you want to reload .223 and .45 ACP, you're going to need two sets of dies, one set for each caliber. The rifle dies will be a two-die set, and the pistol dies will be a 3-die set. Don't even think about not getting carbide dies for the .45 (and any other straight-sided pistol calibers you load in the future). I would also recommend adding a separate taper crimp die for the .45.

 

[DukeInFlorida]

Tell you what..... you come and take the class, and I have an extra press (like NASA, there's always a backup) that I will set up, and train you on. Pay me what I paid for it on eBay, and you can take it home with you.

Duke - Sell me a complete setup from your class room! Take the headache out of it for me

 

[jpattersonnh]

Duke is making a good offer.
The Lee Challenger kit is a good place to start. You would need to add lube pad and lube, Calipers(I own electronic & dial, I use the dial more often), and a case trimmer, although if your reloading .223 most times it is after the 2nd reload that you need to trim. And a Tumbler + case trays. I use Lee for Pistol and RCBS 2 die for rifle, although a few Redding pistol and Lee rifle are used. I still use my Lee Centennial kit + extras after 15 years. I load about 1000 rounds in a couple days. I still have cartridges from 12 years ago that I use for hunting. My suggestion as far as powder is to buy bulk, especially w/ only 2 calibers. I'm up to 16 rifle and 6 pistol.
Here is a great chart that gives grains loaded per pound of powder. Good luck, JP
http://www.reloadbench.com/gloss/grain.html

 

[WILDCATT]

loading tools

I dont in tend to cut in on any arangements.but I believe a lee turret is the best press for beginners.it can be used as a single stage.and the dies can be set up permenently.Mine are also set with a lee disk powder measure as the measure is set for one cartridge,one measure on each head.I set the measure making sure the charge is right and never bother again to check it.
the LNL means you have to buy adapters for every die.I have progressives
3 and I have several single stage presses.as I load many cartridges.there are alot of things I dont do that others do.but I know what works and what does not.

 

[swampy]

EBAY...not so much a bargain

When I was buying equipment for my reloading classes (so that I can handle 4 students, each with their own press), I found that eBay had a BUNCH of cheap used machines. The press is only one of the tools that you will need for the process.

Reloading stuff on ebay is out of sight. Used die sets are selling for more than new ones at Natchez, FM Reloading, or Midway. New Lee dies for .380 acp have been selling between $70-$125. They are under $30 for new ones.

The Lee Challenger kit is a good starting kit. Even if you graduate to a progressive press later on there is always a need for a single stage press on the bench. I think the Challenger kit is still under $100. You get the press, scale, powder measure, priming tool, funnel etc. Add a set of dies and case cleaning set up, some components, reloading books, and your ready to start.

 

[graftyman]

As someone relatively new, I went for the Challenger Breech Lock kit. I've added the Lee AutoDisk powder measure. This allows me to combine the belling and powder throw into one stage on the press itself. I've found that with Win 231 powder it is pretty accurate. I've NEVER seen it through more than .1 grain off what I'm doing and if it does it's usually low. I personally go no where near the max loads and go up a bit from the bottom to give me a good target round and a long OAL. So the .1 swing that happens sometimes doesn't put me in overload or squibb territory.

The past few goes at it I have been doing batches of 200. I think I'm going to drop down to 100 as 200 gets pretty tiring after a while.

I separate my loading up into sessions. I'll decap, resize and prime in one session, then bell/powder, add the bullet and crimp in another. last night I pumped out 200 (bell/powder, bullet, crimp) in an hour.

It's a good set up, pretty cheap if you don't go crazy on other stuff. As a newbie I like seeing everything happening relatively slowly in front of me. I'm sure if I keep it up, I'll be looking to go progressive, but until then I'm very happy with what I'm doing.

Shot 75 of the them at lunch today. I have to say I'm more then impressed with the accuracy of my loads.

 

[Underwhere]

I took the plunge and went with a 650 right off the bat. Check my other thread regarding progressive pricing.

A very nice guy on the forum showed me the ropes as I read through the ABC's of reloading.

My first session alone I was able to understand what the press was doing and only fiddled with it a tiny bit.

My 2nd session I had it down pretty good

My 3rd session was a breeze.

