Supreme Court - NYSRPA v. Bruen - Megathread

[DungeBerry63]

Was it by voicemail or email?
If by email then forward the email back to them and CC Com2a with a notice that you are demanding a response within 7 days AND would like all records of your license decisions held for discovery.
In other words, you have 7 days or I will be filing a civil rights lawsuit. Then back it up - all of this assuming you have a squeaky clean past that would make it a slam dunk in anything other than a Mass kangaroo court

I’ve left multiple voicemails and no response not even a return call so a total of 3 calls one of them where they denied me getting my restrictions removed and two of them no response at all

 

[Mesatchornug]

Easier said then done no one is responding to calls or voicemails in going in personally Monday and demand

There are likely many licensees calling them right now. Even if we give them the benefit of the doubt, they could be flooded with calls.

Emails are discoverable. And easier to provide to COMM2A. Some version of the message @pastera wrote recently would be a great way to get things in writing.

 

[DungeBerry63]

Send details, including LTC expiration date, to [email protected]

Just sent them a email !

 

[VetteGirlMA]

Was it by voicemail or email?
If by email then forward the email back to them and CC Com2a with a notice that you are demanding a response within 7 days AND would like all records of your license decisions held for discovery.
In other words, you have 7 days or I will be filing a civil rights lawsuit. Then back it up - all of this assuming you have a squeaky clean past that would make it a slam dunk in anything other than a Mass kangaroo court

You know this got me thinking about MA machine gun licenses. Wouldn't Bruen also impact these licenses as well? Why do I need an FFL as a prerequisite to applying for the license?

 

[SFC13557]

Yup and FPC.

Just made donations to each and joined FPC.

 

[Mesatchornug]

You know this got me thinking about MA machine gun licenses. Wouldn't Bruen also impact these licenses as well? Why do I need an FFL as a prerequisite to applying for the license?

Until someone pushes? Because they're unusual. That same push might reverse Miller...

 

[DungeBerry63]

If I was to carry with the restrictions on my license what’s the worst that could happen ?

 

[VetteGirlMA]

Until someone pushes? Because they're unusual. That same push might reverse Miller...

Let's be honest the logic behind the Miller decision is in 2022 completely flawed and no longer relevant. If there ever were a scotus decision ripe for overturning it's Miller. The logic in the decision itself is its own destruction.

But my bigger question is, Bruen doesn't say there are carveouts for machine guns or anything considered 'unusual'. So for licensing purposes why wouldn't Bruen hold there as well? It's not like I can get a machine gun license today and go out and buy one tomorrow. I still need a tax stamp and paperwork, a whole pile of cash and quite a long period of time to own one.

 

[Mesatchornug]

Let's be honest the logic behind the Miller decision is in 2022 completely flawed and no longer relevant. If there ever were a scotus decision ripe for overturning it's Miller. The logic in the decision itself is its own destruction.

But my bigger question is, Bruen doesn't say there are carveouts for machine guns or anything considered 'unusual'. So for licensing purposes why wouldn't Bruen hold there as well? It's not like I can get a machine gun license today and go out and buy one tomorrow. I still need a tax stamp and paperwork, a whole pile of cash and quite a long period of time to own one.

Completely agreed. As we've discussed, even at the time, the rationale was tenuous at best. Now we're in a better place than ever to go after it (and most of the NFA, really).

 

[KBCraig]

A number of other lawyers and staff left the old firm and followed them too. Clement is a big time appellate lawyer.

As U.S. Solicitor General, he successfully argued for the government.

As a private attorney, he successfully argued against the government.

I believe he has had more SCOTUS appearances than anyone else.

 

[Bladerunner]

Just sent them a email !

You're a good boy, a very good boy.

 

[Bladerunner]

If I was to carry with the restrictions on my license what’s the worst that could happen ?

Chicks might actually start to like you?

 

[Rob Boudrie]

If I was to carry with the restrictions on my license what’s the worst that could happen ?

1. You could be charged and hear those words "my retainer is" from your attorney. Chances of conviction very unlikely
2. You could, forever, be required to explain the arrest on any future LTC application and hope you don't need to hire an attorney to overcome a suitability rejection.

 

[Rob Boudrie]

Do you intend this for @DungeBerry63 or would it be helpful for both of us to send? To be clear, they lifted my restriction, they refused to lift his. Both first time Medford restricted licensees.

Send em all, let the Comm2A team sort them out. We generally like spare plaintiffs when bringing legal action.

 

[Bladerunner]

Send em all, let the Comm2A team sort them out. We generally like spare plaintiffs when bringing legal action.

Plaintiffs are deemed suitable or not by the Comm2A Chief of Litigation.

 

[DungeBerry63]

You're a good boy, a very good boy.

Ruff ruff

 

[DungeBerry63]

Yea not wort

1. You could be charged and hear those words "my retainer is" from your attorney. Chances of conviction very unlikely
2. You could, forever, be required to explain the arrest on any future LTC application and hope you don't need to hire an attorney to overcome a suitability rejection.

Yea that’s not good at all

 

[DungeBerry63]

Chicks might actually start to like you?

You think ???

 

[Bladerunner]

My girlfriends face when she found out that Medford PD is still cucked, post Bruen:

 

[Hoover]

As U.S. Solicitor General, he successfully argued for the government.

