barrel size, caliber, accuracy, mini-14....... help.

[Signa427]

I had a hard time finding a topic for this thread, so heres whats up:
-Im thinking about the mini 14, but its accuracy concerns me. (3 MOA at 100yds / )
-The mini 30 is a mini 14 varient that shoots a 7.62x39mm bullet of opposed to a .223
-Im wondering if the larger caliber would shoot a better group.

The mini 14 has a thinner barrel than an AR-15, but fires the same bullet. Im thinking that the thinner barrel contributes to the inaccuracy of the firearm (compared to an AR-15). Im not sure of the barrel width of the mini-30, but im sure the Outer diameter to inner diameter ratio will be the same. With than in mind, would the 7.62x39mm be more accurate than the .223 varient?

Why do i want a mini 14?

-I want a fun to shoot firearm that is chambered in a light, inexpensive load that can also serve in a tactical situation if need be. What i would do with the gun for home defence or other tactical use is another story. (I know the gun isnt the most adaptable to optics and such)

Just because the firearm shoots 3 MOA at 100 yards doesnt mean that I wont buy it, Im just wondering if the 7.62 version will shoot more accurately than the .223 version. I would like to be able to hit a coke can at 100 yards, EVERY TIME!

Im still leaning towards the .223 because it wont Jar my cheap optics around and may create less barrel wobble than the 7.62 varient. Im still asking because, admitingly, im not very expirienced in this particular area. I know that the action and the rifling have more of an effect on its accuracy than the diameter of the barrel, my question is more on caliber diffirences and weather thoes diffirences matter if the barrel wobble is a problem.

Please note, im talking about the most recent of the mini-14's, not the 1990's ones.

 

[seanc]

IMO.. Niether the mini 14 or 30 are known for accuracy. They are kind of neat guns. But, (again IMO) unspectacular from any standpoint. They are not extremely accurate, they are a pain to break down, overly complex, lots of parts. Use Only Ruger mags (which up to recently had been hard to find) and any Hi caps you are likely to find at a decent price will be post ban and Mass NON OK.

I don't believe the Minis are exempt from the AWB, So, I believe a new gun will not be available with a folding stock (in Mass).

AKs And ARs are plentiful and cheap.. IMO your money would be better spent on one of those.. But, if you are an A-TEAM fan.. nothing but a mini will do..

 

[LoginName]

The thinner barrel and accuracy problems have always plagued Mini's.

There are heavier aftermarket barrels available, but IMHO, considering the rifle it's going on, the expense isn't justified.

 

[Signa427]

IMO.. Niether the mini 14 or 30 are known for accuracy. They are kind of neat guns. But, (again IMO) unspectacular from any standpoint. They are not extremely accurate, they are a pain to break down, overly complex, lots of parts. Use Only Ruger mags (which up to recently had been hard to find) and any Hi caps you are likely to find at a decent price will be post ban and Mass NON OK.

I don't believe the Minis are exempt from the AWB, So, I believe a new gun will not be available with a folding stock (in Mass).

AKs And ARs are plentiful and cheap.. IMO your money would be better spent on one of those.. But, if you are an A-TEAM fan.. nothing but a mini will do..

Does this even count as an answer to my question? No, its your opinion, which was not asked for. In my opinion, the mini's are easy to break down, and cheaper than a good AR. They are reliable and fun to shoot.

ALSO, why would you say ruger mags are the only ones that work? The mini-14 takes its own kind of mag, meaning if anybody wanted to manufacture a magazine they would have to make it to fit and feed in the gun.

 

[seanc]

I had a hard time finding a topic for this thread, so heres whats up:
-Im thinking about the mini 14, but its accuracy concerns me. (3 MOA at 100yds / )

I would like to be able to hit a coke can at 100 yards, EVERY TIME!

You have already answered your own question..
A coke can is 2.5" wide by 4.75". Technically, you can be on target every time and miss due to the 3" moa spec.

To have hi cap mags in mass, you would need to round up pre 1994 AWB mags or you would be committing a felony.

While there were some 3rd party mags out there, they were notorious for being absolute crap. Ruger mags were always extremely hard to get and expensive (for the most part Ruger only marketed these to LEO and not to civilians).

