AK type rifle builds anyone done them?

Wildweasel

Wildweasel

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I am thinking of buying some parts kits and reciever blanks and putting one together. I am aware of the 922R restrictions (mass awb too) and will assemble the needed US parts. I have a lathe mill and press avalible to me. (along with other commen tools) if anyone in mass has a bending jig or special tools I could rent or borrow (but I am not asking for a free ride) or some advice on what to NOT do that would be a help.
 
The other problem is apparently the thugs at BATFE have instituted another
weird ban on parts kit imports. Granted, there are probably still plenty of
kits here, but the prices have gone up from where they used to be, I
believe.

-Mike
 
drgrant said:
The other problem is apparently the thugs at BATFE have instituted another
weird ban on parts kit imports. Granted, there are probably still plenty of
kits here, but the prices have gone up from where they used to be, I
believe.

-Mike
Click to expand...

parts kits (ROMAINIAN ) are currently avalible for around 100.00 from several sources.
 
I just recently completed two AK builds... Romanian "G" AKM and a Polish PKMKS (pinned underfolder).

Removing the barrel pin is a nightmare unless you have a hydraulic press and jigs (which I didn't have). Mushroomed the 1st pin using the BFH method (Big F**king Hammer). Eventually I gave up and went with a partial screw-build... everything is riveted except the 4 upper front trunnion holes.

7.62x39 on this forum has the jigs, etc. Perhaps you could shoot him an IM?
(I believe he's also the site owner or main admin on Gunco.net).

Personally speaking, you might be better off starting out building on a finished receiver. The NODAK/DCI ones are highly recommended.

http://www.nodakspud.com/page2.htm

The two I ordred from them were flawless.

The following websites have all the build info you need (if you haven't bookmarked them already).

http://gunsgutsandgod.com

http://pookieweb.dyndns.org:61129/AK/docs/construction/construction.htm
 
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drgrant said:
The other problem is apparently the thugs at BATFE have instituted another
weird ban on parts kit imports. Granted, there are probably still plenty of
kits here, but the prices have gone up from where they used to be, I
believe.

-Mike
Click to expand...

That's just for receivers and barrels. The import ban on both has been in place for a long time now (68 GCA, maybe?). Up until last year or so, the ban on barrels had been pretty much ignored, then someone in the ATF or gun grabbing community threw a monkey wrench into the works and ATF issued a letter stating that barrels could no longer be imported (importers with permits already pending were allowed to bring the goods in). Then BATF issued another directive stating that barrels could be imported, but only if they were to be used for firearms that would not be normally banned from importation (lot of good that does anyone).

There's a bill in Congress awaiting a final vote that would once again allow the importation of barrels. With only 6 weeks to go (and with the holidays coming up), it would be nice if it gets voted on and receives Bushs signature before the Dems take over.
 
LoginName said:
That's just for receivers and barrels. The import ban on both has been in place for a long time now (68 GCA, maybe?). Up until last year or so, the ban on barrels had been pretty much ignored, then someone in the ATF or gun grabbing community threw a monkey wrench into the works and ATF issued a letter stating that barrels could no longer be imported (importers with permits already pending were allowed to bring the goods in). Then BATF issued another directive stating that barrels could be imported, but only if they were to be used for firearms that would not be normally banned from importation (lot of good that does anyone).

There's a bill in Congress awaiting a final vote that would once again allow the importation of barrels. With only 6 weeks to go (and with the holidays coming up), it would be nice if it gets voted on and receives Bushs signature before the Dems take over.
Click to expand...

Yeah. Some sites still seem to have the cheap parts kits or they
squeaked more in, but frankly if the guillotine is going to come down, now is
a better time to buy these kits rather than later. Some sites are charging
like $179 for those kits, as well.

