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paul73

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While your work is appreciated, it doesn't automatically make you right no matter what and therefore it's irrelevant to this conversation. Someone who hasn't worked on range X can still weigh in with their opinion.
They sure can.
Also can strip, put peacock feathers up their ass and frolic around for what I care. Not my problem.
 

paul73

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I'm done trying to convince anyone it's deliberate. Believe whatever you want. Ddeck22, I'll measure for the plywood tomorrow or Saturday.
current stuff/setup was pretty decent - and the lower plank as a cover of bolts on plates also worked out great for a while, until it got shot - but, realistically, no matter what we put down there at that level - it will be eventually shredded up. only mistake we did was not using screws along the top edge to secure it to the second board in the middle, so it would not fall down when its midsection is no more.
 

ddeck22

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CBDE90C0-8EB3-4F0E-B1CF-104C3DE875B2.jpeg

New piece of plywood I put up today. It’s 3 smaller pieces screwed together with strapping so technically if the middle piece gets shot out just that section can be replaced. It was scrap 3/4” plywood I had and will replace as needed.

Edit: We also took the advice of paul73 and screwed the bottom piece to the middle piece, so it won't all fall apart if the middle part is shot out. We also used Philips head screws since that will make it easier to remove. The original ones had Torx heads and I didn't have one of those to remove the old screws.
 
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paul73

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View attachment 633459

New piece of plywood I put up today. It’s 3 smaller pieces screwed together with strapping so technically if the middle piece gets shot out just that section can be replaced. It was scrap 3/4” plywood I had and will replace as needed.
awesome.
quite interesting that the left bolt from the round plate on the right got shot off - it was a brand new bolt gerry and i just mounted there.
like i said before - anything small that is exposed gets shot off almost immediately. but, it is no biggie. those bolts are easy to replace.

we also probably need to move the biggest steel target to the center, as thickness of the left post seems to be reducing quite rapidly.
 

67ray

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I thought the same thing about the posts. How wide would the posts have to be positioned in order to not get significant spall? Is there room for that.
 

paul73

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I thought the same thing about the posts. How wide would the posts have to be positioned in order to not get significant spall? Is there room for that.
width is restricted by the hanging rod length where chains get attached to.
it was a potential mistake not to hang the biggest steel plate in the middle, really, as that one gets shot most of the time - it can be seen on the right at the round plate there is almost no damage to the post at all, as people aim at it way less, and i bet almost no one shoots at the smallest 5" or 4" whatever it is plate that is now in the middle.

whoever gets there first - myself or anybody - we just need to swap those plates around, for big square one to be at the center. it will require a couple of pliers/wrenches. we should have done it last time when gerry and i were at it. no need to undo upper mounts - just bolts at the plates. they are mangled in front, but nuts behind were workable last time.

post as is still has 3/4 of thickness left, so, i do not think it is an imminent issue, but, if it will continue like that - it will not live through next 6 months, probably.
 
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paul73

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Then could we get a longer hanging rod length?
It's just galvy fence post.
at a next work party, may be - but now it is a pita no one will go through, to redo whole setup. it is for mark to decide, anyway.
i honestly think, the swap of plates will solve the issue.

>It's just galvy fence post.
no, it is more than that - step behind it and check it out - it has mounts there, plates on a thread - so to replace it costs money and time.
 

paul73

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I will rip a piece of 3/4” plywood and screw it to the post as a sacrificial piece.
try to swap plates too, if it is doable, i think it would be enough, really.
right now it is a dual damage from both ricochets and missed shots hitting that post straight in.
 

gerrycaruso

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Adding a piece of plywood to the post is a good idea but steel (which is in the shed) would last much longer. Moving the posts farther apart would be a lot of work and if they have to move more than a few inches to avoid damage, then 8 foot plywood won't be long enough.
 

Mesatchornug

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Adding a piece of plywood to the post is a good idea but steel (which is in the shed) would last much longer. Moving the posts farther apart would be a lot of work and if they have to move more than a few inches to avoid damage, then 8 foot plywood won't be long enough.
We might also try mounting the pipe back from the legs by adding a couple elbows and short lengths of pipe. Then the spall would predominantly be behind the uprights.

