oregon militia seizes building

[cfbackrow]

thanks for the backstory....I'm sure the mainstream media will be forthcoming with it also....never

 

[Infinite Jester]

Good read on the backstory. Out of all the lawless, criminal alphabet agencies out there, I never thought the BLM would be the one to get the party started.

 

[Bonesinium]

They are arguing that they can no longer make a living grazing cattle on their own land?

Yes.

I guess they can't afford to buy anymore land to run their business?

Sort of hard to buy land when the Feds say they own it all.

. I would be calling more for a revolution if .Gov was kicking people off their own land. That doesn't seem to be the case here?? What am I missing?

Good news! You can start calling for that revolution because what you are missing is precisely what you just said. They are being kicked off their own land. Or rather being thrown in jail and forcibly being prevented from using or accessing their land so that either they sell it or it becomes worthless. But that is pretty much the same thing.

 

[Jsfitzgerald85]

yep the conditioning is in full effect, "using arms makes them terrorists"

 

[timbo]

A (rather long) quote from one of my favorite books written almost 50 years ago:

“1. Concentrate the populace in megalopolitan masses so that they can be kept under close surveillance and where, in case of trouble, they can be bombed, burned, gassed or machine-gunned with a minimum of expense and waste.

2. Mechanize agriculture to the highest degree of refinement, thus forcing most of the scattered farm and ranching population into the cities. Such a policy is desirable because farmers, woodsmen, cowboys, Indians, fishermen and other relatively self-sufficient types are difficult to manage unless displaced from their natural environment.

3. Restrict the possession of firearms to the police and the regular military organizations.

4. Encourage or at least fail to discourage population growth. Large masses of people are more easily manipulated and dominated than scattered individuals.

5. Continue military conscription. Nothing excels military training for creating in young men an attitude of prompt, cheerful obedience to officially constituted authority.

6. Divert attention from deep conflicts within the society by engaging in foreign wars; make support of these wars a test of loyalty, thereby exposing and isolating potential opposition to the new order.

7. Overlay the nation with a finely reticulated network of communications, airlines and interstate autobahns.

8. Raze the wilderness. Dam the rivers, flood the canyons, drain the swamps, log the forests, strip-mine the hills, bulldoze the mountains, irrigate the deserts and improve the national parks into national parking lots. Idle speculations, feeble and hopeless protest. It was all foreseen nearly half a century ago by the most cold-eyed and clear-eyed of our national poets, on California’s shore, at the end of the open road. Shine, perishing republic.”


― Edward Abbey, Desert Solitaire

 

[JCV]

READ THE LINK WAHER POSTED - it's crucial to fully understanding what is going down out there.

I don't understand how this (part) can happen:

(t) In October 2015, the 9th District Court “resentenced” Dwight and Steven, requiring them to return to prison for several more years. Steven (46) has a wife and 3 children. Dwight (74) will leave Susan (74) to be alone after 55 years of marriage. If he survives, he will be 79 when he is released.

 

[exo]

I don't understand how this (part) can happen:

The BLM appealed on the grounds that the judge's sentence violated the minimum sentence prescribed for the so-called crime they were convicted of.

 

[calsdad]

I don't understand how this (part) can happen:

They're screwing the guy - how hard is that to understand?

I'm serious when I say go read Vin Suprynowicz. A guy I worked with a number of years ago turned me on to Vin. He (the co-worker) - had been involved with the militia stuff in the 1990's - was fully familiar how the Feds infiltrated and false-flagged people into doing shit that would take them down - etc.

If you don't understand how that part can happen - I think that's a sign that you're not yet fully informed about how some of this shit goes down.