As a private attorney, he successfully argued against the government.

I believe he has had more SCOTUS appearances than anyone else.

There a deputy solicitor general who has 150 cases. He’s been in that position for decades, so it’s not apple to apples.

 

[crispnipz]

1. You could be charged and hear those words "my retainer is" from your attorney. Chances of conviction very unlikely
2. You could, forever, be required to explain the arrest on any future LTC application and hope you don't need to hire an attorney to overcome a suitability rejection.

Why would he get arrested if, even prior to Bruen, MGL states that carrying on a restricted license is only a fine and cause for license revocation. Is that really arrestable? And if so, what is the charge called?

 

[vicorjh]

Matt Hoover and the Auto Key Card.



Suit is calling out NFA.


View: https://youtu.be/kahaWSrU5nc

 

[Mesatchornug]

Why would he get arrested if, even prior to Bruen, MGL states that carrying on a restricted license is only a fine and cause for license revocation. Is that really arrestable? And if so, what is the charge called?

Contempt of cop.

They can arrest you simply because they don't correctly understand the law.

 

[PappyM3]

Contempt of cop.

They can arrest you simply because they don't correctly understand the law.

And if you question them too much about the unjustified arrest, they’ll charge you with resisting arrest. And when they find out that they can’t actually charge you for the original non-crime, they’ll still keep that “resisting arrest” charge there. Resisting arrest for an unlawful arrest.

 

[Picton]

If I was to carry with the restrictions on my license what’s the worst that could happen ?

Some posters here would get their feathers ruffled.

Seriously, once you start, whether you wait for your "new license" or not, you'll learn what all the rest of us have: that, while you know you're carrying, and feel like you're printing enough to be seen from three counties away, the OVERWHELMING majority of people in MA (cops included) can't see your gun. And even if they can, they'll assume it's a cellphone or something.

Your chances of getting "caught" are almost nil. And, if caught in the post-Bruen environment, your chances of anything happening to you are even niller. If that's a word.

 

[Waher]

Seriously, once you start, whether you wait for your "new license" or not, you'll learn what all the rest of us have: that, while you know you're carrying, and feel like you're printing enough to be seen from three counties away, the OVERWHELMING majority of people in MA (cops included) can't see your gun. And even if they can, they'll assume it's a cellphone or something.

24hrs later, some poor dumb bastard prints, freaks out Spongebob style in front of an oblivious MBTA cop playing Soduku on his phone, accidently moves the wrong way to the point their flabby gut pushes out and drops his shit nylon holster (containing a .40S&W Taurus) dramatically skipping/tumbling down the entire length of the escalators at Porter Square Station (edit: for those of you that don't know, that subway station is deep underground and the escalators/stairs are the length of a damn football field) resulting in a panic at rush hour, full SWAT response from mutual aid all the way out to the Berkshires, and NES has a Mega-thread shitting on the skinflint.

 

[Picton]

24hrs later, some poor dumb bastard prints, freaks out Spongebob style in front of a oblivious MBTA cop playing Soduku on his phone, accidently moves the wrong way to the point their flabby gut pushes out and drops his shit nylon holster (containing a .40S&W Taurus) dramatically skipping/tumbling down the entire length of the escalators at Porter Square Station resulting in a panic at rush hour, full SWAT response from mutual aid all the way out to the Berkshires, and NES has a Mega-thread shitting on the skinflint.

That seems... oddly specific...

 

[crispnipz]

Contempt of cop.

They can arrest you simply because they don't correctly understand the law.

And if you question them too much about the unjustified arrest, they’ll charge you with resisting arrest. And when they find out that they can’t actually charge you for the original non-crime, they’ll still keep that “resisting arrest” charge there. Resisting arrest for an unlawful arrest.

So funny story time: In my errant youth in college, I was feeling particularly angsty and flipped off a cop that was in his cruiser while we were in traffic. He quickly pulled me over into a parking lot and told me not to do it again. Of course when he walked away I flipped him off again. So he puts me in handcuffs and tells me I'm under arrest for disorderly conduct. Then we spend 20 minutes arguing and when another officer shows up, we debate whether hand signs are protected under 1A (which of course they are). He then lets me go and instead of an arrest (which of course would have been a lawsuit/expunged/et al), he saw that there was a crack in my windshield so he wrote me an equipment violation ticket for that.

So that day I came as close as you can be to getting arrested without actually getting arrested, and that day I learned what is technically legal is not always what is prudent.

 

[Mesatchornug]

That seems... oddly specific...

This definitely sounds like "don't ask how I know..."

 

[Coyote33]

OK, a whole lot of reading here. Can I ask something? What impact does the Bruen/NYSRPA case have on Massachusetts today?

I thought the immediate impact is the removal of "suitability" and the need to have reference letters/letters of recommendation for LTC's. Is this true or is it not true? If true, why has the state made other changes and "guidance"/suggestions for police departments, yet the state application itself still has the sections for these 2 things? Ditto for the many cities and towns who have their own applications modeled after the state's.

To shorten this up, it looks like the only thing which has changed so far is the removal of restrictions, but even THAT is still on the application form. See my earlier post here: POST # 2625