Preparing for Winter

sksguns said:
My b-in-law put one in last year. Never saw one before that...I love it. it does a great job for him. I'm looking to get an insert (if they make them) for my basement fireplace. Haven't started shopping yet but there is a place up the road from my house.
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I wouldn't trade our pellet stoves for anything.[grin] There is a big difference in heat. Our house will be nice and toasty, and when I go to my mother in laws it feels cool.
Hubby's aunt and uncle have the insert. They are happy with it.
We also decided the next stove we get will also have the ability to burn corn as well as pellets. Something to think about.
 
MrsWildweasel said:
I wouldn't trade our pellet stoves for anything.[grin] There is a big difference in heat. Our house will be nice and toasty, and when I go to my mother in laws it feels cool.
Hubby's aunt and uncle have the insert. They are happy with it.
We also decided the next stove we get will also have the ability to burn corn as well as pellets. Something to think about.
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???? I'm not familiar with this technolgy. Yeah, he loves that stove and they're stylish too with the glass front and all you get the ambiance of the fire too.
 
News Shooter said:
No problem...do you have any idea what the hook up costs might be?
Does it makes sense for a place that small or would a kerosene heater be more efficient?
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for me I think it would be worth it but you have to decide what you need to get by during an outage. I don't know if it's legal to use those heaters indoors. my father had a couple when we were kids and I think I remember him saying something about them not being legal for in home use.

That doesn't mean he was right though. lol.
 
sksguns said:
???? I'm not familiar with this technolgy. Yeah, he loves that stove and they're stylish too with the glass front and all you get the ambiance of the fire too.
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They have stoves that burn dried corn or both pellets or corn. One of hubbys aunt and uncle have a corn stove. They are potato farmers and get their corn from another farmer.[grin]
 
They do make Pellet inserts, but they hold a lot less fuel. Speaking of fuel, do your homework as getting it delivered by the ton can be a LOT cheaper than buying bags if you have the space to store it.

BTW, Pellet stoves need power to drive the screw that feeds the fuel. However, Most designs can be powered with a 12v battery, so a quick trip to WalMart for a marine battery will be in order.
 
sksguns said:
for me I think it would be worth it but you have to decide what you need to get by during an outage. I don't know if it's legal to use those heaters indoors. my father had a couple when we were kids and I think I remember him saying something about them not being legal for in home use.

That doesn't mean he was right though. lol.
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Since it's just me and a small place I think i'll just stoke up the fireplace and wrap myself up[wink]
Thanks
 
Chris said:
They do make Pellet inserts, but they hold a lot less fuel. Speaking of fuel, do your homework as getting it delivered by the ton can be a LOT cheaper than buying bags if you have the space to store it.

BTW, Pellet stoves need power to drive the screw that feeds the fuel. However, Most designs can be powered with a 12v battery, so a quick trip to WalMart for a marine battery will be in order.
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I have tons of Marine Batteries lying around....lol
 
News Shooter said:
Since it's just me and a small place I think i'll just stoke up the fireplace and wrap myself up[wink]
Thanks
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Years ago my friend's father built a duplex in Newton. He rented one side with his new wife. My girlfriend and I were over there on a saturday evening having dinner and watching a movie. A thunder banger moved though and the powere went out. In no time the generator kicked on and we were back to watching the movie....every light in the house was on...the exterior lights were on and there was a crowd of people wandering around aimlessly outside with flashlights not knowing what to do....some standing in front of the house wondering why we had power. That was a pretty funny evening.
 
sksguns said:
check the depot. they have whole house units for around $3,500.00..but that doesn't include the auto switching panel, electrician and plumber.
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Why would you need a plumber for hooking up a generator transfer switch? A licensed electrician can hook up a small transfer panel adjacent to your main breaker panel. Automatic switches are convenient but hardly necessary. Gen-Tran is a common name in transfer panels and they are relatively short money for the equipment. If your electrician charges you more than $400-500 (not including the cost of the panel) to hook it up you are being robbed. If you are having your electrical service upgraded, you can ask for a panel with switching capability built in. Again, more $$$ but safe and convenient. I do these jobs all the time.
 
I spent the sum total of about $50 to hook mine up: a double-pole 30amp breaker, 50' of romex, and a plug for the generator. Flip off the main, start your generator, flip on your gen breaker and you're in business.
 
