F*ck the USCCA with a rusty stick

[Love Machine]

I'm just over here wondering how a stick got rusty

I mean, I get a rod of some sort...but a stick?

Bend over, ill demonstrate.

 

[Love Machine]

The way I see it when you consider the cost of guns and gun ownership in general, the insurance (or actually pre-paid attorney) is a drop in the bucket.

Does it always work? No.......... But I have guns that don't always work either that cost me a lot more than my CCW Safe.

Your plan is to use a gun that is not always known to work for self defense? Buy life insurance instead.

 

[Love Machine]

Most of the anti-USCCA/self defense insurance videos on YouTube are sponsored by attorney retainer companies. Like the OPs video isn’t just sponsored by a competitor, IT IS LITERALLY PRODUCED BY A COMPETITOR.

Coverage with USCCA or CCW Safe isn’t guaranteed, of course not. But Kayla Giles is a pretty bad example to tie your horse to. She bought the pistol, got the insurance, and googled if it was self defense to shoot someone from your car days before shooting her soon to be ex. Her daughter never saw her father lunge or make any threatening movements. She deleted incriminating data from her phone/laptop before the shooting. No, I wouldn’t cover her for self defense either.

It’s not perfect, as they can’t cover illegal acts. That sucks if you end up being found guilty. But hey, you have bigger worries then. And in instances with pretty clear wrongdoing they can drop you, like with Kayla. She was shady as hell.

BUT, they have helped people and it’s not a scam. It’s just insurance and insurance doesn’t always pay out. They still help lots of people though.

Their competitors are having an easy time because they f***ed up so bad. And since you missed the memo, the attorney that USCCA initially hired wrote a letter to them that the case is legit and they should cover it. But they dropped coverage anyway.

 

[Love Machine]

So are there any such organizations that are legit?

Armed Citizen Legal Defense Network is what I use. Not an insurance company, my lawyer of preference is pre-determined and written on the members card. It avoids the Kayla situation of calling your insurance first, which boned her in court.

 

[M1911]

Your plan is to use a gun that is not always known to work for self defense? Buy life insurance instead.

Guns are mechanical devices and man is incapable of building perfect mechanical devices. Even my Glocks have had occasional malfunctions.

 

[fred6052000]

Armed Citizen Legal Defense Network is what I use. Not an insurance company, my lawyer of preference is pre-determined and written on the members card. It avoids the Kayla situation of calling your insurance first, which boned her in court.

I use the same. ACLDN, seems they are legit.

 

[Love Machine]

Guns are mechanical devices and man is incapable of building perfect mechanical devices. Even my Glocks have had occasional malfunctions.

Point taken.

 

[eboos]

My wife went to a class about a month ago and texted me asking if I wanted to get USCCA insurance. I told her that I do not like the normalization of having insurance to protect you while exercising a right and that voluntary acceptance of carrying liability insurance in case you are ever in a self defense situation emboldens legislators who will seek to make it compulsory. I said that this seems predatory on the part of the insurance companies.

 

[eboos]

Even my Glocks have had occasional malfunctions.

Following me around matches, are you?

 

[Coda]

Your plan is to use a gun that is not always known to work for self defense? Buy life insurance instead.

Read the post next time. Where did I say I carried an unreliable gun for self defense???

I guess you only own one gun, I have more than one. Some are old and not very reliable but collectable and valuable. Do you get it now?

 

[Love Machine]

Read the post next time. Where did I say I carried an unreliable gun for self defense???

I guess you only own one gun, I have more than one. Some are old and not very reliable but collectable and valuable. Do you get it now?

My apologies, I misread your post.

My wife went to a class about a month ago and texted me asking if I wanted to get USCCA insurance. I told her that I do not like the normalization of having insurance to protect you while exercising a right and that voluntary acceptance of carrying liability insurance in case you are ever in a self defense situation emboldens legislators who will seek to make it compulsory. I said that this seems predatory on the part of the insurance companies.

You don't need the insurance, you can spend the $100k on the retainer and $50k on the bond all by yourself. And the civil lawsuit could result in millions.

 

[doxdsgn]

USCCA is a marketing company that is focused on selling to gun owners.

 

[G4Y4HK]

You telling me all those 'gun-tubers' like James from TFBTV promoting their shit.. this company is a lie? "Trust me, bro.. I'm not just a youtuber, I'm a lawyer. Get USCCA" lol.

 

[M1911]

You don't need the insurance, you can spend the $100k on the retainer and $50k on the bond all by yourself. And the civil lawsuit could result in millions.

if you win the criminal self defense case that gives you a very good defense against a civil case here in MA.

 

[M1911]

You telling me all those 'gun-tubers' like James from TFBTV promoting their shit.. this company is a lie? "Trust me, bro.. I'm not just a youtuber, I'm a lawyer. Get USCCA" lol.

James is such a successful lawyer that he has all that time to make YouTube videos and spend hours working on his biceps.

 

[eboos]

You don't need the insurance, you can spend the $100k on the retainer and $50k on the bond all by yourself. And the civil lawsuit could result in millions.

Well dang! In that case, maybe we should have an insurance requirement. If found to be carrying without insurance should be punishable by up to 2.5 years in the house of corrections, or a $5000 fine, or both. It's for the children.

 

[PappyM3]

Their competitors are having an easy time because they f***ed up so bad. And since you missed the memo, the attorney that USCCA initially hired wrote a letter to them that the case is legit and they should cover it. But they dropped coverage anyway.