New mini 14s retail in the 700-800 range. That is well within the price range of a good AK or AR.

 

[PatMcD]

"With than in mind, would the 7.62x39mm be more accurate than the .223 varient?"

NO

" I would like to be able to hit a coke can at 100 yards, EVERY TIME!"

You won't

Those aren't opinions

 

[TNHunter]

Answers:
Fun? yes.
Accurate? No.
Reliable? Mini 14 with factory mags OK. Mini 30 with factory mag and modern hunting ammo OK. Surplus or cheap surplus type ammo not so good. A heavier hammer spring will help a lot but not all.

 

[rlee]

Does this even count as an answer to my question? No, its your opinion, which was not asked for. ...

This is a gun forum.
You asked about 2 specific calibers using 2 specific guns.
Whether you want them or not, you're gonna get opinions.

 

[wolf223]

the only "good" thing about a mini 14 is that it's FID friendly. i got one for my dad and he loves it.


PS: buy em in NH. way cheaper than MA!

 

[Jasper]

if you found a mini14 or mini30 that'll hold 3MOA, you found a good one.

 

[TNHunter]

if you found a mini14 or mini30 that'll hold 3MOA, you found a good one.

For sure! If I can keep 10 rounds from my Mini 30 in a 6 inch target I consider that a good group.

 

[Signa427]

Thats disapointing, however i do all my shooting in vermont at my camp. So i dont care too much about mag regulations or any of that crap. I really just want something thats fun to shoot that i can run shooting drills with and such.

 

[Jasper]

then a mini14 will be fine for you. "running drills" is on the same lines as "plinking". IPSC/IDPA target's A-zones are are like 8MOA...more than capable for a mini14 assuming you do your part. somehow i have a feeling most of your drills will be 5-100yds, tops (most people dont blast away at much farther distances)

if you want MOA or better, get an AR.

 

[Burgermeister]

Why not buy an entry-level AR? You can get a Stag or M&P 15 at Four Seasons for $800. You might have fun running shooting drills with either of those and mags are easy to find.

 

[EddieCoyle]

I've had a Mini-30 and two Mini-14s. I think 3MOA is a best case. One of my Mini-14's best groups were 8" at 100 yards.

+1 on the mags. I never did find an aftermarket one that worked.

 

[atmay]

An AR with a Spikes, BCM or LMT upper, and your choice of lower will only cost you a little more than a Mini. You'll get something that:

1) Is WAY more accurate
2) Takes cheaper, easier to find magazines
3) Is easier to work on, with more easily available parts
4) If you decide you don't like something about it, it can be changed.

 

[Cooter Brown]

http://www.accu-strut.com/

 

[EddieCoyle]

http://www.accu-strut.com/

I thought about getting one of those when I had a Mini, but spending another $95 put's you into AR territory price-wise, and it claims to give you only a 33% increase in accuracy. At best I would've ended up with a 2 MOA rifle.

 

[seanc]

http://www.accu-strut.com/

But, but but.... it says "SOCOM" on it.. So it must be good! As used by SEALS everywhere!!! Right?

 

[Signa427]

Dont get me wrong, i love AR's. But im kinda getting sick of them, i recently fell in love with the new SCAR 16s, which is in the 1000-1500 range and is well worht the extra money. According to FN, it shoots match grade ammo in sub-moa groups at 100yards. 0.0

 

[seanc]

Dont get me wrong, i love AR's. But im kinda getting sick of them, i recently fell in love with the new SCAR 16s, which is in the 1000-1500 range and is well worht the extra money. According to FN, it shoots match grade ammo in sub-moa groups at 100yards. 0.0

if you want a mini 14.. buy it..
If you really want a sub MOA gun, the best solution is a decent bolt action with the best scope you can afford and match grade ammo.
I am skeptical of the scar claims..

 

[Jose]

According to FN, it shoots match grade ammo in sub-moa groups at 100yards. 0.0

I'll believe that when I see a target.

 

[Signa427]

I'll believe that when I see a target.

i know really, even if it shoots 1 - 2 MOA at 100 yards with surplus ammo, ill be more than happy.

