$69 for an NFA Gun Trust from 199trust.com

People've been using mail order and DIY Quicken trusts for years and getting their stamps just fine. Would I use a $69 mail order trust for my house, business, or an expensive NFA weapon(s)? Probably not, but for a $1000 rifle or a $200 suppressor it serves the purpose.
 
mikem317 said:
Too good to be true? Anybody initiate their trust through them?

Saw what appears to be a really good deal through Gearhog.com: http://www.gearhog.com/?did=67412
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Not sure about them, but Guntrust lawyer has a nicely written trust for $199. I even got quick email responses within minutes from the original lawyer who wrote the trust, David Goldman, answered some questions on a Sunday.
 
Probably does not matter where you buy your trust or how much you pay

I think guntrustlawyer is still charging $349-$800 for their trust, the $199 offer is only for the form-fill-scripted trust from guntrust.com? My gut feeling is that a software-generated trust, whether it costs $69 or $199, is almost certainly going to be the same quality no matter where you get it from.

The results from the guntrust.com site are just OK, I noticed the trust generated had a number of typographical errors and one place where terminology was used inconsistently, nothing that would invalidate the trust, just cosmetic imperfections. I know they say their trust is protected by copyright (a questionable claim at best) and they embed multiple forms of watermark in the documents produced, so I almost wonder if some of the flaws were part of their watermarking scheme.

If anybody else has a New Hampshire trust from guntrust.com I would be interested in comparing documents.
 
Kevin_NH said:
I think guntrustlawyer is still charging $349-$800 for their trust, the $199 offer is only for the form-fill-scripted trust from guntrust.com? My gut feeling is that a software-generated trust, whether it costs $69 or $199, is almost certainly going to be the same quality no matter where you get it from.

The results from the guntrust.com site are just OK, I noticed the trust generated had a number of typographical errors and one place where terminology was used inconsistently, nothing that would invalidate the trust, just cosmetic imperfections. I know they say their trust is protected by copyright (a questionable claim at best) and they embed multiple forms of watermark in the documents produced, so I almost wonder if some of the flaws were part of their watermarking scheme.

If anybody else has a New Hampshire trust from guntrust.com I would be interested in comparing documents.
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I believe Atilla used GTL.com. He said he had a lawyer friend look at it and said it was a well put together trust.

Perhaps he'll chime in on this.
 
rkwjunior said:
I believe Atilla used GTL.com. He said he had a lawyer friend look at it and said it was a well put together trust.

Perhaps he'll chime in on this.
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not so much well put together, but it was described as "boilerplate" and fitting the bill. it was written to do one thing, to be a trust for NFA items, and that's all it is.

can't vouch for the success of it with the ATF yet as i am still waiting on my corrected form 1. sent it back about 8 weeks ago.
 
$800 for guntrustlawyer.com, or $199 for guntrust.com's computer-generated trust.

mikem317 said:
How much is the trust formation service from guntrustlawyer.com? Not very clear from their website.
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The human lawyer-assisted service I think varies from state-to-state as they need to use a lawyer based in your state to draft the trust. In 2011 I called asking about a New Hampshire trust, was quoted a price of $800.

guntrustlawyer.com runs a form-filled computer generated service at "guntrust.com", which is a flat rate of $199. It delivers a "locked" PDF file with copyright notices on every page and a few minor typos.
 
I used guntrustlawyer.com (guntrust.com)'s basic $199 trust. I'm not planning on getting into real expensive NFA items - SBR(s) and suppressors (if I ever move to NH). The only thing I wish it would've done was to let me pick the name of the trust.

I had contacted a MA attorney who advertises that they do NFA trusts, and was told it was $100 for the initial consultation and they refused to even give me a non-binding ballpark figure for doing the trust. So, I went with guntrustlawyer.com instead.
 
exodious said:
I used guntrustlawyer.com (guntrust.com)'s basic $199 trust. I'm not planning on getting into real expensive NFA items - SBR(s) and suppressors (if I ever move to NH). The only thing I wish it would've done was to let me pick the name of the trust.
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I know what you mean. I ended up cracking the PDF just so I could do CTRL-A,CTRL-C (notepad) CTRL-V,CTRL-H in order to search-and-replace the name of the trust (and also fix the worst of the typos).
 
Are these guys still getting $600-$1000 for a trust? I wonder if people are rushing to buy them to get in a few items before June or if business is dying off in anticipation. I mean, if ATF kills the trust route on 1JUN, $600 seems a bit pricey for something that will only be useful for a few months. Unless it goes like mags/AR-parts then the price will go through the roof. But mags/ARs are still usable after the ban.
 
ATF is not "killing the trust route"

Came across this resource.. Anyone heard of it and is it good info? .../form1.html
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Yes, trusts and corporations can currently file via EForms, they may still be faster, or at least go to "pending" status sooner (see [thread=219564]the other thread about trusts[/thread] for why this might be important).

Schuyshot said:
Are these guys still getting $600-$1000 for a trust? I wonder if people are rushing to buy them to get in a few items before June or if business is dying off in anticipation. I mean, if ATF kills the trust route on 1JUN, $600 seems a bit pricey for something that will only be useful for a few months. Unless it goes like mags/AR-parts then the price will go through the roof. But mags/ARs are still usable after the ban.
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ATF is not "killing the trust route", 41P is only proposing to add the same annoying extra paperwork and delays for trusts and corporations as currently exists for individuals. The real concern with 41P is that it will lock out buyers who cannot get CLEO sign-off.