Executive said:
Why would you need a plumber for hooking up a generator transfer switch? A licensed electrician can hook up a small transfer panel adjacent to your main breaker panel. Automatic switches are convenient but hardly necessary. Gen-Tran is a common name in transfer panels and they are relatively short money for the equipment. If your electrician charges you more than $400-500 (not including the cost of the panel) to hook it up you are being robbed. If you are having your electrical service upgraded, you can ask for a panel with switching capability built in. Again, more $$$ but safe and convenient. I do these jobs all the time.
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Not for the generator transfer switch. Since the units I reference were not portables I did assume that one would use either propane or natural gas as that's the way most of the standby generator units are sold and as such you need a plumber or gasfitter to connect the fuel feeds. If you are using gasoline (as in a portable) or diesel then I would think you wouldn't need a plumber...
 
PatMcD said:
I spent the sum total of about $50 to hook mine up: a double-pole 30amp breaker, 50' of romex, and a plug for the generator. Flip off the main, start your generator, flip on your gen breaker and you're in business.
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WARNING:
Not only is this illegal, but the risk you are not only taking on yourself, but some poor bastard that is a mile down the road working on the outage.

Backfeeding is a very dangerous condition in which electricity from your generator flows back through your electrical panel and meter into the utility company's electrical system.

Backfeeding can occur when a generator is connected to your home wiring system without disconnecting from the utility power. The most common way this could occur is if you directly connect a generator to your electrical panel or to a circuit in your home.

If you feed power back into the utility system during an outage, you will energize the transformer serving your house. This poses an electrocution hazard for utility company line crews and for your neighbors who may not know the lines are energized. If the utility company's power is restored while your generator is backfeeding, your generator may be severely damaged, or there may be an electrical fire in your home.

How Can Backfeeding Be Prevented?

The simple answer is to always keep generator power and utility power isolated from each other.

Permanent generators are isolated from the utility's electrical system with a transfer switch installed between the generator and the electrical panel. The transfer switch allows power to be fed from only one source at a time.

Portable generators are usually connected directly to an appliance or piece of equipment through an extension cord. As long as the equipment is not hard-wired to the building's electrical panel, there is no path back to the panel. Transfer switches are available to safely connect portable generators to building electrical systems.

Can't I accomplish the same thing by throwing the main breaker?

Not safely. Simple circuit breakers do not make a positive disconnection between the home electric system and the generator system. What's more, they've been known to fail. And, the consequences are pretty high if it does fail. The only safe way to create a positive disconnection between the two electric systems is through the use of a transfer switch.

Generators can provide comfort, safety and security during power outages and emergencies, and can be installed temporarily during these situations. A generator must be installed properly to protect electrical utility workers, family members and property. Improper installation of your portable generator and transfer switch system could void your home owner's insurance in case of accident or injury.

A manual transfer switch is the key to safe and convenient operation of portable generators for standby power. By isolating those circuits using generator power, a transfer switch eliminates the rick of backfeeding the electrical utility which can cause injury to workers and property damage. By installing a transfer switch or transfer panel at your breaker box and connecting a generator to the transfer switch, you can run selected appliances such as a furnace, well pump (which cannot be run with standard extension cords), sump pump, refrigerator, television, computer, printer or lighting circuit during a power outage, depending on the capacity of your generator. Since many home standby generators cannot handle all of these loads at the same time, the transfer switch allows you to manually transfer each of these loads separately whenever you need them. Good planning requires that you determine the wattage output you need before buying a generator. The generator's wattage output should at least meet or exceed the total rated watts of the equipment you will operate in case of an outage.
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Migmojo said:
Where I live in Chelmsford, the power goes out a lot. It's not much of an issue except when the ground water level is high. This past spring I had water in my basement twice. Cleaning up is no fun.
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A recent episode of Ask This Old House addressed this very problem.

There is a backup system available that generates suction using water pressure (this assumes you are on city water). The pump is installed in parallel to the existing pipe and all you have to do is move the lever to allow the water to flow through. This generates suction and pumps out your sump.
 
Mr Weebles said:
A recent episode of Ask This Old House addressed this very problem.

There is a backup system available that generates suction using water pressure (this assumes you are on city water). The pump is installed in parallel to the existing pipe and all you have to do is move the lever to allow the water to flow through. This generates suction and pumps out your sump.
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Thanks for the info. Do you have the specific site address for that article? I have a portable generator now which I plan on hooking up to a transfer switch. I'll still have to be here to turn it on though.
 
Yeah, I found it here.

