Carrying while hunting is illegal, right?

MisterHappy said:
... If you're in the woods, with a handgun, you're presumed to be hunting with it. Like having slug or buckshot rounds with you when you're pheasant hunting. Or, having a combo gun (shotgun/rifle) - even if you have no ammo for the rifle. ...
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Wait, I thought it was PRESUMED INNOCENT until proven GUILTY! What happened to that?


HorizontalHunter said:
Typical Massachusetts law. When studied to try an figure out the answer all you can come up with is a semi-definite maybe.[banghead]
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There is no norm in Massachusetts law. I wish they would go back to the Constitutions, both U.S., and Massachusetts.
 
Coyote33 said:
Wait, I thought it was PRESUMED INNOCENT until proven GUILTY! What happened to that?




There is no norm in Massachusetts law. I wish they would go back to the Constitutions, both U.S., and Massachusetts.
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You are presumed to be innocent, in the courtroom.

If you're having a discussion with an EPO in the woods about your sidearm during shotgun deer season, s/he'll cite you, because s/he presumes that you're hunting with the handgun.

When you talk to the Judge, you can convince them that you weren't.

Not trying to be a dick, but this is the consistent attitude/opinion from the assorted EPOs that have presented to the Hunter Ed classes that I've taught.

Now, the EPOs know that there's some seriously foncused language in the MGLs and regs (such as the prohibition of the possession of buckshot anywhere that mammals may be found [rolleyes] , after all, people in the gun store are mammals), but the sidearm-during-deer season tends to irritate them.

Cite:
http://www.eregulations.com/massachusetts/huntingandfishing/hunting-prohibitions/
 
Is retrieving your deer considered an act of hunting? Let's say during archery season you shoot a deer, return to your vehicle with your bow and arrows. Can you then ccw to track and retrieve your deer? Where I hunt there are many coyotes and possible bear in the area. Maybe the best solution is to carry bear mace to play it safe.
 
Keep your bow ready for a follow up shot. If you check in with a bow kill which also has a bullet hole, it may raise suspicion.
 
I asked the question in my hunter safety class and the cop told me that only the device that was legal for the intended game that I was hunting and season could be carried. I got more specific and he told me that I could not carry a handgun while deer hunting in shotgun season.
 
Fixxah said:
Keep your bow ready for a follow up shot. If you check in with a bow kill which also has a bullet hole, it may raise suspicion.
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That's a shame. Dispatching a wounded animal with a pistol shot to the head is a common method in more reasonable states.
A friend only crippled a deer and had to dispatch it with his 30-06. There was hardly enough left of the skull to meet the state's requirements at the inspection station.
 
robjax said:
I asked the question in my hunter safety class and the cop told me that only the device that was legal for the intended game that I was hunting and season could be carried. I got more specific and he told me that I could not carry a handgun while deer hunting in shotgun season.
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Ding ding ding winner. This is the point of the law. "Hunting" is not the actual act of shooting. Which means if you are innna field on wma land that is stocked with pheasant and have a handgun and a shotgun on you....are you hunting with the handgun or the shotgun? I know....i know....to us it is obvious but it is actually meant to make the boys kn greens job easier. The hunting section of nes had a post a couple days ago about a dude on pheasant stockes land walking around with nithing but an open carried handgun. Lets just say he had a bad day with the warden.
 
whacko said:
Ding ding ding winner. This is the point of the law. "Hunting" is not the actual act of shooting. Which means if you are innna field on wma land that is stocked with pheasant and have a handgun and a shotgun on you....are you hunting with the handgun or the shotgun? I know....i know....to us it is obvious but it is actually meant to make the boys kn greens job easier. The hunting section of nes had a post a couple days ago about a dude on pheasant stockes land walking around with nithing but an open carried handgun. Lets just say he had a bad day with the warden.
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Just an FYI I don't believe this is the case in NH or Maine. My entire life myself and my whole family have carried side arms and never had an issue with wardens.
 
such as the prohibition of the possession of buckshot anywhere that mammals may be found [rolleyes] , after all, people in the gun store are mammal
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No, because the preamble to the section of MGL that mentions "where birds and mammals may be found" contains a specific definition of mammal that does not include humans.
 
schemingbunny said:
What's the penalty if caught by an EPO for having a handgun on you?
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Probably whAtever the fine is for hunting with the wrong impliment. Not talking about illegal posession of a fire arm here.....just hunting with the wrong fire arm.
 
whacko said:
Probably whAtever the fine is for hunting with the wrong impliment. Not talking about illegal posession of a fire arm here.....just hunting with the wrong fire arm.
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That being the case, rather chance having to pay the fine than risk not having the right tool to defend myself.
 
schemingbunny said:
That being the case, rather chance having to pay the fine than risk not having the right tool to defend myself.
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Be careful. IIRC any conviction for a crime that involves a gun that COULD result in a jail sentence is a lifetime DQ in MA. I've been told by my EPO contact that ALL hunting laws have the potential for a jail sentence even though very rarely does anyone go to jail.
 
Len-2A Training said:
Be careful. IIRC any conviction for a crime that involves a gun that COULD result in a jail sentence is a lifetime DQ in MA. I've been told by my EPO contact that ALL hunting laws have the potential for a jail sentence even though very rarely does anyone go to jail.
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Well what is the actual MGL and punishment?

