Wouldn't surprise me to see you doing this, matt
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Fatal Shooting in Worcester by Westborough LTC holder UPDATE: Guilty of Involuntary Manslaughter! 4-7 Year Sentence with 77 Days Credit.
- Thread starter DJBrad
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![[rofl]](/xen/styles/default/xenforo/smilies.vb/013.gif "ROFL [rofl]")
This is a good case for OC spray in the center console.
Nyet...I'm preemptive and woke as eff. My driver-side window sticker reads
It's not Twitter, though. It's the basic human right to privacy he's taking issue with. Somebody wants to publish, comment, or post anonymously, that's built into the freedom of speech. And he's getting the welling eyes up in interviews about it.
He can talk shit about a fat woman on the Sports Illustrated Swimsuit cover, but randos in his mentions are his breaking point?
Guy is just off his game at this point. Hasn't been able to hit with the fire and strength he did pre-breakdown.
I was living in AZ during the Antifa summer of love, I rode around with this in my passenger footwell in urban areas. I got stopped near downtown Tucson after the 10:00 pm curfew during the George Floyd riots, I handed the officer my DL and CCW and informed him I was armed with a pistol and a rifle. The cop asked where and I said pistol in my left pocket and rifle on the passenger floor. He told me to stay safe and sent me on my way. Probably would’ve been a different result with MA law enforcement.Driver and passenger side door pockets.
Learned this watching innocent drivers trying to pass through AntiFa riots in the Summer of Love.
Palladin
NES Member
Christ!! I remember watching this in driver's ed in 1972
Marty McFly
NES Member
Man you could have drove a bus! If the window to bullet ratio holds up!
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chindogg
NES Member
Up until two years ago I drove part time for a college located on one of those side streets. Half of my time was spent on those side streets.I filled my shuttle at that Honey Farms four times a week.Meh. I grew up in Newton Square after my dad moved us from Great Brook Valley in the mid 90’s. I guess I don’t know what I’m talking about with regards to bad neighborhoods
Take a side street once in a while.
Great Brook Valley on the other hand is a different story. I wouldn’t walk through that place with anything less than a Howitzer.
I’m mostly talking from my experience in both places 20-30 years ago. I lived on cedar street for a while and it was only a block away from elm…it’s very segmented over there.
Believe it or not, GBV isn’t half as bad as it was in the 90’s. It’s still kinda bad, but back then it was like San Juan. I’m really lucky my dad lived above the most respected OG crack dealer in the place because NOBODY f***ed around in our area. He liked my dad and me a lot too. Had some good times there as a kid but I was ‘protected’.
chindogg
NES Member
GBV was bad back then. I don't know much about it now. Did you go to Doherty?
I did. And Burncoat. And Prouty in Spencer. I got bounced around a lot those years before I dropped out and became a drum and bass DJ and moved to Arizona with my girlfriend. Fun times
“Innocent” is not a legal term. People are found “guilty” or “not guilty”. Nobody is ever found “innocent”
Based on the information we have, the chances that the shooter did nothing to feed the event are close to zero.
Look at every post here saying something like, “it’s cheaper to replace a window” or “it’s always better to just leave”.
That’s what I’m saying. If someone picks a fight with you, and you let them, you’re not innocent. “Guilty of a crime” is not the same as “not innocent”
pastera
NES Member
You are assuming you have a choice - I've been in situations where I didn't have a choice, trouble found me simply because I was a skinny white kid living in a bad neighborhood. I've also had situations driving where hitting the brakes because of traffic stopping in front of me triggered a road rager. Hard to stop someone from raging on you when you are stuck in traffic or walking home after work.
We don't know if this guy had any options so until it is shown he was actively involved with instigating the assault then I place zero blame on him.
Even if he had an offramp to GTFO and decided not to take it but still did nothing to instigate then I still place zero blame on him (but would consider him an idiot for not getting out)
Break out the reading glasses, morning coffee and give this thread a read.
NH road rage shooting
I'm not even going to say it. NH road rage incident leads to shooting "GRAFTON, N.H. (WCAX) A road rage incident ended in a shooting in Grafton, New Hampshire, Monday afternoon. It happened on Route 4 near Lower Meadow Road. Police say Joseph Brown, 38, and a 46-year-old driver were both...
www.northeastshooters.com
Jesus Christ...
Read this carefully:
I AM NOT TALKING ABOUT YOU.
I AM NOT TALKING ABOUT SOME HYPOTHETICAL ENCOUNTER THAT MIGHT HAPPEN.
I'm talking about this guy, in this one situation, that this thread is about.
I'm not saying it's impossible to be innocent. Elisjsha Dicken (the guy who took down the mall shooter in 15 seconds) for instance. He is absolutely innocent. No question.
I'm saying that the subject of THIS THREAD, is not. I have no idea if he's guilty of murder or manslaughter or negligent homicide.
Maybe I'm wrong and he was just sitting at a fuel pump waiting to leave because he was blocked in by three cars and some random psycho ran up without warning and smashed his window and was going to punch him in the face. But none of the reporting suggests that's the case though.
police report and news article said:
Sure, it's possible that it was,
"Get out of that space, you're blocking the pump!"
"I'm trying sir, but I'm blocked in."
"MOVE MOTHERf***ER!"
"What do think I can do? I have nowhere to go."
"I'M GOING TO KICK YOUR ASS, a**h***!!" (punches window)
But really, is that the way you imagine it going down?