My 4th session I changed calibers and still had no issues.

Of course, I have had questions along the way and people on this forum have helped me through them.

Personally, I think if you get a single stage press it would be useful for just a few loadings (if you're looking to make large quantity and not looking to make the perfect round every single time).

Otherwise go for a progressive. So long as you are somewhat good with understanding mechanics and how things operate you should be fine.

I would love to have a cheapo single stage press to do large quantities of rifle prep. You don't need to do that with most handgun rounds.

 

[little-doodie]

Single stage is very good to make test loads and prove out loads before setting a progerssive and pumping out 100s of rounds.
I started out single stage and once I got sick of spending alot of time reloading I bought progressive.
I still use the singe stage for some calibers that I don't shoot alot.
one thing about reloading... I can shoot faster than I can reload but its alot cheaper and more accurate.

 

[JimGiven]

I think you should take Duke's offer. You will learn a lot. Also +1 on the ABCs of Reloading...it is a great resource.

Jim

 

[bpm990d]

There is nothing that says you need to put dies in all the stations on a progressive.

I've had a Rock Chucker for about 20 years. If I had the money I would have got a progressive way back when.

That being said, you can load lots of ammo on a single stage if you don't mind trading time for money. You just do the operations in batches.

B

 

[Dirtypacman]

Set up my dillon 550 and after reading ABC's of Reloading, watching the intro video and doing my own research online I was up and running in under 2 hours. I also took 2 free classes up at Kittery Trading Post to help me understand things better. I load up about 2-3 hundred rounds in a session lasting anywhere from 45 minutes to 2 hours depending on different factors.

 

[DukeInFlorida]

We're trying to work out an arrangement with Cabelas in Scarborough to provide their customers with a free reloading oversight session (about 1 hour) by way of introducing them to reloading. In no way, shape, or form will we cover any of the important DETAILS, which really need to be covered in specific ways. It will be really more about helping Cabelas sell equipment. Our benefit will be that we will get to promote our reloading class. Trying to tie that together with a discount for people who buy equipment that day, and also sign up for a class. Corporate is not being cooperative at the moment. It's too much like any other big box store.

I also took 2 free classes up at Kittery Trading Post to help me understand things better.

 

[Underwhere]

I took a reloading class up at Kittery once. I don't think it helped me at all. I was expecting more hands on and possibly to even see a press being operated. Disappointed. Maybe their other classes are better.

 

[DukeInFlorida]

I've never attended any of Kittery's "free" classes. However, as one who teaches classes, and is working with Cabelas on the same subject, I will tell you that there's no way you can cover this subject SAFELY in some free one or two hour session. A little knowledge is a dangerous thing. I'm sure their insurance company would not want there to be any hands on, or in-depth anything during one of those. Those are intended to ONLY be an introduction to the idea of reloading. Most people are intimidated by the notion of it. And, perhaps they should be.

Like driving a car, it requires some instruction to be done safely. Or, scuba diving. I suppose I could come up with a bunch of other examples.

Someone said it somewhere: For me, reloading is a ZEN experience. When I am in my reloading "cave", I am "Bullet Boy", master of my universe. I don't take phone calls. Even my sweetie knows to minimize interruptions until I emerge, bullets in hand. It's my relaxation time. My zen time.

I took a reloading class up at Kittery once. I don't think it helped me at all. I was expecting more hands on and possibly to even see a press being operated. Disappointed. Maybe their other classes are better.

 

[Dirtypacman]

The two classes I took in KTP - were informative and helpful. I feel you get what you put into it. I had already read up on the subject, at length, and was prepared with questions for the instructor. I did get hands on time with a few different pieces of equipment and waited patiently for the end of the class to get some extra things discussed pertaining to more complex parts of reloading. Its a great starter (at no cost) when no other options exist.

 

[gerrycaruso]

I load on an old Dillon 450 and a 650. A few months ago I loaded 1200 rounds of 9mm in an hour on the 650, just to see how fast I could go. I don't recommend going that fast. If 400 rounds an hour is fast enough, get a 550. If you want to double that get the 650. I prefer Dillon because if you wear it out or break it, they replace it. They replace it even if you broke it through abuse,neglect or stupidity.