Justice Kennedy to Retire this Summer, according to Republican Senator (NYDailyNews article)

Did not think anyone today would pull that.

Birds of a (whatever type of) feather tend to flock together in their free time, but that goes a bit beyond...

My town is big enough there are several schools and each has a slightly different "mission". It results in some self selecting segregation but it's more like the "percentages" vary a little per school, not school A is black, B is white and C is hispanic. Oh, they're white too, now, according to the libs... Guess we only need two schools...

Growing up we had a fairly homogeneous Caucasian population in my school district, just as the next district over was primarily black. That's self-selecting segregation, I don't see much wrong with it. However the administrators did and tried busing some of them out of the ghetto to our High School during my senior year. They actually would've been better off staying where they were, since education standards were far lower there. Of the dozen or so who got bused in, none of them graduated.

Had they stayed in the ghetto, chances are they would've at least been given a HS diploma. Not that it would've been worth much, but they didn't learn shit getting bused out to our school anyhow.
 
Bussing was also a form of wealth redistribution. Parents want their kids to grow up in a nice town with good schools. The free market drives up the price of homes in those towns, and good schools usually mean higher property taxes.

On the other hand, a room, books and a good teacher(with the liberty to maintain discipline!) is all that's really required, and wealth should have little to do with it. In the early 1900s a lot of kids were still educated in one room school houses. If you look up the old reading books, spelling, history and math tests from then, they got a damned good education.
 
If you mean that there is a high percentage of Democratic appointees right now, it's a common misconception that this is unusual. After one party has had the presidency for 8 years, it's always the case that that party has a high percentage of appointees, and it balances out over the course of the other party's term, then tips in the other direction.

What court-packing means is enlarging the size of a court so the party in power can fill the newly created seats with their own appointees, and so tip the balance of power in their favor. The last president to consider it was FDR.
Correct. Maybe I confused the issue a bit by highlighting how Dems definitely packed the lower courts when Obama was POTUS.

My point was what is to stop the Dems from packing SCOTUS once they take power like FDR tried to do? I don't think that it will make a difference if the court is 5-4 or 6-3. I expect the left to employ every single dirty trick necessary to achieve the end they desire.
 
Correct. Maybe I confused the issue a bit by highlighting how Dems definitely packed the lower courts when Obama was POTUS.

My point was what is to stop the Dems from packing SCOTUS once they take power like FDR tried to do? I don't think that it will make a difference if the court is 5-4 or 6-3. I expect the left to employ every single dirty trick necessary to achieve the end they desire.


It would be a slaughter for them in the next election, however I don't know that they are even afraid of that in this case. I have seen the idea popping up more places lately that if trump puts in anyone but merrick garland then the next time there is dem control of the government they should pack on 4-6 ultra liberals in their 30's to "Even things out" after the "Stolen" seat and now this. Even if they lose control of the government for 20 years afterwards, they will have wrecked the supreme court, and made getting any of our stuff fixed impossible, which is all they seem to care about.
 
It would be a slaughter for them in the next election, however I don't know that they are even afraid of that in this case. I have seen the idea popping up more places lately that if trump puts in anyone but merrick garland then the next time there is dem control of the government they should pack on 4-6 ultra liberals in their 30's to "Even things out" after the "Stolen" seat and now this. Even if they lose control of the government for 20 years afterwards, they will have wrecked the supreme court, and made getting any of our stuff fixed impossible, which is all they seem to care about.
Not too much of a slaughter in the next election if they get their way on the immigration issue.
 
Me neither but its going to require House/Senate and POTUS to change the law.......

At this point I wouldnt be surprised if the Dem party splits into Socialists an Dem party inadvance of the election

This is why I said it would take full government control by dems. I don't think they will do it, and if they did they would be likely to lose a LOT of elections. But there is a chance that they care more about packing the court, and less about the temporary loss of power while they control the courts for a very long time. The threat of a huge loss is why FDR was not supported when he threatened it by his own party, but it may not matter to them as much anymore.
 
Interesting potential pick - Raymond Kethledge

Kethledge emerging as dark horse SCOTUS pick?

"He has an exemplary record on Second Amendment rights, concurring with his colleague Judge Jeffrey Sutton’s declaration of the right to bear arms as “fundamental” in a crucial en banc case on the amendment. Kethledge has also dissented in a Fifth Amendment takings case from the decision of his colleagues to punt back an aggrieved party to state court in a way he concluded indicated that the court had “lost our constitutional bearings” on property rights."
 
Correct. Maybe I confused the issue a bit by highlighting how Dems definitely packed the lower courts when Obama was POTUS.

My point was what is to stop the Dems from packing SCOTUS once they take power like FDR tried to do? I don't think that it will make a difference if the court is 5-4 or 6-3. I expect the left to employ every single dirty trick necessary to achieve the end they desire.
If you have a 5-4 split, you're much more likely to see stare decisis respected, as one of the conservative justices will flip to the other side in certain cases that have been long settled. Basically, you're less likely to see over the top judicial activism from the conservative side that way.

On something like 2A, that won't matter, because there's no stare decisis issues - virtually any 2A cases are issues of first impression, so we should get all the victories we want. But on something like environmental law or even some more banal federal programs, if you get a 6-3 conservative majority you're likely to start seeing some pretty extreme shifts. And once that happens, you're leaving the left with no real recourse other than court packing. They might be able to live with a court that respects gun rights and is skeptical of any future expansion of federal powers, but not with one that's also overturning long-established federal programs.