I think @paul73's idea to put the biggest target in the middle makes a lot of sense, though, as a first step.
 

AHM

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We might also try mounting the pipe back from the legs by adding a couple elbows and short lengths of pipe. Then the spall would predominantly be behind the uprights.
(I haven't seen this setup, but if I can imagine grossly how this is designed)
why wouldn't you want to move the crossbar forward of the posts?
 

Mesatchornug

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(I haven't seen this setup, but if I can imagine grossly how this is designed)
why wouldn't you want to move the crossbar forward of the posts?
Right now there is plywood mounted to the posts as a scrim to disguise the chains and pipe. If the pipe were pushed backwards, I would hope it might reduce the damage from spall to the uprights (never eliminate, obviously)
 

gerrycaruso

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Backward is probably better because it would allow the plywood to remain. If the spall still hits the posts, we could make shields out of the flat stock in the shed. Mark needs to be notified first to get his approval. If this work is to be done, I'll bring some tools and help out.
 

Mesatchornug

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Backward is probably better because it would allow the plywood to remain. If the spall still hits the posts, we could make shields out of the flat stock in the shed. Mark needs to be notified first to get his approval. If this work is to be done, I'll bring some tools and help out.
I'd definitely let Mark decide if it's worth doing. I was basically just riffing.
 

AHM

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Right now there is plywood mounted to the posts as a scrim to disguise the chains and pipe. If the pipe were pushed backwards, I would hope it might reduce the damage from spall to the uprights (never eliminate, obviously)
Still exactly the opposite of the geometry I'm imagining. [angry]
Well, that's my problem.[thumbsup]
 

AHM

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it could be that backwards and forwards are used differently here. Perhaps if I said "towards the berm"?
'Fraid not.

The spall is never going to go purely further downrange towards the berm after hitting the plate, right?
If the plates are properly angled down, the spall goes back uprange, but towards the ground -
hopefully well short of the firing line.
But if any goes sideways, it's more likely to bounce back uprange
than angle to the side but further downrange towards the berm.
So the sideposts should be downrange of the plates.

Does all that make sense?
Or is the rack not constructed like I imagine?

I've got a single-plate rack which is like a sawhorse made out of pipes.
The downrange side of the two uprange legs (those closer to the firing line)
is where some spall goes - far less than the uprange side of the downrange legs.

Or am I misunderstanding "spall"?

Or are the boolits so awesome that they're going through the plates
like fast neutrons through a solid,
or Buckaroo Banzai's Jet Truck going through a mountain?
 

AHM

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I've got a single-plate rack which is like a sawhorse made out of pipes.
Not this precise make/model,
but the geometry is valid:
3_8_-x-10_-gong-plate-and-stand.jpg
 

AHM

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I completely agree with the physics of what you're describing. Going forward would be ideal. Unfortunately, that would do away with the current ability to obscure the chains.
Way above my head.

Just glad I'm not crazy.
Sorry not to have grokked what you meant.
Thanks for your patience.
 

Mesatchornug

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Damage happens as two sides of a coin. On the one hand, we saw a bolt break when we were shooting at the steel yesterday. We're shooting things with guns, we should expect damage.

On the other hand, I found this under the steel targets when we were clearing our paper targets from the frames. It's impossible to know how long it was there, but lead and copper don't attract magnets...
20220716_155427.jpg
 

paul73

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People who know know better than me are pretty sure it's a core from a 50. At some point, as a personal project, I'll probably put it on a mill or surface grinder and report back.
i saw holes in steel plates there before, some people do shoot there with such things, and those piercing things make a good amount of damage. it is what it is.
again, those bolts at plates are easily replaceable, there is plenty of them in the shed. as long as upper mounts remain intact - it is not such big of the problem.
 

Mesatchornug

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i saw holes in steel plates there before, some people do shoot there with such things, and those piercing things make a good amount of damage. it is what it is.
again, those bolts at plates are easily replaceable, there is plenty of them in the shed. as long as upper mounts remain intact - it is not such big of the problem.
If I were smarter, I'd have gotten the code for that shed and replaced the bolt before we left..
As I can't change the past, I'll get that code now, so I have it for next time.
 
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