Practical Implications of H4885 for Purchasing and Possessing

[DJBrad]

I recall reading language along the lines of "components that seal the breach", in which case yea, sounds like uppers would be f***ed.

{ “Receiver”, the part of a rifle or shotgun that provides housing or a structure for the primary component designed to block or seal the breech prior to initiation of the firing sequence, even if pins or other attachments are required to connect such component to the housing or structure. Any such part that is identified with an importer or manufacturer serial number shall be presumed, absent an official determination by the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives in the United States Department of Justice or other reliable evidence to the contrary, to be the receiver of the firearm.}




Eta Frame language

{“Frame”, the part of a pistol or revolver that provides housing or a structure for the component designed to hold back the hammer, striker, bolt or similar primary energized component prior to initiation of the firing sequence, even if pins or other attachments are required to connect such component to the housing or structure. Any such part that is identified with an importer or manufacturer serial number shall be presumed, absent an official determination by the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives in the United States Department of Justice or other reliable evidence to the contrary, to be the frame of the firearm.}

 

[1903Collector]

{ “Receiver”, the part of a rifle or shotgun that provides housing or a structure for the primary component designed to block or seal the breech prior to initiation of the firing sequence, even if pins or other attachments are required to connect such component to the housing or structure. Any such part that is identified with an importer or manufacturer serial number shall be presumed, absent an official determination by the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives in the United States Department of Justice or other reliable evidence to the contrary, to be the receiver of the firearm.}

Thank you!

 

[CrackPot]

{ “Receiver”, the part of a rifle or shotgun that provides housing or a structure for the primary component designed to block or seal the breech prior to initiation of the firing sequence, even if pins or other attachments are required to connect such component to the housing or structure. Any such part that is identified with an importer or manufacturer serial number shall be presumed, absent an official determination by the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives in the United States Department of Justice or other reliable evidence to the contrary, to be the receiver of the firearm.}

Ok. I am not worried any longer. Both the Frame and Receiver definitions say that the serialized part is THE frame or receiver absent a BATFE determination otherwise. So given that all guns have a serialized frame/receiver (ok, most) and they say THE (not A), they are envisioning one frame or receiver for each gun and we dont have an issue here.

One word change or removal of THE and I think we were screwed.

 

[Lxpony]

So if an MP5 clone receiver is a “frame”. It can still be transferred in from out of state until 10/23? And with an approved Form 1 assembled as an SBR it will be a pistol as far as the state is concerned?

Illegal after 10/22....you will be at the mercy of anything inside MA that owned one prior to 8/1...

 

[AMV]

Illegal after 10/22....

I’m sure it won’t be the only thing. Lol

 

[MAJoe]

Sure. And on 10/23 it is an ASW and illegal to possess. I mentioned this earlier. We can still bring in anything that is legal today and transfer it, but it wont be grandfathered. A MP5 clone is a great example of this. No way for it to be legal after 10/22.

Is it though? It’s not on the banned list. Remove the threads and remove the hand guard “barrel shroud”. Only feature is detachable mag outside the pistol grip. I don’t think the cocking tube is a barrel shroud.

 

[DJBrad]

Is it though? It’s not on the banned list. Remove the threads and remove the hand guard “barrel shroud”. Only feature is detachable mag outside the pistol grip. I don’t think the cocking tube is a barrel shroud.

But dealers can no longer take in MP5 clones as manufactured with the handguards and threaded barrel since they are not on the roster nor can they be brought in due to being an ASF. Compliance work seems to be pretty much cooked now?

“Persons” to me means everyone except the leos, depts, or agency in (e) who get the carve out to possess and transfer.

 

[MAJoe]

But dealers can no longer take in MP5 clones as manufactured with the handguards and threaded barrel since they are not on the roster nor can they be brought in due to being an ASF. Compliance work seems to be pretty much cooked now?

“Persons” to me means everyone except the leos, depts, or agency in (e) who get the carve out to possess and transfer.

Right, the roster will be an issue, but the compliance work can be solved with a friendly out of state FFL before inbounding. It seems possible to own but impossible to sell. Maybe a rifle with the same modifications since there would be no forward grip or barrel shroud, assuming it’s not added to the naughty list and the roster doesn’t end up applying to rifles.

Either way, it’s going to be expensive.

 

[DJBrad]

Right, the roster will be an issue, but the compliance work can be solved with a friendly out of state FFL before inbounding. It seems possible to own but impossible to sell. Maybe a rifle with the same modifications since there would be no forward grip or barrel shroud, assuming it’s not added to the naughty list and the roster doesn’t end up applying to rifles.

Either way, it’s going to be expensive.

I can’t imagine these 1 feature guns will be of any value except to the most frail and newly minted serfs in this state.

 

[DavidP617]

Apologies if this was already answered but I scoured the threads and couldn't find it. Post 8/1 pre 10/22, are we still allowed to sell preban mags or are they dead in the water regarding the heir or FFL transfers only?

 

[milktree]

Apologies if this was already answered but I scoured the threads and couldn't find it. Post 8/1 pre 10/22, are we still allowed to sell preban mags or are they dead in the water regarding the heir or FFL transfers only?

You can sell like before until 10/23

 

[MAJoe]

Apologies if this was already answered but I scoured the threads and couldn't find it. Post 8/1 pre 10/22, are we still allowed to sell preban mags or are they dead in the water regarding the heir or FFL transfers only?

Business as usual

 

[MAJoe]

I can’t imagine these 1 feature guns will be of any value except to the most frail and newly minted serfs in this state.

Some of them I don’t think will be too bad. An MP5K clone with a brace and no handguard is still pretty useable holding from the magwell. Yes it’s stupid as hell.

 

[DavidP617]

You can sell like before until 10/23

Business as usual

Sweet, thank you!

