223 load development

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peterk123

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Any of you guys pushing your loads to 556 load data specs, or do you tend to stick to 223 max loads? I'm getting good accuracy out of mine and it seems to match the factory load I sometimes shoot but was wondering if pushing it further could yield even better results. I am still a half grain or so below the recommended levels for 223 as well.
 
Season 3 Nbc GIF by The Office
 
peterk123 said:
if pushing it further could yield even better results
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a usual answer will be no, but you can check with your brass and your barrel.
you will not be able to explode anything in .223 as barrel pressure limit is like 10x more than a max pressure a varget load can produce if you fill whole case to the top, then compress it down.
that is, of course is NOT that you should try doing. :)

try to load a ladder, and you will see that for a 70gr bullet something around 25gr of varget should give you an optimal node. the more you push it up speed wise, the more spread you will usually end up with, and brass will suffer. if your primers are getting flattened mad - back off with your loads, as you aint gaining anything.
here is my last outing result, with 70gr noslers and varget and #450 primers.
i made a similar ladder from 25.5 to 26gr for 69 SMK, but too lazy to get out to test it.
previous better slower node is at 24.8 - 24.7, so this one is whole grain up powder wise, i made those specifically for my shorter barrel ARs.

1735067408405.png
 
for comparison with the above, this is a sample of NON optimal spread, was 26.4 here. looks a bit different, yeah?
but, if it was a chest area of something movable, it would still get the job done.
1735067614582.png
 
paul73 said:
for comparison with the above, this is a sample of NON optimal spread, was 26.4 here. looks a bit different, yeah?
View attachment 948000
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Wow! Ya, that would stress me out 🙃

I'm not a tight as your first Pic, but I'm close. Every once in a while one of the bullets decides it wants to stray from the group by an inch or so. Likely it's me. I can hit an eight inch gong at 325 yards every time in the field with my current load though. Not exactly a huge challenge but I think that is acceptable for an AR. But it is fun trying to squeeze a bit more accuracy or if the thing. I have gotten to really enjoy this gun.
 
peterk123 said:
I'm using a 68gr bullet. The other thing I want to try is the 73gr bthp. I can seat that one to 2.25 so it will still feed.
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be ready to experiment more to find what works best.

69 smk is a pretty much standard bullet in this range, as it is cheap and works well. but i tend to like nosler rdf ones more now, as when you buy them blem - they are even cheaper than SMKs.

next is the 75gr hornady, it runs very well in my 1:8 twist barrels. same well as 77 smk, but i got those hornadies way cheaper forgot where, as i usually get 1k bulk, then test, then load them in a batch, if i like them. and quickly end up with way more ammo i would ever use. all fun in its own way.
 
peterk123 said:
Wow! Ya, that would stress me out 🙃

I'm not a tight as your first Pic, but I'm close. Every once in a while one of the bullets decides it wants to stray from the group by an inch or so. Likely it's me. I can hit an eight inch gong at 325 yards every time in the field with my current load though. Not exactly a huge challenge but I think that is acceptable for an AR. But it is fun trying to squeeze a bit more accuracy or if the thing. I have gotten to really enjoy this gun.
Click to expand...
first you do the ladder, sit them at max length mazagine allows, then assess results from ES/SD numbers and grouping wise. i usually load first ladder with .2gr powder steps, as it saves time.

so you choose a node or 2 from first set, then will play a bit with seating depths, if you want to fine tune it. none of my .223 guns are worth that tuning.

the deal is, when your ladder is almost 100 rounds long - you need to space out shots to make sure barrel is not getting overheated. none of this matters much for cheap guns, but for precision ones - it helps to put a temperature sticker on it, and ideally do all this fun in a bit colder conditions, so the barrel would be able to cool down.