The less politicized the courts become, the better. In the long run, once the new court with Kennedy's replacement starts ruling in our favor on 2A cases, those victories are more likely to be permanently cemented if the court shows a continued respect for stare decisis.
 
A conservative court could shrink the federal government back to within its constitutional authorization and reassert the powers and responsibilities to individual states via the 10th. I'm going to laugh if Trump doesn't just roll back Obama, but does LBJ, and FDR getting us back to Wilson's manipulations. Gutting Wilson's attack on the Republic would require Constitutional Amendments which I don't think would pass though.
 
Interesting potential pick - Raymond Kethledge

Kethledge emerging as dark horse SCOTUS pick?

"He has an exemplary record on Second Amendment rights, concurring with his colleague Judge Jeffrey Sutton’s declaration of the right to bear arms as “fundamental” in a crucial en banc case on the amendment. Kethledge has also dissented in a Fifth Amendment takings case from the decision of his colleagues to punt back an aggrieved party to state court in a way he concluded indicated that the court had “lost our constitutional bearings” on property rights."
Not all conservatives are enamored with Kethledge: Conservatives Concerned: Judge on Trump’s SCOTUS Shortlist Could Be Next Anthony Kennedy
Despite his generally conservative record of decisions on the bench, three sources familiar with Kethledge’s reasoning and judicial philosophy have raised concerns with Breitbart News over his tendency, not unlike his one-time boss Justice Kennedy, to resort to sweeping moral judgment, rather than constitutionally-mandating restraint, in reaching his opinions.
...
This emphasis on moral considerations over constitutional originalism can be seen in one of Kethledge’s opinions, United States v. Gabrion ... Both a concurring opinion and the dissent criticized Kethledge’s use of moral considerations in determining whether the jury should have been able to hear evidence about how, if the murder had taken place nearby, outside of the national forest, Gabrion would not have faced death.
...
In Tyler v. Hillsdale County Sheriff’s Dept., all 15 judges of Kethledge’s court reheard an earlier panel decision and ruled 9-6 in favor of Clifford Tyler ...Kethledge had the option of joining one of several pro-gun opinions, including a heavily “original meaning” focused one which criticized the controlling opinion in the case for “giving little more than a nod to the originalist inquiry.”

But Kethledge instead joined the Sutton opinion, which focuses largely on the injustices endured by the mentally ill, criticizing the government for tacking too close to “the unfair generalizations that once applied to individuals with mental health challenges” in its arguments.
...
The implications of Kethledge’s decision to join Sutton’s Tyler concurrence are uncertain, but may suggest a judicial philosophy on the Second Amendment that stands at odds with the originalist direction paved by Justice Antonin Scalia when he crafted the Heller decision.
Thank you, no. There are other, better, less risky choices.
 
A conservative court could shrink the federal government back to within its constitutional authorization and reassert the powers and responsibilities to individual states via the 10th. I'm going to laugh if Trump doesn't just roll back Obama, but does LBJ, and FDR getting us back to Wilson's manipulations. Gutting Wilson's attack on the Republic would require Constitutional Amendments which I don't think would pass though.
We have a system that's designed with checks and balances, but at the end of the day our government is one by, of, and for the people. The protection of individual rights is the most important province of the court. But drastically changing the nature of the government is not the court's job.

We can't and shouldn't rely on the least democratic branch to accomplish what we can't accomplish electorally. Even if you got a court to do it, it would be a dangerously unstable and unsustainable solution that would only cause a backlash that would empower the left.

If we want to shrink the size and scope of the federal government, we have to elect a Congress that actually wants to do that.
 
The size and scope of the government is well beyond it's constitutional limits because the court since FDR's time hasn't ruled in manner which invalidates the trespasses of the federal government beyond its constitutional limitations.

If we had a court which would rule to indicate that x,y,z department or legislation goes beyond the limits of federal power and that x,y,z, is the domain of states, the size of the federal government and its relationship with states would have to change.

Look at the CFPB. Totally unconstitutional and yet it existed for how many years?

A strict constitutionalist court could do a lot to reign in the 'general welfare' cause and return powers to the states.
 
The size and scope of the government is well beyond it's constitutional limits because the court since FDR's time hasn't ruled in manner which invalidates the trespasses of the federal government beyond its constitutional limitations.

If we had a court which would rule to indicate that x,y,z department or legislation goes beyond the limits of federal power and that x,y,z, is the domain of states, the size of the federal government and its relationship with states would have to change.

Look at the CFPB. Totally unconstitutional and yet it existed for how many years?

A strict constitutionalist court could do a lot to reign in the 'general welfare' cause and return powers to the states.
Whether or not what you're saying is true, the way to change it is not through the tyrannical and undemocratic power of the courts. That is an inherently unstable and easily reversed solution that will further politicize the judiciary. And that will only hurt individual rights like 2A. The way to make big and fundamental changes to the nature of government is through the democratic process.

We're the richest country in the world in large part due to the stability of our system. Anything that destabilizes the system is not a good thing.
 
Correct. Maybe I confused the issue a bit by highlighting how Dems definitely packed the lower courts when Obama was POTUS.

My point was what is to stop the Dems from packing SCOTUS once they take power like FDR tried to do? I don't think that it will make a difference if the court is 5-4 or 6-3. I expect the left to employ every single dirty trick necessary to achieve the end they desire.

Dems will surely do their best to appoint SCOTUS members that think and vote in their favor. Who wouldn't. All the more reason why our side should do the same whenever we can. Seems like pretty minimal logic.
 
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