Co-witness No-witness. Are iron sights needed?

[kalash]

Obviously I line up the sights with my dominant eye.

 

[GlockBy]

Obviously I line up the sights with my dominant eye.

Or maybe you think you do?

Seriously, don't dismiss this right away. If you never tried it - pretend your other eye is dominant and run a few sessions that way, eventually trying to keep the other one open?

I just tried few transitions with irons starting with non dom eye sight picture on first target- result is "scramble" indeed. At destination index is somewhat on second target, but neither eye have the sight picture, need to tilt the head left or right.

 

[Point&Shoot]

I’ve sorted through the chaff and I’m going with a 1/3 co witness but if you’ll humor me FOR just one maybe two more quickies. Firstly.. Do youse guys put the new irons forward of the optic or behind? That never even occurred to me so I’m wondering if there’s a given. Secondly.. If I get the G34 milled for a 507c and find I don’t like it for some reason are there adapter plates that would let me mount something with an RMR footprint or would I just be out of luck and HAVE to get a new firearm. Sorry for asking so many questions but thanks for your tolerance.

 

[frenchman]

If it’s a carry gun, iron sights are a must. For a plinking/competition/range gun, do or don’t. A lesser ranking in a competition won’t kill you, a mugger might.

 

[GlockBy]

I’ve sorted through the chaff and I’m going with a 1/3 co witness but if you’ll humor me FOR just one maybe two more quickies. Firstly.. Do youse guys put the new irons forward of the optic or behind? That never even occurred to me so I’m wondering if there’s a given. Secondly.. If I get the G34 milled for a 507c and find I don’t like it for some reason are there adapter plates that would let me mount something with an RMR footprint or would I just be out of luck and HAVE to get a new firearm. Sorry for asking so many questions but thanks for your tolerance.

There is a small benefit to front of optic iron cut I have not considered before this thread (thanks for this btw) - in the extreme "just right wrong" positions you might still see the dot vs it being blocked by the rear in the traditional spot. That said, I would probably still choose traditional placement for the rear with low enough cowitness. Habit, plus if you decide to move the RDS to another gun and run irons only or sell it - it will make things easier. But this would be your personal preference.

Do you have the optic already? Is it 507c or 507 Comp? If you did not buy it yet and thinking about 507c, I would spend the extra few bucks saved on rear sight relocation towards stepping up to an enclosed Holosun EPS or 507 Comp if range/game only gun. If you staying with 507c plan, they do make adapter plates to different footprints. At least RMR to EPS exists for sure. But try to get it right on the first attempt, as tight optic specific cut is probably the best way to secure a RDS. Adapter plates add height and more tolerance stacking.

 

[jkelly1229]

Shield red dot? Yeah. Good luck with that.

Turrible

 

[jkelly1229]

conventional sights don't "point" the same as a dot sight. when you run a dot the problem you need to train out is finding the dot. you shoot with both eyes open and 'lower' the dot onto the target. you need to train target transitions without reverting to the old habit of looking at your front sight post with one eye. you target transition with both eyes open, sweeping your field of view and settling the dot on the target without closing one eye and without looking at the front sight. its hard to do perfectly every time. you make mistakes, catch yourself looking for the dot or closing one eye, or pulling your focus closer to your front sight.

the difference in height between the dot and the front sight is really irrelevant because they require two completely different techniques. Transitioning from one to the other is easy enough.

Get an acss holosun

They have a circle on the outer edges that helps correct very quickly

Even if you run other optics you prefer it def helps your transition from irons to optics

 

[P51MA]

I'm assuming this slide has factory iron sights. In which case, they will mill the slide for the optic just forward of the rear sight. Remove the "iron" sights and replace them with suppressor height sights to co-witness.

This is what I do. I like the Trijicon blacked out rear sight + white tritium front sight, personally.

I don't think you really need backup sights, and honestly I only install them because it looks nice. Maybe I'll need them someday, I doubt it though.

If you install sights you'll probably need to spend ~$40 or whatever a decent sight pusher goes for these days. Sometimes you can tap them in without it, but it's nice to have anyways.

 

[P51MA]

There is a small benefit to front of optic iron cut I have not considered before this thread (thanks for this btw) - in the extreme "just right wrong" positions you might still see the dot vs it being blocked by the rear in the traditional spot. That said, I would probably still choose traditional placement for the rear with low enough cowitness. Habit, plus if you decide to move the RDS to another gun and run irons only or sell it - it will make things easier. But this would be your personal preference.

Do you have the optic already? Is it 507c or 507 Comp? If you did not buy it yet and thinking about 507c, I would spend the extra few bucks saved on rear sight relocation towards stepping up to an enclosed Holosun EPS or 507 Comp if range/game only gun. If you staying with 507c plan, they do make adapter plates to different footprints. At least RMR to EPS exists for sure. But try to get it right on the first attempt, as tight optic specific cut is probably the best way to secure a RDS. Adapter plates add height and more tolerance stacking.

The downside to the 407/507 is that it is sort of "deep" if that makes sense, so it can accumulate a ton of dust, lint, body hair, and everything else imaginable. This is much worse if you carry IWB, and doubly worse if you carry directly up against the skin.

The SCS, rmr, etc will also accumulate some debris, but are easier to wipe off the glass.

Moving to a 509T solved all of these issues. The EPS is also an option, as are the MPS, acro p2, the new rcr, etc. Yes, they all cost more, but open emitters were basically unusable for me for appendix IWB. For OWB or on a rifle I'm more open to the 407/507.