Yes, I will believe the woman found guilty of murder, who has a beef against USCCA and the attorneys who are competitors with USCCA, without questioning it. They are completely unbiased.

Also, of course the first attorney is going to say to go forward with the case. That means he’s getting paid.

 

[PappyM3]

…

You don't need the insurance, you can spend the $100k on the retainer and $50k on the bond all by yourself. And the civil lawsuit could result in millions.

USCCA covers up to $2mil for civil judgements.

 

[G4Y4HK]

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gbEbOJMdK30

 

[Jason Flare]

My wife went to a class about a month ago and texted me asking if I wanted to get USCCA insurance. I told her that I do not like the normalization of having insurance to protect you while exercising a right and that voluntary acceptance of carrying liability insurance in case you are ever in a self defense situation emboldens legislators who will seek to make it compulsory. I said that this seems predatory on the part of the insurance companies.

That’s a long text.

 

[eboos]

That’s a long text.

Yeah, I had to pull over.

 

[Rob Boudrie]

Coverage with USCCA or CCW Safe isn’t guaranteed, of course not. ..... No, I wouldn’t cover her for self defense either.

The problem is the process.

If the case is being tried, it means the government has taken the position it is not self defense and the shooter has. The trial is the refereed arena in which case the winner and loser are decided.

When places like USCCA reserve the right to declare something not self defense absent a judicial finding, they are placing themselves in the role of judger of fact and turn their policy into one that can be converted to "pay after you win" (like the ill fated NRA marketed policy). In the USCCA case, the court basically said "Yup, USCCA was right to deny coverage since she was convicted".

All of the policies I have read say "self defense" and not "all cases in which the member raises a self defense claim". They share the same loophole. They should be more honest and say "In cases the USCCA considers self defense". I know there are other cases, and I have heard of one attorney who turned down a case for a USCCA member as USCCA declined coverage.

An important factor is that a-priori funding of a trial can decrease the chances of a guilty verdict. As a successful defendant in a self defense trial told me "Justice is a commodity like any other, and how much you get depends on how much you can afford".

 

[PappyM3]

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gbEbOJMdK30

That’s the same law firm as the one in the OP, trying to take market share from USCCA. Maybe what they say has validity, but take it with a grain of biased salt. They’re a direct competitor.

 

[Coda]

My apologies, I misread your post.

No problem. To be honest I am not sure if CCW Safe is worth it or not.

To put it another way I am also not sure if some of the $$$ I spend on guns, ammo, optics, accessories, safes, memberships, etc is worth it or not.

I just renewed my CCW safe (actually it is auto renew) because I figure with my luck as soon as I drop it then I will need it. It is just one big crap shoot.

 

[badshot101]

That’s the same law firm as the one in the OP, trying to take market share from USCCA. Maybe what they say has validity, but take it with a grain of biased salt. They’re a direct competitor.

True, but the larger point is important - you want a pre-paid attorney who will defend you regardless, vs an insurance company that decides if your case has merit before deciding to defend you.

Has anyone here read the contract with ACLDN or AOR? If so, any obvious weasel words that would allow them to decline coverage?

 

[Chevy 2 65]

Guns are mechanical devices and man is incapable of building perfect mechanical devices. Even my Glocks have had occasional malfunctions.

NO WAY !! Not the Glock. It's a lie.

 

[Broc]

The problem is the process.

If the case is being tried, it means the government has taken the position it is not self defense and the shooter has. The trial is the refereed arena in which case the winner and loser are decided.

When places like USCCA reserve the right to declare something not self defense absent a judicial finding, they are placing themselves in the role of judger of fact and turn their policy into one that can be converted to "pay after you win" (like the ill fated NRA marketed policy). In the USCCA case, the court basically said "Yup, USCCA was right to deny coverage since she was convicted".

All of the policies I have read say "self defense" and not "all cases in which the member raises a self defense claim". They share the same loophole. They should be more honest and say "In cases the USCCA considers self defense". I know there are other cases, and I have heard of one attorney who turned down a case for a USCCA member as USCCA declined coverage.

An important factor is that a-priori funding of a trial can decrease the chances of a guilty verdict. As a successful defendant in a self defense trial told me "Justice is a commodity like any other, and how much you get depends on how much you can afford".

I wonder ... how would USCCA determine if it is self defense before a trial?

Who do they listen to? ... do they read the police report? ... I would be very concerned if this is what they do.

A defense attorney is not going to tell USCCA "my client is guilty", the prosecutor will not say "the person is not guilty" and neither will hand over information to USCCA.

 

[fred6052000]

I wonder ... how would USCCA determine if it is self defense before a trial?

Who do they listen to? ... do they read the police report? ... I would be very concerned if this is what they do.

A defense attorney is not going to tell USCCA "my client is guilty", the prosecutor will not say "the person is not guilty" and neither will hand over information to USCCA.

Another bad thing about USCCA is, that you cannot take a plea deal, if you loose the case then you have to return all the expenses to them!

 

[Rob Boudrie]

Another bad thing about USCCA is, that you cannot take a plea deal, if you loose the case then you have to return all the expenses to them!

Their video claims they have never done that, but they conveniently fall short of the obvious solution of changing their contract.

 

[Rob Boudrie]

I wonder ... how would USCCA determine if it is self defense before a trial?

USCCA would probably balance the PR impact; the need to show members it funds cases; and the desire to keep expenses down to arrive at a balance that serves USCCAs interest.