with a can on it - it will be more problematic to keep temp down, so, you will see. :)

 
so, here are 2 more factual comparisons - hornadys go a bit faster, and grouping is comparable, but 77 noslers are still a bit better packed.
but do cost quite more. i did seat them deep, to the mag length. it was not supposed to work, really, but the result is below.
and 24.2 varget on 77gr bullet is a best node i could find, theoretically it may go up to 25.2 pressure wise, but nothing above 24 worked well at all.
1735068641373.png

1735068669704.png
 
peterk123 said:
Any of you guys pushing your loads to 556 load data specs, or do you tend to stick to 223 max loads? I'm getting good accuracy out of mine and it seems to match the factory load I sometimes shoot but was wondering if pushing it further could yield even better results. I am still a half grain or so below the recommended levels for 223 as well.
Click to expand...
There is a reloading forum
 
peterk123 said:
Any of you guys pushing your loads to 556 load data specs, or do you tend to stick to 223 max loads? I'm getting good accuracy out of mine and it seems to match the factory load I sometimes shoot but was wondering if pushing it further could yield even better results. I am still a half grain or so below the recommended levels for 223 as well.
Click to expand...
Do whatever you are comfortable doing. If you do it, go up slowly.

That being said, if you are getting the accuracy you want, there is no need to push to further, unless you are bored.

I dont reload .223, but once I went over the max for 6.5cm by mistake (reloading from memory rather than reading my notes - very stupid). Some cases ended up with expanded primer holes making them useless.

I don't know if that happens with .223, but it is something to consider.
 
Varget was the most accurate powder I have used. I forget the recipe but it is written with Sharpie on my bench. The rounds were for 55g and stupidly were used up years ago at the car shoots. They were loaded into Radway Green brass from the Manchester group buy.
Shortly after bass pro opened I bought a bunch of Hornady 223 from C-pher and that ammo would blow right through steel without issue.
 
If looking in the books, I usually start near the top, because that's where I want to be anyways; as fast as I can be while still being accurate.
I generally don't look in the books or online; I ask others that are shooting the same game as me what they are using. As a "for instance", when asked what they are using for 69 or 77 grain bullets with RE15, the answer is usually 24 or 24.5 grains. I don't know where that falls in load manuals. It's probably near the top, but nobody was complaining about popping primers. Was there likely a milder charge that yielded better accuracy? Probably, but we want the speed.
 
Use Reloader 15 or Varget. Ladder load 0.2gr increments from 24.0-25.5gr.

Start shooting from the bottom (24.0gr) and pick the first node you arrive at.

That ammo will shoot better than you 99% of the time. If you start being competitive, sort your brass.

If you get more competitive, get into the weeds with the old timers.

I bet 98% of AR owners can't shoot well enough to harness 24.0gr of Varget under a 69 or 77 SMK in sorted brass.
 
peterk123 said:
I'm using BL-C2 24.5 gr. I have a bunch of varget. Picked it up recently for 308, just in case I couldn't get my hands on 4895. Will have to try the varget.
Click to expand...
have fun. it is worth it.
real fun begins if you have 3+ of .223 long guns, and then you start looking at the recipe that works acceptably well on all of them.
 
I've never found the best .223 accuracy at max load or slightly above getting towards those max 5.56 loads. Sometimes I'll be close, but definitely not at the limit. Any time I tried a compressed load of Varget, it sucked for accuracy. YRMV

+1 for the Nosler CC or RDF. This a bolt gun? RDF's for sure. If an AR, the CC's (Custom Competition) will have a shorter 'jump' at mag length and might be more accurate.

I used to always use Varget for .223 but in the last couple years have migrated to Benchmark, which meters like water vs. the Varget which is a PITA in the small .223 case. One of my .223 uppers will shoot sub-half MOA and I have a couple more that are always sub-MOA. I'm doing some case prep to get there.
 
Most all of my .223 precision loads are well below max and show outstanding consistency. I do have one "hot" load for my competition service rifle shooting the 80gr SMK and Varget. I take extra precautions when running this load. I refrain from running "hot" loads unless I can't identify any lesser velocity nodes.
 

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