There is still an "end around" on barrels, though. Apparently barrels for
things like WASR-10 (the mag limited version) and Saigas will still be
importable. My guess would be that the price would still cost more
than the barrels salvaged from the demill kits. Most of the kits are
essentially trash from some foreign army. (I'm not demeaning the
quality of the parts, by any means... but the fact that theyre
someone's trash means that explains a large part of the really low
cost. Most of the "cost' incurred by the sellers is probably
importing and shipping the stuff here. The sources are probablly
something to the effect of a guy named Yevgeni that hasn't gotten
paid in 6 months, and would gladly trade in a pile of retired AKs for a
lifetime supply of real vodka. [grin]

-Mike
 
The current prices makes me wish I had bought an extra kit or two as in a few years the current supply will dry up pretty much for good.

As far as the quality goes, the kits I've gotten so far have been in very good to excellent shape. I paid a little more than I probably should have, but nonetheless I was satisfied with what I received.

Not all the kits are salvaged from service/duty weapons. The better ones come from stockpiled guns that were put into storage for the anticipated SHTF scenario.

I have a few more builds in mind (FAL, RPK and Dragunov), but finding any kits (let alone ones in decent shape), is getting much harder and more expensive.
 
here is my latest build almost complete...

Yugo m90a ...223 caliber, folding stock...

just need to test function fire and then refinish it...

223ak.JPG
 
The magazines for the Yugo m90a are the Yugo .223 magazines.

The kit came with one mag, and Ohio Rapid Fire got a shipment in, and also Centerfire Systems has them.

http://rapidfire.targetweb.net/cgi-...965494.7430*6q0fT6&p_id=02114&xm=on&ppinc=big

http://www.centerfiresystems.com/index.asp?PageAction=VIEWPROD&ProdID=886

The Kit I bought from Bocefus....great looking Kit, one of ther best AK kits I have received, and Bocefus is a great guy to buy from.

The receiver....NoDakSpud.....they are sold out for now, but there is a thread gathering names for interest in a 2nd build of these receivers...on AK47.net
 
I have been reading like crazy over at the ak files and falfiles. (have some of both coming. ) I will be bending flats so I am either going to rent a jig or buy one. (I am planning on a few AK types I want to make a bullpup out of one.... )
and it never hurts to have extra recievers around (LOL)
Thanks
 
This may be a noob statement and comment, but how much do you really save buying parts and investing the time into it? I mean I have seen people doing the same for 1911s and ARs and for the most part they invest way more into a piece that they can buy off the shelf pre-configured the same. As far as reliability, homebuilt as more likely to experience problems than commercially built ones.

No doubt the satisfaction and the cool factor of something you make yourself but I fail to see the return if the inevitable problems come up. I also see people dumping or dismantling the parts and recouping for a fraction of what they spent on it.
 
pj150 said:
This may be a noob statement and comment, but how much do you really save buying parts and investing the time into it? I mean I have seen people doing the same for 1911s and ARs and for the most part they invest way more into a piece that they can buy off the shelf pre-configured the same. As far as reliability, homebuilt as more likely to experience problems than commercially built ones.

No doubt the satisfaction and the cool factor of something you make yourself but I fail to see the return if the inevitable problems come up. I also see people dumping or dismantling the parts and recouping for a fraction of what they spent on it.
Click to expand...

Depends what you're comparing it to. A NIB WASR-10 is roughly $350.00. A used Polytech Legend can easily cost $1,200 or more.

(all $$$$ figures are approximate).

A builder can still get a decent Romanian "G" parts kits for about $100.00 - $125.00. Some of the Polish and Krinkov kits are twice that and more.

Unfortunately, many of these kits are starting to increase in cost due to a limited supply and the ATF directive banning most barrels from importation.

Stripped receivers... $80.00 - $100.00 or unbent flat... $15.00 - $20.00

US compliance parts kits... under $50.00

Misc (rivets, furniture refinishing, GunKote/MolyResin/DuraCoat)... $40.00 - $50.00

This doesn't include the costs of any needed tools or jigs which can vary from a 24" set of bolt cutters, drill bits, drill press, air brush, sand blaster to a 12 ton hydraulic press, spot welder and jigs for bending flats and crushing rivets.

Forgetting the tooling for a moment (except for the minimal requirements), one can easily build 2 - 3 AKs for the cost of 1 middle of the road AK and quite a few more when compared to the 1K and up ones.