 

[Jsfitzgerald85]

The BLM appealed on the grounds that the judge's sentence violated the minimum sentence prescribed for the so-called crime they were convicted of.

is it just me or is the BLM quickly becoming worse than the ATF? Does anyone else feel that way? And can someone explain to me how PUBLIC land is not owned by the PUBLIC? This is something i just dont comprehend

 

[dragonballzz]

I will read the link WAHER posted tonight when I have more time. I just skimmed thru the WIKIPEDIA regarding the bundy stand off and it said,

"The farm property was purchased by the Bundy family in 1948, after they moved from Bundyville, Arizona, and Bundy has claimed that he inherited "pre-emptive grazing rights" on public domain land because some of his maternal grandmother's ancestors had kept cattle in the Virgin Valley beginning in 1877.

There are no legally recognized inherited grazing rights, preemptive rights, special rights, or grandfathered public-domain land-use rights held by the Bundy family or Bundy's ancestors."

 

[noddaduma]

is it just me or is the BLM quickly becoming worse than the ATF? Does anyone else feel that way? And can someone explain to me how PUBLIC land is not owned by the PUBLIC? This is something i just dont comprehend

BLM's been like that for a long time.

 

[exo]

I will read the link WAHER posted tonight when I have more time. I just skimmed thru the WIKIPEDIA regarding the bundy stand off and it said,

"The farm property was purchased by the Bundy family in 1948, after they moved from Bundyville, Arizona, and Bundy has claimed that he inherited "pre-emptive grazing rights" on public domain land because some of his maternal grandmother's ancestors had kept cattle in the Virgin Valley beginning in 1877.

There are no legally recognized inherited grazing rights, preemptive rights, special rights, or grandfathered public-domain land-use rights held by the Bundy family or Bundy's ancestors."

This latest issue is about the Hammond family, not the Bundy family.

It's very difficult for people not from the west to understand how grazing rights, water rights, etc. work. There isn't a whole lot comparable to it in the east. And of course the media won't give anyone a primer since they aren't interested in reporting anything but the government's side.

 

[Jsfitzgerald85]

This latest issue is about the Hammond family, not the Bundy family.

It's very difficult for people not from the west to understand how grazing rights, water rights, etc. work. There isn't a whole lot comparable to it in the east. And of course the media won't give anyone a primer since they aren't interested in reporting anything but the government's side.

here is what i dont understand, its public land correct? Public land is paid for through taxes (atleast it should be), why the **** do people have to pay a fee to use land they already pay for.

 

[Greschner 4]

The misinformed and the disinformed public won't give two shits about the entire situation.

Correct.

The sheep will sleep as the Feds take advantage of, and consider the aforementioned, as nothing more than a "real life" warm up exercise for the practice/taxi squad(s).

 

[mibro]

I think you, like many of us, don't see Americans getting off their couches and acting against government tyranny but are inside secretly hoping we're wrong. I know I feel that way. I have little faith in the American people as a whole yet am desperately hoping I am wrong and enough momentum gets started to actually begin to take back what's left of the country. If it DOES happen it will be bloody, tragic and a ****ing nightmare....not at all like the military video games everyone is so fond of. The government is totally out of control and their tyrany has been evident for decades and only in the last 8 years do I see anger against the federal government begin to take hold on a national scale. It will be a war!

1. It's foolish to keep posting this kind of stuff on a public message board. At a minimum it's pointless.

2. This incident may be yet another false flag. The Obama Administration wants to paint white males with their "assault weapons" as domestic terrorists and so far white males have pretty much refused to provide the example they're looking for.

3. Anyone who's actually doing anything consistent with whatever they may happen to believe is not posting here.

 

[calsdad]

is it just me or is the BLM quickly becoming worse than the ATF? Does anyone else feel that way? And can someone explain to me how PUBLIC land is not owned by the PUBLIC? This is something i just dont comprehend

The BLM has been "worse" for a long time.

Suprynowicz on barring the people from the land:

(note that it was written in 2001)

http://www.ncc-1776.org/tle2001/libe129-20010709-05.html

Who could be against "protection"? Parents are expected to "protect" their children. Everyone wants to "protect" a litter of helpless puppies.

But the word can have other meanings. If the head of the household has died and the property tax payments aren't being made, the authorities may eventually decide to "protect the asset" on which they have filed their liens. Such a gentle way to describe the process of evicting the tearful widow and her kids, setting their belongings on the public sidewalk, changing the locks and securing the place with yellow police tape till auction day.