 

[drgrant]

Dont get me wrong, i love AR's. But im kinda getting sick of them

Buy/Build a really good one instead of the typical gun store trash, and you won't be sick of it. Not to mention to get a SCAR legal in MA, you have to completely f**k up the gun to make it legal... why butcher an innocent rifle?

-Mike

 

[Jose]

i know really, even if it shoots 1 - 2 MOA at 100 yards with surplus ammo, ill be more than happy.

Military ammo will rarely shoot better than 2 - 3 MOA even in accurized rifles.

 

[Cooter Brown]

I'm a fan of the Mini in its own right, not as an "AR alternative", which it isn't. No tacti-cool stocks or that kind of crap, but I do want it to perform up to its potential.

The accu-strut (or similar barrel struts) claims up to 33% improvement on initial accuracy, but the big benefit comes when you run the Mini hard (like in a 2 day defensive rifle class) where it minimizes barrel warp and keeps a "minute of pie plate" gun from becoming a "minute of broad side of the barn" gun.

 

[Signa427]

Buy/Build a really good one instead of the typical gun store trash, and you won't be sick of it. Not to mention to get a SCAR legal in MA, you have to completely f**k up the gun to make it legal... why butcher an innocent rifle?

-Mike

The gun would stay in vermont, so im not concerned with dumb massacusettes laws concerning "assault" rifles. Im probobly going to look into it much more because its diffirent and it seems to fit me better than AR's.

 

[highlander]

One thing that hasn't been addressed here,the Mini 14 mags are expencive as compared to your run of the mill ar mag. Another question are you planning to leave your Mini in Vt or bring it back here? Assuming you use your camp during the summer/fall season.do you really want to leave it at your camp on the off season and take the chance that someone may break into your camp and steal your rifle? It has been known to happemn.

 

[Jasper]

The gun would stay in vermont, so im not concerned with dumb massacusettes laws concerning "assault" rifles. Im probobly going to look into it much more because its diffirent and it seems to fit me better than AR's.

ive shot a SCAR

i was *not* impressed.

once again, its like most carbine-sized ARs...it's a 2-3MOA gun on most everything you'll feed it...which is fine, seeing as 99.999% of targets you'll ever shoot at have 2+MOA sized 10rings.

if you want MOA or better, you're going to be spending a grand+ on an AR (with a 18+" heavy barrel), and the better choice is going to be a bolt action. now, will SOME 16" AR's shoot sub MOA. maybe...certainly not with surplus ammo, and it certainly isnt the norm.

if ya dont believe me, buy whatever tacticool plinker you have your heart set on, and blast away. if you shoot a 10shot group, im sure at least 3 will be "subMOA", and we can just call the other 7 "fliers".

I average somewhere between 7-10,000 rounds a year down the tube on various target rifles (it's what I live for)...be it 100yd smallbore prone, 200/300/600yd XTC competition, 300/500/600 midrange prone, or starting this year, 800/900/1000yd longrange. I DO know what i'm talking about as far as accurized rifles go, however, and I know what *usually* has to be spent and done in order to shoot MOA or better all day. believe me...i've got thousands upon thousands of dollars invested in target rifles....if there was a cheap way to shoot sub MOA, most of us would have done it already


oh yea, and ammo. forgot about that. shooting .223? surplus is around...what, $.15-.20 a round?

you want MOA or better? hope ya reload....cause even reloading, it's $.35-$1.00+ a round for some of the stuff I shoot thats "Sub MOA" ammo. .223 i've REALLY optimized, and buy bulk as far as bullets (Sierra matchkings) and whatnot...and those are still ~$.28c a round

 

[drgrant]

The gun would stay in vermont, so im not concerned with dumb massacusettes laws concerning "assault" rifles.

Have fun getting a gun dealer to violate (the rather nonsensical) federal law. Course some will, some won't. (There is a chunk of US code that prevents them from selling you something if owning the gun isn't legal in your state of residency). You're better off doing an AR build if you're going to keep it out of state, in that case it wouldn't apply and you can build whatever you want.

-Mike