Army chooses Sig Sauer to build Next Generation Squad Weapon.

[facecrime]

Wait, what? Is new Sig M17 gay? Cause it's plastic or 'cause it's not 1911? I'm confused. It's not 6.5CM, so what is it? Although, I'm already gay so...need to know what I should be rocking to show it off.

Your .40 is enough

 

[PappyM3]

The new rifle is 2lbs heavier than the M4, which is expected. Stinks, but is expected.

However, the new machine gun is 4lbs lighter than the SAW is fantastic. Lighter plus a more potent cartridge.

Army expects Next Generation Squad Weapon to get to its first unit by next year

An unloaded XM5 rifle is two pounds heavier than an unloaded M4. But the XM250 is four pounds lighter than the M249 SAW.

www.defensenews.com

 

[Road_Clam]

As long as it doesnt go off when you throw it off the top of a tall building ...

 

[Mesatchornug]

[...] sell them in the US market as surplus after removing the full/burst-auto bits. Man, I hope they don't do the last one. This will destroy all domestic AR makers. I mean, why would you pay $2500 for LaRue when you can get an M4 for $500.

Never going to happen. Once a machinegun, always a machinegun. Not to mention, the lower (with its third hole) is what makes a machine gun, not the the trigger components.

Unless we repeal the NFA, the closest those rifles ever get to civilian hands is the 1033 program funneling gear to police departments

 

[crazymjb]

So the army is essentially going back to a battle rifle?

Does the MG replace the 240 as well? Muzzle energy wise this cartridge is ahead of 7.62x51, right?

 

[bigbravehog]

This part is interesting:

'The decision to pursue an intermediate caliber round came out of the Small Arms Ammunition Configuration Study, which emerged from concerns about body armor improvements among Russian and potentially Chinese troops.'

you nailed it. That peaked my interest also.

 

[AllaSnackbah]

Wait, what? Is new Sig M17 gay? Cause it's plastic or 'cause it's not 1911? I'm confused. It's not 6.5CM, so what is it? Although, I'm already gay so...need to know what I should be rocking to show it off.

Honestly, its shoots really good. I just personally dont like sigs.

 

[AllaSnackbah]

The new rifle is 2lbs heavier than the M4, which is expected. Stinks, but is expected.

However, the new machine gun is 4lbs lighter than the SAW is fantastic. Lighter plus a more potent cartridge.

Army expects Next Generation Squad Weapon to get to its first unit by next year

An unloaded XM5 rifle is two pounds heavier than an unloaded M4. But the XM250 is four pounds lighter than the M249 SAW.

www.defensenews.com

The rifle itself naked or with the LPVO?

 

[AllaSnackbah]

Man, imagine replacing all those M4s. They either have to destroy them, give them to non-NATO allies for free or sell them in the US market as surplus after removing the full/burst-auto bits. Man, I hope they don't do the last one. This will destroy all domestic AR makers. I mean, why would you pay $2500 for LaRue when you can get an M4 for $500.
Personally, I hope they sell it to non-NATO countries, destroying Russia's arms industry in the process. Who knows, we might see $100 Kalashnikovs yet

Lol. They'll give them all to shithole new nato members like ukraine.

As i understand it countries like romainia etc joining nato has historically hurt the kalash market here in the US. If they're getting our old junk for free they generally just stop making combloc stuff.

 

[AHM]

Obviously there's branding attached, but let's be honest here - most cartridges have someone's name in it. ... I started counting in just the SAAMI rifle cartridge spec, then gave up. Look for yourself - they're almost all [...]Remington or Winchester...except for the Ruger, Nosler, or Savage entries.

Meh, weak.

Holding out for Florbert.

Of course none of this matters because there’s a good 95% chance of DOD either punting, crapping out on, or demotion of the cartridge to being a special ops thing.

(To wit: the special operations operating operators
who actually get to choose what they carry;
amirite?)

Who cares about the rifle.

The optic, that sounds like it has a lot of stuff built into it.

It does. Vortex had a long podcast style Q&A video with a lead engineer for it, but I can’t find it anymore.

Old and Busted: Optic.
The New Hotness: Mine-Resistant Ambush Protected Optic.

I'd worry about information overload for individual soldiers. TMI for everyone means people have the potential to be even more confused, ...

I've long suspected that a key to modern pilot competence
is mastery of a plane's avionics: Actually understanding how they work,
and how to use them properly - not just scroll through a few common modes by unthinking rote.

Such optics are only worth fielding if they can be taught and used.

As for batteries. Oh yes. I get it. Luckily the military is currently doing a lot of research on how to recharge things on the go so fewer spare batteries are needed for everything that’s carried.

Here's what the Army's Let's Piss Away Money On Fuel Cell Battery Rechargers Research Command
thinks about the problem:
Soldier Tactical Power: The Key to Cross-Domain Maneuver

Lmao...

"Our guys cant shoot... we need a new gun!"

Wait'll you see a demo of the new Replay™ mode.

 

[cathouse01]

It does. Vortex had a long podcast style Q&A video with a lead engineer for it, but I can’t find it anymore.