It doesn’t sound like the dead guy had a weapon, that is a factor. The shooter also wasn’t assaulted yet which is also a factor. We don’t know the size difference between the two, that’s a factor. If a 110 lbs woman is attacked by a 250 lbs man, the probability of serious harm or injury is far greater than if the reverse happened (if no weapons were involved).
The issue here will be the imminence, how close was the dead guy, was he advancing etc. if he had a gun, the closeness doesn’t matter because a gun is a danger at distance. If the dead guy had a knife or bat, the distance can be a factor
Then there’s reasonableness, was the shooters actions reasonable. And proportionality. Was the force used proportional to the threat.
Even reading the police report, we can’t say much about any of these. Police reports are one sided (often wrong) and they’re so brief, they leave out vital details. We don’t know about witnesses or their credibility or if there is video surveillance (and how good that video is quality wise) nor are forensic evidence knows. The medical examiner will test for gun powder to estimate the distance of the dead guy from the shooter, the angle of the shots, the location of the shots on the body, was the dead guy high on pcp, etc and bugged out of his mind?
If the shooter had pepper spray and the dead guy was unarmed, he definitely would have been better off using that. It’s definitely better to have a less lethal option rather than only a firearm. There is more legal ability to use non lethal in situations than lethal and even if you used excessive force with pepper spray, any charge would be a low level misdemeanor with no risk of jail/prison and the legal expenses defending that (if you were even charged) would be minimal.
eboos
NES Member
This may seem semantic given the rest of your post, but in Massachusetts (and many other states) "assault" is placing one in fear of an imminent battery. Breaking the dude's window, especially if he was in the car, certainly qualifies as an assault. If the dude was in the car, getting struck by the broken glass may even qualify as A&B DW (however prosecutors are unlikely to charge the deceased).
SFC13557
NES Member
Yup, like I said bought new vehicle in July and forgot to relocate spray. I'm good to go nowDriver and passenger side door pockets.
Learned this watching innocent drivers trying to pass through AntiFa riots in the Summer of Love.
Hope you’re doing better today.
MaverickNH
NES Member
I got a Pepperblaster 2 3-pack and am considering keeping one in my car. But if somebody busted my window out, I might first reach for the hickory cane on my passenger seat first to thrust out at them, assuming I was unable to drive off immediately. I'd probably get enough pepper spray backlash to reduce my capabilities too, if I tried to blast someone short-range through my window.
Presumably, they don't smash my window and step back, without further physical assault and I need to engage. If they have any impact weapon, it's a clear lethal threat, with me strapped into the seat, so firearm is justified. A lawyer will, of course, argue that until they beat me with that tire iron, how did I know they had lethal intent, but that's BS - once bashed I cannot defend. Hopefully, I have my seatbelt off in time to shift right, but there nowhere to go, really, Better to engage than delay.
We practice seated self-defense in my MA style, but haven't done car situations. That said, training is meant to be adaptable. Somebody breaking my window and reaching into my car for me exposes themself to a head-twist (right hand under chin and left wrapping over top of head, twist CCW) and throat smash against the front window frame. If they try a grab/punch, pull them in to get them off-balance and go for the eyes/throat.
There might be other situations where I'd exit my car and find use for pepper spray before a firearm, but those would be very, very special circumstances.
Control access: If I'm in my car, my car door is locked. If I unlock my car, it's just my driver's door.
I like most used assault as the combined A&B. Whether it’s assault or not depends on facts we don’t know. How far were they when there window was broken (I didn’t see it specified it was the drivers window), did he break the wind and stand still or step back, etc. if the shooter can’t show he was in fear and he acted reasonably, proportionally etc then he’s in a world of trouble.
Everyone should have pepper spray, give yourself options which can neutralize a threat and minimize the risk of an arrest or trial for a killing
richc
NES Member
Mike Tyson used to say everyone had a fight plan against him until he punched them in the face...
A lot of states don’t have the same standards for a car as they do a home. Also, castle doctrine doesn’t make any shooting a good shoot inside a home in most states, there still needs to be a threat, proportional force used, imminent harm, etc. if a plumber was told I’ll leave the back door open, go in that was to fix the kitchen sink. And the plumber wen to the wrong townhouse/house/apartment Most states wouldn’t allow you to shoot the plumber who made a mistake. Now if the person broke a window to get in, that eliminates the mistake type entry.
Every situation is so different and fact dependent. It’s impossible to generalize because the slightest change in facts can change the lawfulness of an event.
If you’re arrested and tried, even if the jury acquits you, you may be financially wrecked. This guy from west borough may spend $400,000 or more to beat this charge.
commodon
NES Member
Agreed. I took that class about 10-12 years ago, when they were first starting out in Framingham. It was a good class and worth the money.
And McQuarrie is an excellent instructor. I've taken another class he offered and thought it was equally valuable,.
Doherty grad here as well lolI did. And Burncoat. And Prouty in Spencer. I got bounced around a lot those years before I dropped out and became a drum and bass DJ and moved to Arizona with my girlfriend. Fun times
eboos
NES Member
I don't know his attorney personally, I don't think I've met him, but he had been doing this for a long time. Been on the murder trial list for a long time. He was in charge of the public defender division of CPCS prior to going private practice.
Yeah, financially he is effed! The concept of carrying insurance for this sort of thing is completely repulsive to me on philosophical grounds, but I do understand its value in a practical sense.
Hopefully his statement to the police didn’t handcuff his lawyer too much.
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