It's this latter use of the word "protect" we must keep in mind as we read that U.S. District Judge Tena Campbell ruled June 25 in favor of the Southern Utah Wilderness Alliance and the Sierra Club in their suit against three counties in southern Utah, in a case concerning county roads through the so-called Grand Staircase-Escalante National Monument.

In the waning days of the late Clinton administration, the president decided to override the objections of local states and counties -- paying off his supporters on the extreme fringes of the environmental "protection" movement (as well as any supporters who might have controlled, say, Indonesian coal deposits, hardly anxious to compete with high-quality coal newly scheduled to be mined in southern Utah) by waving his magic executive pen and declaring a great swatch of southern Utah off limits for productive use ... possibly including coal mining.

(You remember coal. We burn it to make electricity, and Utah's is particularly hard and clean-burning. Try telling the residents of California now suffering rotating power blackouts they're being "protected" from the over-hasty development of Utah's coal reserves.)

At any rate, the three counties in question decided to make use of an 1866 federal law which provides them "the right of way for the construction of highways across public lands not reserved for public uses."

Congress repealed that law in 1976, but existing rights of way were "grandfathered in" and thus still protected. So the Utah counties went in and re-graded the roads they intended to keep open through the new "monument," around which the green extremists now planned to wrap the legal equivalent of yellow police tape -- "protecting" vast acreages against any trespass or productive use by the people of the United States.

In their lawsuit, the environmental groups contended the roads in question were not protected under the law because they were not actually "built"; did not access particular destinations, and in some cases were on land already "reserved for a public use" ... coal development, oddly enough. The counties responded that the roads were important transportation links and had been in use since the 19th century.

A federal court ruled in 1998 that the counties' maintenance of rights of way would not constitute trespass onto federal lands, but then stayed its decision pending a ruling by the Bureau of Land Management on whether the rights of way were valid (an odd measure of deference for an independent branch of government to show mere appointed regulators.)

Not surprisingly, the green-infiltrated BLM concluded in 1999 that with one exception, the right-of-way were not valid.

Judge Campbell's ruling now upholds the BLM's determination that the counties did not have rights of way on 16 of 17 routes -- a precedent which could affect control of tens of thousands of routes and trails on public lands.

Thus are effectively barred the hunters, the shooters, the hikers, the fishermen, the rock collectors, the off-roaders -- thus is the human-hating agenda of the Green Extreme made flesh.

"No more will the counties be able to undermine the protection of national parks, Bureau of Land Management lands and wildlife refuges with the blunt edge of the bulldozer," crows Heidi McIntosh, an attorney and "conservation director" for the Southern Utah Wilderness Alliance ... using that interesting word "protection," again.

Significantly, Judge Campbell said the goal of Congress in repealing the 1866 law, "that federal lands be governed in accordance with national interest, would be undermined if the interest of the various states, rather than the interest of the federal government, governed the validity."

In fact, the only way the federal government is authorized by the Constitution to control any lands within the several states is to "purchase by the Consent of the Legislature of the State in which the Same shall be, (places) for the Erection of Forts, Magazines, Arsenals, dock-Yards and other needful Buildings."

Has the Utah state Legislature consented to sell the federal government this "Grand Staircase-Escalante National Monument"? Does the federal government need all this land for "Forts" and "dock-Yards"? Has the federal government, in fact, ever attempted to buy this land from the state? How much did it offer? Cash or check?

Judge Campbell here vacates, violates, and eviscerates the 10th Amendment (an integral part of the Constitution which she has sworn an oath to protect and defend) -- the amendment which informs us that in fact it is the powers and prerogatives of the states -- not the sharply limited interests of the central government -- which must take precedence, since "The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the States, are reserved to state states respectively, or to the people."

Of course, Judge Campbell is not the first federal functionary cynical enough to look at the return address on her paychecks and promptly turn this vital "default setting" of the constitution upside down.

