Shooting reported outside Empire State Building

newportri said:
So do you think they were aiming at innocent bystanders since they hit a few of them? The police (and anyone else in a similar situation) is responsible for every shot fired regardless where it hits, and I expect the police to be held accountable. I can see some big lawsuits coming...

I don't consider shooting a pistol being "extra special training", it should be mandatory training for all LEO. Unfortunately, many don't practice more than what's required by their department and you end up with innocent bystanders getting shot.
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No, I'm saying if they hit a lot of bystanders, they need better/different/new training to reflect the "in real life" situations they're going to be in. I know that me shooting at static paper targets won't be of much help in a real gunfight. I doubt the average beat cop in NYC gets more than 50 rounds at a couple of paper targets. It's expensive. [thinking]
 
<---is patiently waiting to see what else has been said.....lol.

kvesi122 said:
Capture4.png


Ehhhh is it worth it to say anything to OP?

Edit:

Screw it I almost bit my tongue off trying to hold back from saying anything.
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...I say guns should go...
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But let's keep the homicidal maniacs that do these types of things and then glorify all over the media so every potential copycat knows that he/she will be famous by doing the same thing. And to top it all off, lets blame an inanimate object for the entire thing so that we don't have to deal with the REAL PROBLEMS!

One simple post, so much fail.
 
Palladin said:
Watching msnbc. Shooter had a 1911 with 8rd mag. He took out his former boss, 2 in the head, walked past the building security guard, who according to a witness, was hiding under the desk. Construction worker outside notified Leo on foot patrol, others in cruisers arrived. Prep drew on Leo they returned fire causing the nine bystander injuries!!!!

Awesome.
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Interesting as initial news reports suggested the 'shooter' was firing indiscriminately. I would imagine the situation was chaotic and it might have been hard to tell where the shots actually came from unless you saw the shooter.
 
Palladin said:
Watching msnbc. Shooter had a 1911 with 8rd mag. He took out his former boss, 2 in the head, walked past the building security guard, who according to a witness, was hiding under the desk. Construction worker outside notified Leo on foot patrol, others in cruisers arrived. Prep drew on Leo they returned fire causing the nine bystander injuries!!!!

Awesome.
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Do I understand this correctly that the shooter had one kill and the police took out 9 bystanders and the shooter?
 
I wonder how quickly this is all going to be buried? By looking at the bullets, its simple enough to tell who really did the shootings, but I'm thinking we won't get to learn that info. In the end, it will mysteriously all be the gunman, and heroic cops.
 
OfficerObie59 said:
I qualify with my department once a year. In the Army Reserve, I qualified twice a year.

I don't go to war everyday.
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And the NYC department is huge, what 30k+ officers? A box of cartridges and a paper target isn't going to get them prepared for this kind of thing. If we're going to delegate responsibility to police so completely they have in NYC, you damn well better train them good.

But hey, maybe it's cheaper in the long run to pay off a bunch of families when this kind of thing happens. But that's crappy math, IMO.
 
It seems like as more info comes out about this thing, and the greater the potential for the cops being the ones who shot the most people... the media lingo is already changing.

First it was 11 shot, then wounded, injured, hurt... now grazed. Coming soon, "nicked"
 
pdm said:
And the NYC department is huge, what 30k+ officers? A box of cartridges and a paper target isn't going to get them prepared for this kind of thing. If we're going to delegate responsibility to police so completely they have in NYC, you damn well better train them good.
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Yet at the same time we have legit concerns over police training and equipping themselves as though for war.

How do we balance having police that are part of the community YET ready to go into action against overwhelming odds or at least sudden and aggressive nuts?
 
Prepper said:
I wonder how quickly this is all going to be buried? By looking at the bullets, its simple enough to tell who really did the shootings, but I'm thinking we won't get to learn that info. In the end, it will mysteriously all be the gunman, and heroic cops.
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yeah, 9mm - NYPD = G17/G19??? 45auto - shooter = 1911. -but i agree. they'll say they have "forensics" on it or something.
 
namedpipes said:
Yet at the same time we have legit concerns over police training and equipping themselves as though for war.

How do we balance having police that are part of the community YET ready to go into action against overwhelming odds or at least sudden and aggressive nuts?
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Well, they don't need 80# of gear and kitted out for war, but let's be honest, they all need dynamic training. They are policing a bigass city with a lot of bystanders, not static paper targets. I'm sure it's just a matter of money.
 
pdm said:
Well, they don't need 80# of gear and kitted out for war, but let's be honest, they all need dynamic training. They are policing a bigass city with a lot of bystanders, not static paper targets. I'm sure it's just a matter of money.
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I agree. I just wonder if the knee jerk response might be to increase the "battle-readiness" of the PD.
 
pdm said:
Probably. It's cheaper to load them down with gear than to provide ongoing training.
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Just what I was going to say. Its probably cheaper, less time consuming, and more intimidating to throw on a bunch of tacticool gear than to actually train and develop some skills.
 
pdm said:
Well, they don't need 80# of gear and kitted out for war, but let's be honest, they all need dynamic training. They are policing a bigass city with a lot of bystanders, not static paper targets. I'm sure it's just a matter of money.
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They do have special training. Stop and frisk. I don't know how this guy got by them.
 
Bloomberg probably did the math and figured it was cheaper to settle lawsuits by innocent bystanders being shot than to pay for ammo for LEO to become better shooters.
 
Good thing it wasn't a crowded theater! Bystanders should be running when the cops show up from the sound of it
 
namedpipes said:
Do I understand this correctly that the shooter had one kill and the police took out 9 bystanders and the shooter?
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Yup, that's kinda what it looks like. Tv showed 17 of the CSI type shell casing markers on the street!!

"we're the police and we're here to help !"

Lawsuits will probably start Monday.
 
Bloomberg said "Thanks to all the heroes that helped out to keep this from being much worse".

Seems to me the "heroes" caused the extra carnage. If they just let the shooter go, that would have kept the injuries down to 1.
 
Yup the press is referring to today's events as another "mass shooting."

Whackjob targets ONE former co-worker, and shoots him three times.

Police respond, and perhaps this guy returns fire (in self-defense?).

Police shoot several innocent bystanders.

Yup. "mass shooting" is wicked accurate...
 
Scarecrow said:
Unless I miss my guess, it was a homocidal cow that cannot be stopped by normal bullets. Check the palm trees. Scarecrow out.
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Ive been having mixed results with palm trees lately but this was spot on. Also early reports from witnesses say the cow kept yelling something about 'eat more chikin' while firing wildly.
 
Harry Temple: All right, pop quiz. Crowded New York City street, gunman with no hostages. He's next to a building; he's pointing a gun at you. You're a hundred feet away... Jack?
Jack: Death Blossom. Shoot all the bystanders and then shoot the gunman.
 

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