Description:

Installing a water-powered backup sump pump.
Richard helps a homeowner who is worried about his sump pump not working in the event of a power outage. Richard recommends a "backup" sump pump that is powered by municipal water instead of electricity. When the primary pump fails, the backup pump kicks in. The pump uses 1 gallon of city water for every 2 gallons of water drawn out of the sump pit. Richard mounts the backup pump on a nearby wall, making sure that the float sits slightly above the float for the primary pump. That way, it will only activate when the primary pump fails and water rises in the sump pit. The backup pump requires a 3/4" water supply line to power it, to Richard has to run new copper pipe over to the sump pit. Richard decides to tie the PVC discharge pipe for the backup pump into the existing discharge pipe for the primary pump using a "Y" fitting. Richard also installs a "check valve" on the backup pump's discharge pipe to make sure water never runs back down into the sump pit when the pump stops running.
Where to Find It

Guardian backup sump pump (model #747H20)
Manufacturer: A.Y. McDonald Mfg. Co.
4800 Chavenelle Rd
Dubuque, IA 52002
800-292-2737
www.aymcdonald.com
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Good luck.
 
dixidawg said:
I can't believe nobody mentioned a wood stove! You can heat the house and cook with it. Although cordwood is getting expensive, it can be had cheap by scrounging after storms and through the state's cut a cord program...
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Could you tell me more about this? We heat about 60% with wood,
and I spend a lot of the spring scrounging downed trees and logs
to make up the 3 cords I need. for the next year. We cut on
friends' and family's land, but it is always good to have more sources
so you don't have to tap the same well too often.

Thanks,
F
 
what to do if your electric heat goes out?
Set up a few tents in your house to keep warm...works great if you have a dog or two as well....they'll keep the temp up in the tent.

If you have a fireplace set them up there, and close off other areas of the house by tacking blankets up in hallways or over doors to keep the heat in where you're sleeping.

Who says tents are just for sleeping outside?
 
I didn't read the entire thread here, but here's a suggestion. Force a power failure. Turn the power off when you go to bed on Friday night. Don't turn it on until Saturday or Sunday night. See what goes wrong. Solve those problems.
 
Yet one more nice thing about Westford Sportsmen's Club. Our arborist regularly marks trees that members are free to cut and take. A cord of firewood for a little sweat equity and a nominal donation to the scholarship fund is getting more valuable every season.

Ken
 
Programmable thermostat. What's a good one? Do they all take the same current/voltage? I have an old mechanical programmable one which I'm not fond of and want to replace.

Thanks.
 
PatMcD said:
I spent the sum total of about $50 to hook mine up: a double-pole 30amp breaker, 50' of romex, and a plug for the generator. Flip off the main, start your generator, flip on your gen breaker and you're in business.
Click to expand...

Me too. Just make sure you only have one breaker engauged at a time.

Adam_MA said:
WARNING:
Not only is this illegal, but the risk you are not only taking on yourself, but some poor bastard that is a mile down the road working on the outage.
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The posted quote sounds like it was writen by a company making switch panels.

Breakers are bullet proof. That is why it is acceptable to ensure a circuit is de-engerized by LO/TO of a breaker.

I will admit the method requires strict adherence to administrative controls where the switch over is a very clean method the prevents any chance of an issue. But then we on this board are used to administrative controls in handling our firearms.
 
matt said:
Breakers are bullet proof. That is why it is acceptable to ensure a circuit is de-engerized by LO/TO of a breaker.
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[rofl][rofl][rofl]

Breakers bullet proof, huh? Ask any reputable electrician about Federal Pacific circuit breakers. Think about what happens to the internal parts of a circuit breaker when moisture enters the panel. (A common occurance.) Circuit breakers, like any mechanical device, can and do fail.

Your ignorance on this matter suggests that you should get some formal training before continuing the dangerous practice of doing electrical work.

I suggest you begin with the NEC Article 404, Switches; and OSHA 1910 Subpart J, Lock-out / Tag-out.
 
Executive said:
[rofl][rofl][rofl]

Breakers bullet proof, huh? Ask any reputable electrician about Federal Pacific circuit breakers. Think about what happens to the internal parts of a circuit breaker when moisture enters the panel. (A common occurance.) Circuit breakers, like any mechanical device, can and do fail.

Your ignorance on this matter suggests that you should get some formal training before continuing the dangerous practice of doing electrical work.

I suggest you begin with the NEC Article 404, Switches; and OSHA 1910 Subpart J, Lock-out / Tag-out.
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Funny, that's not how I read it from your own source [rolleyes]:
http://www.osha.gov/pls/oshaweb/owadisp.show_document?p_table=STANDARDS&p_id=9804

Energy isolating device. A mechanical device that physically prevents the transmission or release of energy, including but not limited to the following: A manually operated electrical circuit breaker; a disconnect switch; a manually operated switch by which the conductors of a circuit can be disconnected from all ungrounded supply conductors, and, in addition, no pole can be operated independently; a line valve; a block; and any similar device used to block or isolate energy. Push buttons, selector switches and other control circuit type devices are not energy isolating devices.
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Placing a lock out device on the circuit breaker is acceptable, and common practice. Of course no LO/TO procedure is complete without a verification that energy is isolated. I don't have the NEC book handy, but I'm pretty confident it won't disagree.
 

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