One downside to rolling your own (at least as far as this state is concerned), is that they have to be built in a post-ban configuration... no bayonet lugs, folding stocks, muzzle brake has to be permanently attached, etc).

As far as problems go, sure there's the potential for some, but that's more the fault of the builder than the product.

Keep in mind, these are AK-47 builds we're talking about. They don't have to be in close tolerances, state-of-the-art or highly accurate. As long as they're built with a degree of safety, most of the problems can be cured or avoided.

The one thing I would avoid is kits with non-matching numbers (at the very least it's desirable to have the front trunnion, bolt and bolt carrier match).

Anyhow, your assessment about the cool factor and satisfaction is dead on (at least for me it is). It's a unique hobby that I find rewarding (FWIW, I'm one of those people that has to take everything apart at least once). By building my own I've learned way more about AKs than if I had simply bought one off the shelf (same for my AR-15 builds).

I lurk and post on a few of the AK related forums and there are builders out there that literately crank out these things a half dozen or more at a time.

I only have 2 builds under my belt that went painfully slow, but now that I have some experience and equipment, I expect any future projects to progress a lot faster (RPK, Krinkov, AMD-65, Dragunov).
 
Ya know the worst thing about reading about AK builds... Is somewhere out there some a**h*** is shaking his fist and pointing at the screen saying "First pipe bombs, now kids can look this stuff up and build machine guns!"
Can you imagine the complete shock and jaw drop when some ignorant anti gunner reads about building an AK at home.[shocked]
If they only knew the work and machining process, not to mention laws involved. I guess one could put it this way... That ain't yer Daddy's zip gun there Junior! [laugh]

Myself I'd like a build it workshop for NESrs. We could meet once a week and work on our own AK kits using the tools and knowledge of a builder. Probably the only way I'll ever get my lazy ass to build one.
Ya know, kinda like a scrapbook party your wife might have, only we'd be building AK47s.
I think I just heard Reilly, Kennedy, and a few others hit the floor from fainting.[thinking]
 
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Ok, I must admit, I did not fully understand what went into building one. I thought it was just buying the parts and then putting it together with perhaps a bit of tooling. I did not know how extensive these builds were.

Kinda like re-building a car. Some folks just buy parts off the shelf and bolt on, whereas others fabricate.

Actually if there was a AK build party I would love to join. Once a week for X number of weeks until complete and then a shoot off at the end. Should film it and make it a reality show.
 
Milsurps 4 Me said:
Ya know the worst thing about reading about AK builds... Is somewhere out there some a**h*** is shaking his fist and pointing at the screen saying "First pipe bombs, now kids can look this stuff up and build machine guns!"
Can you imagine the complete shock and jaw drop when some ignorant anti gunner reads about building an AK at home.[shocked]
If they only knew the work and machining process, not to mention laws involved. I guess one could put it this way... That ain't yer Daddy's zip gun there Junior! [laugh]

Myself I'd like a build it workshop for NESrs. We could meet once a week and work on our own AK kits using the tools and knowledge of a builder. Probably the only way I'll ever get my lazy ass to build one.
Ya know, kinda like a scrapbook party your wife might have, only we'd be building AK47s.
I think I just heard Reilly, Kennedy, and a few others hit the floor from fainting.[thinking]
Click to expand...

Build party's are actually quite common amongst the AK circle of firearms enthusiasts.

If I had the equipment and space I'd host something like that as a primo NES gathering... complete with barbecue, beer and balloons for the kiddies! [smile]
 
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When NES first got started, there was someone who was about to outfit a machine shop and offered to help anyone do a group build. IIRC he was in one of the Northern "free" States. Don't remember who it was or what happened, but nothing further in the past year IIRC.
 
Hey at least I got some conversation started on the subject. I have hosted Fab-fests when I was big into the 4wd scene but the rifle building brings more liability issues so I am reluctant to do so. For close friends maybe but for joe smoe? not so sure.
 
LenS said:
When NES first got started, there was someone who was about to outfit a machine shop and offered to help anyone do a group build. IIRC he was in one of the Northern "free" States. Don't remember who it was or what happened, but nothing further in the past year IIRC.
Click to expand...

