I got some brass from the brass trading thread on this site.. All was .223 but about 10 where 5.56. Now my understanding is they are the same but slighty different. I decided to full length size the cases even though they had been deprimed already. (just so I know they where sized) And had no problems at all using My RCBS Rock Chucker and RCBS full length decapping .223 die... My friend just full length/decapped some of his .223 and a few 5.56 brass but when he put the 5.56 brass in the decapping pin jammed in the flash hole.. Now the first one didn't jam real tight but the next 5.56 brass he did actually broke his decapping pin.. He has the same press and dies I do. My question is do you think he did something wrong or are the flash holes different sizes in .223 and 5.56. And if so how come I didn't run into any problems.. Also the ones i sized felt like they hadn't been sized..But i could be wrong... Any ideas? Anyone ever run into something like this??
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.223 - 5.56 the same.. or different?
- Thread starter MechanicBenjamin
- Start date
gerrycaruso
NES Member
I didn't know there was any berdan primed .223 brass until I found one at the range. Maybe your friend got one mixed in with his other brass. A berdan primed case would likely break his decapping pin if he pushed hard enough.
There was some new 5.56mm brass that was sold a few years ago that had slightly smaller flash holes. From what I read pretty good quality, and reasonably priced. I can't remember what it was though, Guatemalan maybe.
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Fixxah
NES Member
This thread was one of many with the info you need I believe. I found it relatively easily even though I am a rock and spear kind of guy. Read it and you should know much more about the answer to your question. Best of luck and welcome to the forum.http://www.northeastshooters.com/vbulletin/threads/25067-5.56-v.-223/page3?highlight=.223%2F5.56mm
If you look into other threads from around the same time period, Patriot (?) posted detailed cutout pics of the difference between the two cases.
If you look into other threads from around the same time period, Patriot (?) posted detailed cutout pics of the difference between the two cases.
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I very much dislike RCBS die sets because (as I tell my reloading students) they do not have any mechanism to allow for over pressure. Being an entirely screwed together primer knock out pin assembly, the pin usually bends or breaks where the sizing plug screws onto the upper threaded rod (when it bumps into anything which causes too much pressure).
Lee dies, and several other manufacturers, use a tightened collet to hold onto the pin. If that collet is adjusted properly (not too tight), then the pin will just slip through the collet if it bumps into an occasional berdan primer, or tight flash hole. You loosen the collet, slide the pin back into place, and retighten the collet (all without removing the die body from the press), and you're back in business. No harm done.
So, you have to be careful with your RCBS dies, and visually look inside every case. Also, your buddy should have kept a note (in his reloading log book), making mention of the specific manufacturer of that one piece, and be extra careful when dealing with other pieces of that brass in the future. If he didn't make mention of that in a log book, then he is destined to repeat the error.
Lee dies, and several other manufacturers, use a tightened collet to hold onto the pin. If that collet is adjusted properly (not too tight), then the pin will just slip through the collet if it bumps into an occasional berdan primer, or tight flash hole. You loosen the collet, slide the pin back into place, and retighten the collet (all without removing the die body from the press), and you're back in business. No harm done.
So, you have to be careful with your RCBS dies, and visually look inside every case. Also, your buddy should have kept a note (in his reloading log book), making mention of the specific manufacturer of that one piece, and be extra careful when dealing with other pieces of that brass in the future. If he didn't make mention of that in a log book, then he is destined to repeat the error.
not reloading metallic yet......but I would be warry of any non us manufactured ammo cases. It may not be corrossive BUT im sure they still use the berdan primers such as wolf. Duke good heads up on the dies. As I look into reloaders and equipment. Good to know
mac1911, are you the same guy (mac1911) that I see posting lots of shotgun discussions over at castboolits?
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Reloaders should always get in the habit of looking at, identifying, knowing, and making records of HEADSTAMPS that they are dealing with. Headstamps are the markings on the ends (primer end) of the cases. Every manufacturer uses a specific head stamp, and lots of info can be gleaned from them.
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Reloaders should always get in the habit of looking at, identifying, knowing, and making records of HEADSTAMPS that they are dealing with. Headstamps are the markings on the ends (primer end) of the cases. Every manufacturer uses a specific head stamp, and lots of info can be gleaned from them.
Good point gerrycaruso on the berdan primed cases.. I'll have to talk to my friend and look at some of his brass to see if he even noticed that. I believe the brass he was sizing/depriming was a lot of once fired brass he had just spent.. But I could be wrong, I'll have to get with him on this.. And believe me I'm goin make a note of his error/problem in my log book..
My RCBS dies punch straight through.
Wow, Kryptonite pins when you hit BERDAN primers?? They go right through???
You serious?
You serious?
Always makes sense to check for berdan-primed cases, especially when acquiring unknown/range brass. Use a good light source since the anvil depression often looks like the conventional boxer flash hole when glanced at quickly. You will find berdan-primed brass with one, two or three flash holes, as a rule. (I haven't seen four or more holes...yet!)
Regarding small diameter flash holes, I have come across this with HOTSHOT/Igman 6.5x55 cases. They'd pull the decap pin out of the die stem, but once drilled slightly larger (flash hole) they worked as advertised.
Oh.... .223 Rem. versus 5.56mm: Technically, the 5.56mm is loaded to slightly higher pressures, but don't ask me to quote the figures (a search for SAAMI data should be easy enough). There may be some case dimensional variations (mostly wall thickness), but this is certainly possible even among various commercial .223 cases, I suppose. You could seperate your brass by headstamp and do some case volume tests to satisfy your curiousity.
Regarding small diameter flash holes, I have come across this with HOTSHOT/Igman 6.5x55 cases. They'd pull the decap pin out of the die stem, but once drilled slightly larger (flash hole) they worked as advertised.
Oh.... .223 Rem. versus 5.56mm: Technically, the 5.56mm is loaded to slightly higher pressures, but don't ask me to quote the figures (a search for SAAMI data should be easy enough). There may be some case dimensional variations (mostly wall thickness), but this is certainly possible even among various commercial .223 cases, I suppose. You could seperate your brass by headstamp and do some case volume tests to satisfy your curiousity.
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Its Wyoming the State.. Little town of about 6,500 people
Wyoming is in the Midwest?
Did California finally slide off the map?
Did I miss the event?
Did California finally slide off the map?
Did I miss the event?
ochmude
Marine Veteran
I wish Cali sank, but It hasn't yet.
If it's not midwest, what would you call it?
I grew up calling it part of the "West". I grew up in the Midwest, and in 4th grade Geography we learned that the Midwest consisted of North Dakota, South Dakota, Nebraska, Kansas, Missouri, Iowa, Minnesota, Wisconsin, Michign, Illinois, Indiana, and Ohio.
ochmude
Marine Veteran
It's cool. We also spent at least at least a two months of my 5th grade history class learning exclusively about the life of John Deere. The curriculum definitely had a bit of a regional bias, lol.
I really like this site. One of the best I've seen of this type.. I visit atleast once a day if not more. Only bad thing is I live so far away from everyone else that if they wanna get rid of something and its face to face deal I have no choice but to pass..