Here’s a link to the podcast:


And a shorter descriptive video:

 

[67ray]

It's funny how you NES skinflints think cost matters to Uncle Sam
.

 

[drgrant]

It's funny how you NES skinflints think cost matters to Uncle Sam
.

Small arms is basically mouse turds in cost to the DOD on the whole, even if you gave a trigger-puller type soldier 50 grand worth of gear thats not a whole lot of
money in DOD setting cash on fire terms. They have missiles, bombs and rockets that cost more than that for one explosion.

 

[40 Creedmoor fan]

Wait! So if the army adopts new SIG and retires M4, will that make the "AR-15 is the same rifle military uses" anti-gunner argument mute? They don't even have "interchangeable" parts.

 

[PappyM3]

The rifle itself naked or with the LPVO?

Unloaded and I’m guessing naked.

The requirement for the whole rifle with all accessories and optic was less than 12 lbs. definitely a porker. But I think that includes the silencer too. Not positive though.

 

[cathouse01]

This might be a stupid question, but how if at all reloadable this cartridge will be?

Most of the articles say that it is reloadable. Looking at the construction of the round, it’s probably like reloading a belted magnum.

 

[Picton]

Wait! So if the army adopts new SIG and retires M4, will that make the "AR-15 is the same rifle military uses" anti-gunner argument mute? They don't even have "interchangeable" parts.

They're not retiring the M4. It's going to be used for decades by REMFs, the ARNG, Reservists, etc.

 

[PappyM3]

They're not retiring the M4. It's going to be used for decades by REMFs, the ARNG, Reservists, etc.

I also have a feeling that infantry TLs, SLs, PSGs, RTOs, COs, 1SGs and platoon medics will continue to rock M4s. Maybe not TLs, but SL and higher. Just a hunch, since M4s will likely stay in the infantry arms rooms like M16s did.

And when your primary job is directing everyone and being on the radio, why add weight with a weapon system you’re not even going to use outside of your immediate bubble?

 

[Dennis in MA]

Always smart. Have multiple calibers that sort of look like each other all over a battlefield. LOL

Man, imagine replacing all those M4s. They either have to destroy them, give them to non-NATO allies for free or sell them in the US market as surplus after removing the full/burst-auto bits. Man, I hope they don't do the last one. This will destroy all domestic AR makers. I mean, why would you pay $2500 for LaRue when you can get an M4 for $500.
Personally, I hope they sell it to non-NATO countries, destroying Russia's arms industry in the process. Who knows, we might see $100 Kalashnikovs yet

I hear Biden would prefer the Army put them in boxes, palletize them and strap some parachutes on them and drop them into Afganistan. It's the least we can do for the Taliban.

 

[crazymjb]

Always smart. Have multiple calibers that sort of look like each other all over a battlefield. LOL

I don’t think you’re going to find American infantrymen mixing up ammo and weapons with any degree of regularity. Yeah there are always some morons, but generally speaking there is a solid enough working knowledge of the weapons “we (in a previous life)” employ that we aren’t loading the wrong shit in the wrong shit. Sure not all grunts are gun nerds — but matching the bullets to the weapon is pretty basic stuff — plus we still have good NCOs, and enough grunts are gun nerds they can keep an eye on it.

 

[AHM]

Always smart. Have multiple calibers that sort of look like each other all over a battlefield. LOL

Project Eldest Son - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

 

[Quite_Exasperated]

I’ll wait for the 1911 variant…

 

[AHM]

I’ll wait for the 1911 variant…

 

[In God We Trust]

Damn, that's nice... Same size as the 365 carry model, just upgraded ?

I think I want one

Same size, just has the compensator it into the slide. Not sure if it has “fancier” parts or not, but the side says “sig custom works” whatever that means

 

[MAGA99]

Can't comment on the rest, but you're not the first to say this and I want to catch us all up - this cartridge might have a composite case, but not a polymer one. It has a stainless case head attached to a brass body by some third (proprietary) piece. The few things I've seen claim it's not reloadable, but they're not clear why.

Wait, this is not the true velocity polymer case stuff??

 

[sjohnston0311]

 

[Mesatchornug]

Wait, this is not the true velocity polymer case stuff??

Nope. That may have been one of the other two entrants?

 

[PappyM3]

Wait, this is not the true velocity polymer case stuff??

No, each of the three performers also bid their own cartridge design. Sig went with a bi-metal option.

 

[safetyfirst2125]

Good question.
Looks an awful lot like this-

.277 SIG Fury Demystified

Speculation on the .277 SIG Fury has practically broken the internet. GunsAmerica spoke directly with SIG to get the scoop on this revolutionary cartridge.

www.gunsamerica.com

Sweeeet!

Grateful for this..

“The cartridge shoulder dimensions, however, won’t let the SIG Fury fit in the chambers of those (308 or creedmore) rifles”

 

[safetyfirst2125]

No, each of the three performers also bid their own cartridge design. Sig went with a bi-metal option.

3000fps out of a 16” barrel of a gun weighing only 6+ lbs is pretty awesome.