Third Massachusetts Judge Rules Suitability Unconstitutional

[42!]

My best guess is these judges are getting their PP slapped.. for being f***tards

Just overturning a denial
I doubt the state will appeal.

And that’s the point, right now these are district rulings from an administrative hearing. They do not set precedent. And they won’t appeal, because that could bring the law down for everyone.

 

[Darksideblues42]

Just overturning a denial
I doubt the state will appeal.

Especially since appeals build case law.

 

[puška m70]

That's great, as Bruen showed as well.

Still plenty of people out there with application denied or had theirs suspended because of "suitability." Meanwhile the claim of unsuitability is absolute BS at worst and subjective at best.

Hopefully that changes something for these groups

 

[MGnoob]

Hell yeah, ripping it up on a Thursday - make sure to hydrate and don't drive anywhere

If you haven’t gone to the bathroom at three or four days, you’ve definitely got a serious problem your hands

 

[Uzi2]

Seems odd that a MA judge would reverse his decision the next day. What’s their angle?

Staying out of federal prison?

 

[Boghog1]

Her. They have female judges too nowadays.

Courts have kitchens?

 

[nstassel]

Q

And that’s the point, right now these are district rulings from an administrative hearing. They do not set precedent. And they won’t appeal, because that could bring the law down for everyone.

See post 28.

 

[pastera]

That's great, as Bruen showed as well.

Still plenty of people out there with application denied or had theirs suspended because of "suitability." Meanwhile the claim of unsuitability is absolute BS at worst and subjective at best.

Hopefully that changes something for these groups

Don't forget Rahimi - even though it was a "loss" is wasn't a disaster.
Rahimi is early in defining for how long and for what reasons the RTKB can be lost. This is key since the states will run with any leeway left in a SCOTUS opinion.

 

[nstassel]

So this article is quite inaccurate about the holding. The judge only said that pre Bruen cases on the broad "may issue" discretion afforded the police aren't valid any more. She definitely didn't declare suitability unconstitutional.

 

[milktree]

So this article is quite inaccurate about the holding. The judge only said that pre Bruen cases on the broad "may issue" discretion afforded the police aren't valid any more. She definitely didn't declare suitability unconstitutional.

Does this mean that if you were denied for "suitability" *BEFORE* Bruen, you have a course of action to get your LTC, but anyone denied now, doesn't? That seems kinda weird.

 

[42!]

Q

See post 28.

so does that give us something that is binding? I don't think so, but thought I'd as the expert.

 

[pastera]

Already did appeal.

Great - they aren't very bright are they...

 

[fishgutzy]

Didn't SCOTUS already say that?

Yup. But MA rulers believe the US constitution doesn't exist in MA. the MASJC even ruled that the constitution doesn't protect any technology that did not exist in 1790.

 

[nstassel]

Does this mean that if you were denied for "suitability" *BEFORE* Bruen, you have a course of action to get your LTC, but anyone denied now, doesn't? That seems kinda weird.

I'm not sure how one could draw that conclusion.

 

[Parker Schreiber]

Seems odd that a MA judge would reverse his decision the next day. What’s their angle?

If I'm reading the secondary source correctly, the Judge in question is Richard Sinnott. If so, in 2019, he got into the news by refusing a prosecution request to dismiss charges against "Straight Pride" protesters and having the defense attorney arrested for contempt when they objected.

So is this an actual threat to the suitability scheme or just an overturning an LTC denial?

Massachusetts takes the position that it's suitability standard meets the "narrow, objective, and definite standards" test given as dicta in Bruen. If the judge's ruling rejects that assertion it's somewhat of a threat, but it does not establish precedent in itself. If, on the other hand, the judge ruled that the information forming the basis of the denial was not "reliable, articulable and credible," then they are simply applying the law as written.

 

[milktree]

I'm not sure how one could draw that conclusion.

"The judge only said that pre Bruen cases on the broad "may issue" discretion afforded the police aren't valid any more"

Can you rephrase then? I'm not sure what "pre Bruen cases" means.

 

[nstassel]

Can you rephrase then? I'm not sure what "pre Bruen cases" means.

The police cite cases that were decided before Bruen and the judge said they are no longer binding.

 

[Rob Boudrie]

2011 10 rounders cost more than standard capacity

That's because the manufacturer has to start with full capacity magazines and vandalize them.

 

[Rob Boudrie]

The police cite cases that were decided before Bruen and the judge said they are no longer binding.

Sort of like MA district courts citing Moyer v. Shelburne?

 

[dcmdon]

A couple of glasses of wine seem to help.

After trying to buy a spare mag or two for my P210s I’ve become numb to mag prices.

I bought spare mags for my 210 at the same time I bought the pistol. It hurt less that way. `

 

[Tartakovsky]

If you haven’t gone to the bathroom at three or four days, you’ve definitely got a serious problem your hands

Yeah, opioid addiction

 

[MGnoob]

Yeah, opioid addiction

I wish .. they say three days without water and 30 days without food. That’s a joke you be surprised what people are be capable of

 

[MGnoob]

Yeah, opioid addiction

I take it you never tasted desperate. It’s not a good look.

 

[MGnoob]

If this doesn’t resolve itself, I’m gonna have to go to the hospital and they all have cold fingers

 

[pastera]

Yup. But MA rulers believe the US constitution doesn't exist in MA. the MASJC even ruled that the constitution doesn't protect any technology that did not exist in 1790.

For which they got bitch slapped in Caetano.
They specifically call it out in Canjura.

 

[Coyote33]

Just overturning a denial
I doubt the state will appeal.

Already did appeal.

Especially since appeals build case law.

Q
See post 28.

Great - they aren't very bright are they...

Sounding "so far, so good".

Then there is this:

So this article is quite inaccurate about the holding. The judge only said that pre Bruen cases on the broad "may issue" discretion afforded the police aren't valid any more. She definitely didn't declare suitability unconstitutional.

Is this game on, or not?

 

[Picton]

Is this game on, or not?

The idea is that prior decisions will need to be re-litigated in light of the new Bruen standard.

To the extent that it's a MA judge admitting (even insisting) that the Bruen standard needs to be applied, it's a great thing. But it's not like this judge snapped her fingers and invalidated a whole bunch of MA gun laws or something.

 

[Coyote33]

The idea is that prior decisions will need to be re-litigated in light of the new Bruen standard.

To the extent that it's a MA judge admitting (even insisting) that the Bruen standard needs to be applied, it's a great thing. But it's not like this judge snapped her fingers and invalidated a whole bunch of MA gun laws or something.

Of course, that would only be if they even find out about this decision.

 

[pastera]

Of course, that would only be if they even find out about this decision.

That's what a good lawyer is for...

 

[appraiser]

I don't know if you've read up on the judge in that case that we're all talking about but when he was a investigator or something in another department he got into a beef with someone in Boston and shot the guy. so he knows first hand about second amendment rights