When I read M.G.L. c. 131, §§ 67 & 70, neither specifies a punishment, they merely proscribe. ie They just say "a person shall not" without a stated penalty.
 
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Shotgun Scully said:
Wouldn't there have to be irrefutable proof the handgun was fired in the act of hunting?
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the way it was explained to me just having the handgun with you is the crime. Not firing it. And to clarify this was in Mass. I noticed some others talking about NH and ME so I apologize and hope I didn't cause any confusion.
 
Shotgun Scully said:
Wouldn't there have to be irrefutable proof the handgun was fired in the act of hunting?
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Not according to the game warden at my course. He explained it to me this way.......if you are using a regular rod and reel in a lake that is "fly fishing only"........and you have not caught a fish are you fishing with the wrong equipment. YES YOU ARE.

Now......if you are walking through the woods with a handgun and an orange vest on a wma stocked with pheasant (shotgun only for any game on wma stocked land) are you hunting with a handgun? YES YOU ARE!


Hunting is not the act of shooting just as fishing is not the act of putting a hook in a fish's lip. That is how it was explained to me by the boy in green anyway.
 
Suppressor said:
Screw Massachusetts. Don't hunt here.
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Plenty of game in Massachusetts to hunt. I'm less worried about needing a ccw gun on my hip in the woods than walking around the street.......especially as I am already carrying a shotgun loaded with #4 high brass. That shit may not kill a coyote or bear.......but either will be damn sorry it messed around with me. The rule in mass is set up as a way to be sure there is no question about hunters obeying the implement rules for the game they are hunting. No biggie in my opinion.
 
robjax said:
the way it was explained to me just having the handgun with you is the crime. Not firing it. And to clarify this was in Mass. I noticed some others talking about NH and ME so I apologize and hope I didn't cause any confusion.
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I don't believe it is a crime though.......we are talking about implement rules for the game you are after not illegal possession of a fire arm. Again......the epo explained it to me that way.......but again......they may not all be 100% on the regs.
 
sig shooter said:
How about using a handgun to hunt coyote on a non pheasant stock WMA or other hunting land? Would be legal then correct?

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Yes

Coyote & Fox

Hunting hours begin ½ hour before sunrise and end at midnight, except 1) on WMAs stocked with pheasant or quail during the pheasant and quail season when hunting hours begin at sunrise and end at sunset and, 2) when hunting coyote during the shotgun deer season (see below). Coyote and fox may be hunted with shotguns, muzzleloaders, and archery, as well as rifles and handguns with special nighttime restrictions (see Hunting Prohibitions). Coyotes may be hunted with shotguns using numbered or lettered birdshot (≤ 0.230 inch pellet diameter; up to FF), except during the shotgun deer season (see below). Fox may be hunted with numbered birdshot only (≤ 0.160 inch pellet diameter). It is legal to hunt coyote and fox using bait, decoys, electronic or manual calls, and dogs. Artificial lights are prohibited. Coyote and fox pelts/carcasses must be checked/reported within 4 working days of the end of the season by either 1) checking them at an official check station (see Trapping), or 2) reporting them online and writing the harvest confirmation number on a tag of your own making, then attaching the tag to the carcass or pelt (see Trapping for details). Confirmation numbers must remain attached to all pelts/carcasses, with the specific confirmation number issued for each particular pelt or carcass, until the carcass is prepared for mounting by a taxidermist, or the pelt is sold or tanned.

http://www.eregulations.com/massachusetts/huntingandfishing/furbearers/
 
sig shooter said:
How about using a handgun to hunt coyote on a non pheasant stock WMA or other hunting land? Would be legal then correct?

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as long as you abide by the regs below sure. Just stay off wma stocked with pheasant during pheasant season.....and you abide by the caliber rules. One other thing....during shotgun deer season rifles and handguns are prohibited. You definately have to pay attention to the rules in mass.

You guys pissing and moaning about the handgun reatriction.....it is a safety issue and there for good reason. The wma land stocked with pheasant are packed with hunters and dogs.....that is the reason it is shotgun and archery only during pheasant season on that land.



http://www.eregulations.com/massachusetts/huntingandfishing/furbearers/
 
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whacko said:
I don't believe it is a crime though.......we are talking about implement rules for the game you are after not illegal possession of a fire arm. Again......the epo explained it to me that way.......but again......they may not all be 100% on the regs.
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So you would say maybe they fine you and probably revoke your hunting license? And then what, they notify your chief and he potentially pulls your ticket? So no jail time perse' but still punished...
 
sig shooter said:
Is the caliber restriction only at night?

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You hAve to read the regs yourself my friend. Hunting requires a great deal of reaearch.

- - - Updated - - -

robjax said:
So you would say maybe they fine you and probably revoke your hunting license? And then what, they notify your chief and he potentially pulls your ticket? So no jail time perse' but still punished...
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As per any thing to do with your ltc in mass.....your chief can say you are unsuitable for almost any reason and pull your ltc. Will your chief do it for a fine for hunting with a reatricted impliment?!? Im not gonna find out.
 

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