 

[Toast]

Is there an understanding on the effect on change parts that change the caliber of a firearm (for example, swapping the regular 9mm slide off of a SIG P938 and installing the .22lr conversion slide)? Any thoughts?

 

[DJBrad]

Is there an understanding on the effect on change parts that change the caliber of a firearm (for example, swapping the regular 9mm slide off of a SIG P938 and installing the .22lr conversion slide)? Any thoughts?

No changes. Do as you wish.

 

[BlastingRaccoon47]

Can I still buy an MCX with an LTC?

 

[not new guy]

Can I still buy an MCX with an LTC?

Edit - bad info

 

[BlastingRaccoon47]

You might be able to find someone to sell you one but it's going to be illegal to have in MA when this goes into effect in October.

Sad

 

[CrackPot]

Can I still buy an MCX with an LTC?

Yes. If it was lawfully possessed by Dealer or LTC holder on 8/1 it will even be legal come 10/23. Prices are likely continuing to go up, though

 

[Sabougolden]

time to move out of this state of mass! been here 25 years. sad... but this state does not recognize the constitution of the people. moving to gun friendly state in the south!

 

[Yotacrawler]

Can I still buy an MCX with an LTC?

There are a bunch of Sig Spears for sale that were in dealer inventory before 8/1 if that’s what you are looking for. Do a little searching on the site here and on the “list” online. Heck the cape had a full pallet of them in .556. @michaelpelosillc Of Civilian supply had one listed on his site still for like $2700. You pick it up at the mill, RG sports. The prices i am sure will be going up as they sell out but I have seen a bunch for sale.

 

[theciviliansupply]

Right, the roster will be an issue, but the compliance work can be solved with a friendly out of state FFL before inbounding. It seems possible to own but impossible to sell. Maybe a rifle with the same modifications since there would be no forward grip or barrel shroud, assuming it’s not added to the naughty list and the roster doesn’t end up applying to rifles.

Either way, it’s going to be expensive.

This is what CA FFLs have to do. They can't import "assault weapons," so they have another dealer make it CA legal before shipping it into the state. I've done a few of these myself for FFLs in CA: grip fin, pin/weld, or fix magazine something. Anything that isn't enumerated or isn't a copy/clone/duplicate - whatever that means - can still be purchased. But the new Massification process may have to be done by an out-of-state dealer, or outright sold by an out-of-state dealer.

 

[FArook]

I apologize in advance for not being able to locate this question if it has been asked, but if someone lawfully owns a rifle or shotgun prior to 8/1 can they swap out the stock? For example, take a ruger mini 14 or mini 30 and change to pistol grip tactical stock or an m1a socom and change to the cqb pistol grip style stock, a bennelli m4 from regular stock to pistol grip, etc..

 

[MAJoe]

I apologize in advance for not being able to locate this question if it has been asked, but if someone lawfully owns a rifle or shotgun prior to 8/1 can they swap out the stock? For example, take a ruger mini 14 or mini 30 and change to pistol grip tactical stock or an m1a socom and change to the cqb pistol grip style stock, a bennelli m4 from regular stock to pistol grip, etc..

It appears so, yes, but only on 10/23 or later when these new laws are in effect.

 

[DJBrad]

I apologize in advance for not being able to locate this question if it has been asked, but if someone lawfully owns a rifle or shotgun prior to 8/1 can they swap out the stock? For example, take a ruger mini 14 or mini 30 and change to pistol grip tactical stock or an m1a socom and change to the cqb pistol grip style stock, a bennelli m4 from regular stock to pistol grip, etc..

Since all these semiautomatic firearms are now ASFs and the new definition with 2x features test only applies to all firearms transferred, owned, possessed, sold, bought, or obtained after 8/1 then any features are unlimited pre 8/1 since everything is now a ASF. 8/1 is the new preban.


The risks are still there in Ma no matter what and one should know the new laws to determine the risks. Study up on section 121 and 131 in Chapter 140 on mgl and compare to the new law.

The funny thing is that there is no language in that current bill that is now in force until 10/23 when the new bill takes over that restricts a properly licensed owner from owning any firearm that was lawfully possessed on 8/1/2024.

 

[FArook]

Thanks for the feedback. goes without saying this whole thing a popsicle headache. I see you can still get a benelli m4 pistol grip or m1a socom cqb if they are still in stock somewhere in MA, but no information on changing your own legally owned rifle or shotgun.

 

[pastera]

Hmmm.... if the definition of "Frame or receiver" is specific to ASWs, does this mean that frames that go to items other than ASWs are still non-firearms? If so, the not listed handgun hack would still work, provided of course, that a dealer accepts such interpretation.

230 “Firearm”, a stun gun, pistol, revolver, rifle, shotgun, sawed-off shotgun, large capacity firearm, assault-style firearm and machine gun, loaded or unloaded, which is designed to or may readily be converted to expel a shot or bullet; the frame or receiver of any such firearm or the unfinished frame or receiver of any such firearm; provided, however, that “firearm” shall not include any antique firearm or permanently inoperable firearm.

Frame or receiver is also part of the firearms definition.

 

[Yotacrawler]

I have a question about firearms in the “others” category. like a tac-14, honcho, shockwave. I have not seen any discussion on them. Any relevant changes to buying those post 8/1/24. I’m only asking because they are an easy route to the SBS.

 

[Boston4567]

Question regarding ATF dual state residency and pistol purchases.

Prior to the new law, dual residents could buy any pistol they wanted in their free state where they owned property and later bring it to MA (provided no AWB conflicts). The roster didn't matter because it only applied to dealer sales. Technically it needed to be registered in MIRCS within 7 days.

What does the landscape look like under the new law? My read is that it still only applies to dealer sales and there are no material changes.