I'm having major space problems and need something quick, and was wondering if those heavy-duty Rubbermaid storage cabinets (or deck boxes, etc.) with a padlock on it are MA legal for storage of ammo? (Inside the house, of course! A deck box with ammo wouldn't actually be on my deck.) It seems fine to me since they are quite sturdy and would take some work to get into, more so than just a toolbox would. Any problems with this idea (other than an outdoor storage cabinet being inside looks a bit silly)?
-
If you enjoy the forum please consider supporting it by signing up for a NES Membership The benefits pay for the membership many times over.
-
Be sure to enter the NES/MFS May Giveaway ***Canik METE SFX***
Rubbermaid storage cabinet legal for ammo?
- Thread starter Prepper
- Start date
Yup, pretty much any locked container should work for the purposes of 527 CMR 13.00. The exact wording of the regulation is "shall be stored in original containers and such containers shall be stored in a locked cabinet, closet or box when not in use". It doesn't contain the "render [...] inoperable by any person other than the owner or other lawfully authorized user" wording that 131L (weapon storage law) has.
"stored in original containers"
I've often wondered how strict the enforcement of this "original containers" requirement would be if it were discovered, for example, that maybe I had put fully loaded magazines back in the safe, forgetting to empty the cartridges back into their original boxes, after a trip to the range. For example.
I'm thinking nobody would ever charge you with that if they were to inspect your house. Then again, this is mass.
As far as "original containers" what about the ammo i get that's loose in a box? in that case it doesn't have a fitted section of the box. Like the box of 100 9mm Luger Winchester i have. What if the original box becomes damaged an unusable? Can i substitute another container?
I'm sure that "reasonable" people would just be more concerned to see you have it be behind a lock.
What about ammo you reload? there's technically no "original" box.
As far as "original containers" what about the ammo i get that's loose in a box? in that case it doesn't have a fitted section of the box. Like the box of 100 9mm Luger Winchester i have. What if the original box becomes damaged an unusable? Can i substitute another container?
I'm sure that "reasonable" people would just be more concerned to see you have it be behind a lock.
What about ammo you reload? there's technically no "original" box.
Yes, I've always hoped that anybody reasonable would ignore the 'original container' bit, as it's incredibly goofy. It's especially annoying with black powder, because bp pretty much only comes in 1 lb containers and you're not allowed to have more than 2 lbs without a permit. So if you want three different types of bp (which is extremely easy to want if you have a couple different types of bp guns) you automatically need to get a permit, because you're usually forced into keeping more than 2 lbs of it due to the 'original container' wording.
Keep in mind a few things wrt ammo storage:
- The CMR puts this under the State Fire Marshal's jurisdiction. Therefore, any enforcement is under your local FIRE Chief . . . NOT police chief.
As my Fire Chief admitted, locks have nothing to do with fire safety (purpose of these CMRs by law).
It becomes obvious that while we (gun owners) were watching the front door (actions by legislators, police chiefs), someone in the anti-gun movement snuck in the back door (State Fire Marshal) to pull a fast one on us while nobody was looking. [If one "studies" how/who gets to be a State Fire Marshal, you will realize that it is a POLITICAL appointment by the Governor and the person does NOT have to be a firefighter or really know a damn thing about fire fighting! I did some consulting for a person who held that position many years ago . . . he was also a Deputy Registrar of Motor Vehicles at one time . . . all political appointments because he was a rich entrepreneur and very well connected scumbag.]
In general the "original container" issue (per Fire Chief) is important for storage of all powders, as the containers are designed with a pressure "weak spot" to avoid exploding. "Original containers" do nothing for fire safety wrt cartridge storage.
After any loss, your insurance company can make it an issue (use it as an out to deny coverage) wrt improper storage of ammo, but indications that I've been given are that you will not be prosecuted for it (and knowing this, it is very UNlikely that the local fire chief will write that level of detail into his report, according to what I've been told). YMMV
- The CMR puts this under the State Fire Marshal's jurisdiction. Therefore, any enforcement is under your local FIRE Chief . . . NOT police chief.
As my Fire Chief admitted, locks have nothing to do with fire safety (purpose of these CMRs by law).
It becomes obvious that while we (gun owners) were watching the front door (actions by legislators, police chiefs), someone in the anti-gun movement snuck in the back door (State Fire Marshal) to pull a fast one on us while nobody was looking. [If one "studies" how/who gets to be a State Fire Marshal, you will realize that it is a POLITICAL appointment by the Governor and the person does NOT have to be a firefighter or really know a damn thing about fire fighting! I did some consulting for a person who held that position many years ago . . . he was also a Deputy Registrar of Motor Vehicles at one time . . . all political appointments because he was a rich entrepreneur and very well connected scumbag.]
In general the "original container" issue (per Fire Chief) is important for storage of all powders, as the containers are designed with a pressure "weak spot" to avoid exploding. "Original containers" do nothing for fire safety wrt cartridge storage.
After any loss, your insurance company can make it an issue (use it as an out to deny coverage) wrt improper storage of ammo, but indications that I've been given are that you will not be prosecuted for it (and knowing this, it is very UNlikely that the local fire chief will write that level of detail into his report, according to what I've been told). YMMV
I would argue that ammo in the magazine is not being "stored" because it is in the magazine as personal defense ammo. So long as you only keep your personal defense ammo in one or two magazines, I think you are covered under any personal defense exceptions and/or the recent supreme court case.
Having worked at home depot, I can tell you that all of the Rubbermaid brand deck boxes, utility sheds, etc. that they sell, are crap as far as safe storage goes. I sold all kinds of them. They are nice but only to keep your rusty shovels in. With most of the models, all you have to do is pick it up and shake it up and down and voila! you're in.
You're keeping it indoors though, so I wouldn't be worried. But if you plan on putting it outside for the future with something else in it, I would not recommend it.
You're keeping it indoors though, so I wouldn't be worried. But if you plan on putting it outside for the future with something else in it, I would not recommend it.
With several wooden cases of ammo in the deck box, it is going to be hard to lift it up and give it a shake. I did notice while assembling that the floor's connection to the rest of it is an easy alternate entry point, although it is hard to get underneath that floor to disconnect the pieces if the whole thing can't be lifted. If I did have to break into my own deck box, I'd either cut the lock, or maybe try to take a saw to the plastic hinges. Or insert pry bar under the lid (easy to fit it in there) and see what gives way first.
I failed to even think about the ammo. Please don't smack me with a newspaper.
You could also easily melt the eyelet where the lock goes, if you are dumb enough to put an open flame that close to ammo. Then again, a dumb robber wouldn't know what was in it unless you spray painted "ammo box" on the thing.
You could also easily melt the eyelet where the lock goes, if you are dumb enough to put an open flame that close to ammo. Then again, a dumb robber wouldn't know what was in it unless you spray painted "ammo box" on the thing.
The original packing requirement has nothing to do with politics. I've spoken at length to fire chiefs and fire fighters about storage requirements of various materials. Their biggest concern is to be able to identify a flammable or dangerous area of your house when they show up to put out a fire. Nothing is scarier to firemen than a house full of unidentified flammables laying around various sections of a building in flames. If they can a least know what is dangerous and what is not they can concentrate their efforts accordingly without blowing up themselves or your house. Most fire chiefs have no political agenda in mind when they suggest regulations or codes.