But she's still wrong.

 

[EDD]

READ THE LINK WAHER POSTED - it's crucial to fully understanding what is going down out there.

http://theconservativetreehouse.com...st-to-hammond-family-persecution/#more-110497
Very helpful backstory. Thank you

 

[Chevy 2 65]

The misinformed and the disinformed public won't give two shits about the entire situation.

Spot on. This 1,000 times

 

[jkelly1229]

So what does the blm want is what I can't figure out. Why are they harassing these people. By all accounts some of the protesters work there. So what is the end game of getting this land.

 

[mibro]

Spot on. This 1,000 times

Outside of the rural red states Constitutionalists are thin on the ground. In the blue states, today's Americans don't want freedom, they want a kind master. There is nothing new under the sun.

"Few men desire freedom; the greater part are content with just masters".....Gaius Sallustius Crispus, Roman statesman and historian, 86−34 BC

 

[just jim]

Well I saw a report on Fox news...

 

[just jim]

So what does the blm want is what I can't figure out. Why are they harassing these people. By all accounts some of the protesters work there. So what is the end game of getting this land.

Probably stealing the 12,000 acre ranch and water rights is what they want. Under the forced agreement the Hammonds have to sell their property to the BLM if they can't pay the fines.

 

[Jsfitzgerald85]

Probably stealing the 12,000 acre ranch and water rights is what they want. Under the forced agreement the Hammonds have to sell their property to the BLM if they can't pay the fines.

so what you are saying is, the BLM most likely trumped up charges against these guys just to get their land. Its a conspiracy but i know enough of how the government acts to really believe it.

 

[Chevy 2 65]

Outside of the rural red states Constitutionalists are thin on the ground. In the blue states, today's Americans don't want freedom, they want a kind master. There is nothing new under the sun.

"Few men desire freedom; the greater part are content with just masters".....Gaius Sallustius Crispus, Roman statesman and historian, 86−34 BC

"A
Government that does not trust its law abiding citizens to keep and bear arms,
is itself, unworthy of trust." --James Madison, chief wordsmith of the
Constitution

"Any government that would attempt to disarm its people is
despotic; and any people that would submit to it deserve to be slaves."--
Stephen F. Austin, 1835

- - - Updated - - -

so what you are saying is, the BLM most likely trumped up charges against these guys just to get their land. Its a conspiracy but i know enough of how the government acts to really believe it.

Of course they are. It's like working for corporate America, there are policies in place for use when they want someone gone.

 

[dennism]

So did they start the fire to cover up illegal poaching?

Im not saying the punishment is reasonable, when you consider the boston bombing accomplice got 17 months, but that is what is being reported.

 

[Chevy 2 65]

So did they start the fire to cover up illegal poaching?

Im not saying the punishment is reasonable, when you consider the boston bombing accomplice got 17 months, but that is what is being reported.

Poaching is another GOV BS line.

 

[Bonesinium]

So what does the blm want is what I can't figure out. Why are they harassing these people. By all accounts some of the protesters work there. So what is the end game of getting this land.

Because they can. Vindictive. They wanted something and didn't get it. So they tried another tactic, and lost. So on they go.

"The most powerful aspect of any bureaucracy, in Kidd’s eyes, was the same thing that gave cancer its power: it was immortal. If you didn’t seek it out and kill it, cell by cell, it’d just keep growing. Bureaucracies could chase you forever. You could defeat them over and over and over again, and the bureaucracy didn’t much care, though some individual bureaucrats might. The bureaucracy, as a whole, just kept coming, as long as the funding lasted."

 

[NHAtHeart]

Poaching is another GOV BS line.

How dare anyone shoot the King's deer!

 

[mibro]

So did they start the fire to cover up illegal poaching?

Im not saying the punishment is reasonable, when you consider the boston bombing accomplice got 17 months, but that is what is being reported.

Anything you see "reported" is just something someone wants you to think. The MSM is 100% government-controlled propaganda.

 

[Chevy 2 65]

Flame away.