NFA Trusts are still useful even with the 41P rule change. There are legitimate reasons to use an NFA trust that go beyond just working around a gun-hating CLEO or not wanting to deal with fingerprint cards. A common use of a trust is to protect family members from prosecution under the NFA if they use (or simply have access to) an item regulated by the NFA that is not registered to them personally, and also provides for inheritance without re-registeration on ATF Form 5.
 
Kevin_NH said:
ATF is not "killing the trust route", 41P is only proposing to add the same annoying extra paperwork and delays for trusts and corporations as currently exists for individuals. The real concern with 41P is that it will lock out buyers who cannot get CLEO sign-off.

A common use of a trust is to protect family members from prosecution under the NFA if they use (or simply have access to) an item regulated by the NFA that is not registered to them personally, and also provides for inheritance without re-registeration on ATF Form 5.
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I see. I think inheritance is my big concern. I don't want my gear going to the heap when the clock runs out. Who knows what would be available then...

So I guess I'll be getting into the Trust market this year, instead of the suppressor/fun toys market....
 
exodious said:
Be careful because not all trusts are multi generational. The basic guntrustlawyer one isn't.
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Thats why I haven't gone to one of those fill-a-form websites. I don't have big money for a proper trust. Sigh... Poor student for a couple more years.


Hmmm... Wonder if they have NFA trust/item scholarships...
 
Schuyshot said:
Thats why I haven't gone to one of those fill-a-form websites. I don't have big money for a proper trust. Sigh... Poor student for a couple more years.


Hmmm... Wonder if they have NFA trust/item scholarships...
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I think the top of the line trust that guntrustlawyer.com offers is multi generational, not into perpetuity (there are lots of laws in various states prohibiting that) but at least for a couple generations. But their top trust is IIRC over $2000. The good news is that you can pay the difference and "upgrade" later if you wanted to.
 
OTOH, changing the trust later would probably trigger the changes in 41P and thus a round of fingerprinting for everybody involved in the trust.

Anybody have an updated estimated timeframe on new Form-1 stamps for trusts done via EForms? You could always do a Form-1 build-your-own suppressor and just pay for the trust and tax stamp(s) now, take your time buying and making the materials; there is no set timelimit to finish building a suppressor on a form 1.
 
So I'm gathering you guys would recommend guntrustlawyer.com? Im looking to get a few filed before June rolls around and the more I save on the trust the more $200 tax stamps I can send in!
 
Harkes2k said:
So I'm gathering you guys would recommend guntrustlawyer.com? Im looking to get a few filed before June rolls around and the more I save on the trust the more $200 tax stamps I can send in!
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I'd guess that any of these NFA trusts will be equally "good", as in correct enough to not be kicked back by BATFE. So unless you need a custom trust, go with whoever is least expensive.

Keep in mind that June is not an absolute date (could be sooner, could be never) and [post=3737192]there's no guarantee of earlier applications being grandfathered[/post].
 
As you know, a properly drafted gun trust accomplishes a number of important objectives (i.e., reducing ATF wait times, allows multiple legal users, and serves estate planning purposes). Working with an experienced gun trust attorney can help ensure you comply with the law and achieve these objectives for not much more than the cost of the do-it-yourself form. The quoted figure of $600-$1000 is far more than what I or any of my colleagues in other states charge for a gun trust. I'm happy to answer questions or provide referrals.
 
Now what if I'm thinking I want a barebones trust now for nfa purposes but in the future I want it to serve as a way to pass on my firearms to my kids can I change my existing trust to accommodate my future needs.
 
Harkes2k said:
Now what if I'm thinking I want a barebones trust now for nfa purposes but in the future I want it to serve as a way to pass on my firearms to my kids can I change my existing trust to accommodate my future needs.
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With a revocable trust, you can make changes to the beneficiaries down the road. Is there are reason why you'd prefer not to name your kids as beneficiaries now? You can name them as beneficiaries even if they aren't currently eligible to posses the firearms if that's your concern.
 
I was going more along the lines of getting a cheap barebones trust now from one of the above websites and then beefing it up later as the collection grows. Also I don't have kids yet but plan to in the future.

Also rough guesstimate how much were you talking about earlier in setting up a more robust trust for little more than the online ones?
 
I am currently preparing a group buy opportunity for NES members, but the price will be a flat fee of around $300. My NFA trusts are "robust" and, among other things, allow for flexibility for future acquisitions. Unlike the DIY online forms, I draft the trust based on the information you provide and include step by step guidance on execution and the ATF application process. Feel free to shoot me a PM for further information.

Harkes2k said:
I was going more along the lines of getting a cheap barebones trust now from one of the above websites and then beefing it up later as the collection grows. Also I don't have kids yet but plan to in the future.

Also rough guesstimate how much were you talking about earlier in setting up a more robust trust for little more than the online ones?
Click to expand...
 
I just filed a Form 1 using the Guntrustlawyer.com route this afternoon. It went pending immediately on the eForms site. We'll see how it goes from here.....
 

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