Was it this guy?

http://www.ktordnance.com/kto/products.php

He used to have a shop somewhere in NH and he hosted build parties using 80% 1911 and AR-15 frames/receivers.

I almost made the trip up there back before 1911s became MA legal.

Last I remember reading he was living in Montana and having serious legal "issues" with the BATF.
 
pj150 said:
Ok, I must admit, I did not fully understand what went into building one. I thought it was just buying the parts and then putting it together with perhaps a bit of tooling. I did not know how extensive these builds were.

Kinda like re-building a car. Some folks just buy parts off the shelf and bolt on, whereas others fabricate.

Actually if there was a AK build party I would love to join. Once a week for X number of weeks until complete and then a shoot off at the end. Should film it and make it a reality show.
Click to expand...

Actually, it's not nearly that complicated at all... that's part of the genius of the AK design. It pretty much is just putting parts together (just not as easy as buying off-the-shelf parts for building an AR-15).

The hardest/most time consuming part is de-milling the parts kit (one gets to appreciate and observe just how rugged and solid an AK is). For some, there's the inevitable problems such as
pressing out the barrel pin and/or barrel.

Once one has the proper tools, putting everything together is fairly simple and straight forward.

The only part that requires fabrication and a degree of skill (if one decides to take this route), is bending the receiver flat and spot welding in the guide rails.

I don't know with any certainty, but from what I've read from some builders is that most of the screw-ups are the result of rushing things or taking short-cuts. Seems like drilling holes off-center and/or snapping off drill bits is a common problem. Then there's the guys who neglect or forget to install things like the safety/selector stop or disconnector spring.

As far as the build parties go, I believe they're a one day thing. It probably helps a great deal if the people involved have all the parts and materials they need on hand and prep work done beforehand (de-greasing all the parts and refinishing the furniture for example).

Here's one example of what's involved (takes awhile for the site to load)...

http://www.ar15club.com/ak/index.html
 
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LoginName said:
Was it this guy?

http://www.ktordnance.com/kto/products.php

He used to have a shop somewhere in NH and he hosted build parties using 80% 1911 and AR-15 frames/receivers.

I almost made the trip up there back before 1911s became MA legal.

Last I remember reading he was living in Montana and having serious legal "issues" with the BATF.
Click to expand...

I thought that the guy I was referring to was in NH and moving to VT. I recall him inviting us "once he got the machine shop setup" to his place for a build party. It wasn't as far away as MT, that I'm sure of.

Yes with the BATF troubles, I can understand serious reluctance to host others. Better not to spend $25K+ defending yourself against helping folks save a few hundred building a rifle.
 
LenS said:
I thought that the guy I was referring to was in NH and moving to VT. I recall him inviting us "once he got the machine shop setup" to his place for a build party. It wasn't as far away as MT, that I'm sure of.

Yes with the BATF troubles, I can understand serious reluctance to host others. Better not to spend $25K+ defending yourself against helping folks save a few hundred building a rifle.
Click to expand...

Probably not the same guy then (Rick Celata). His shop was originally in Sanbornville, NH. I have no idea when he relocated his business to MT.

His legal problems are suspect to say the least (The BATF had some shaky grounds to build their case on, but it's not like that's never stopped them before). However, the guy did walk a fine line and tended to attract a bit of attention. For his 1911 build parties the builder/owner would purchase the 80% frame from him, he'd set it up on the milling machine (to make the slide cuts), and the owner would hit the start button. Sounds legal enough (at least to me anyways), but it's also the kind of thing that a judge could easily disagree with.
 
back on topic I think I have all my ducks in a row and hope to get going on at least one of the builds this weekend after building some tooling I will need. (minimal thankfully mostly for doing the rivits.) I have the 922r parts and should be ready to go. the kits I got are in decent shape bores exallent but there is a little bit of rust in a few places. but still not bad. (they where 98.00 ea after shipping and with compliance parts and the reciever flats about 160.00 ea so far.
 

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