mad max

just jim said:
I wouldn't buy gold or silver, someone else sets the value of it so it's open for corruption.
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Maybe so, but the guy I knew that got himself and his family out of N. Korea in the late 1970s had to use gold for all the bribes and illegal transportation. It was the one universal currency.
 
just jim said:
I remember the first gold and silver run up and how prices were manipulated, took 20 years to get prices up the again and by then inflation wiped out the gain. Will it be a mad max in the financial zone when they hyperinflate out of the trillions in debt?
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Fair enough, not trying to talk anyone into anything here...just handing out free (and probably worthless) advice [rofl]
 
cockpitbob said:
Maybe so, but the guy I knew that got himself and his family out of N. Korea in the late 1970s had to use gold for all the bribes and illegal transportation. It was the one universal currency.
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That's probably because there was still a first world where gold would have some real market value. If the sh!t really hits the fan, the US is not going to go down alone. Gold has some intrinsic value in industry, but if there's no industry to need it it's just a pretty metal. I'm talking like zombie apocalypse SHTF kind of stuff here. Of course if that happens money in all its forms is going to be pretty much meaningless, gold, paper, or bottle caps.
 
I don't know about Mad Max, but I think when the economy crashes ( not if, but when ) the dollar will be worthless, an IOU with no collateral. Maybe they'll revalue the dollar or come up with new currency altogether. I'm not a big fan of Gold, it's too volatile and it's hard to make exact change with a gold bar. I also don't like Silver rounds or bars. Most people won't have a Nitric Acid Test Kit handy. I prefer Junk Silver, pre-64 Dimes, Quarters, Half Dollars & Dollars. These already exist, they're cost prohibitive to counterfeit and it's easy to make exact change. I don't have a lot but I have some. I think food, water, medicine, tools, ammo & Vicks ( for the stench of death ) will the primary barter items early on. Maybe precious metals will come into play after the first year. I hope anyone but Hillary gets in to buy us a few more years of preparation. If not, I'd say 2018-19 will be the fall of the Republic. By 2020-21, we'll be aiming at our friends in the Light Blue Helmets that have come to help us out.

UN Bitches.jpg
 
In a mad max it would go to barter in my opinion but who out there would know real gold from flake in the marketplace? So if you don't think it's going to go mad max over finances then how will they get the world out from under trillions in debt?
 
the_shootist said:
Fair enough, not trying to talk anyone into anything here...just handing out free (and probably worthless) advice [rofl]
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When gold and silver went to being commodities rather than currency they became like all commodities and their values manipulated. As currency they had a structured value you could depend on, now they are worth what some bank sets for value against the dollar.
 
If the world does go "Mad Max"; let us all hope that Flaming Guitar Guy is there, too


download.jpeg
 
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Varmint said:
The only way it goes Mad Max, Walking Dead etc is if the power grid goes down for an extended period, say entire US for a month. Also people will likely behave better if they think everything will go back to normal soon.

So what could cause this? Some kind of natural disaster (meteor, massive solar flare etc). Some kind of attack with multiple nukes or EMP nukes. Some kind of massive cyber attack. All 3 are pretty unlikely.

What's much more likely IMO is another Great Depression as the US collapses under bad debts, financial engineering and decades of artificial economic expansion contracting back to the mean.
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I think the most likely scenario for a collapse of our society is a deadly viral pandemic. Something that spreads very quickly and kills quickly. There is a point I would imagine where soldiers, police, doctors, etc would stop showing up for work out of fear for their own lives or to simply protect their own families.

Plus if you think about it, some personnel, for example, the people responsible for operating power plants and keeping electricity flowing, how many of those could the country afford to lose to a deadly plague before the electric grid began to fail. It's probably highly unlikely that there are more than a tiny handful of people in this country who would know how to keep Hoover Dam functional for example.

From what I have read on this, a loss of about 20% of the population would be devastating enough that our technological society would be thrust into the dark ages. Forget the constitution when it's everyone out for themselves for whatever food or fresh water is left.
 
VetteGirlMA said:
I think the most likely scenario for a collapse of our society is a deadly viral pandemic. Something that spreads very quickly and kills quickly. There is a point I would imagine where soldiers, police, doctors, etc would stop showing up for work out of fear for their own lives or to simply protect their own families.

Plus if you think about it, some personnel, for example, the people responsible for operating power plants and keeping electricity flowing, how many of those could the country afford to lose to a deadly plague before the electric grid began to fail. It's probably highly unlikely that there are more than a tiny handful of people in this country who would know how to keep Hoover Dam functional for example.

From what I have read on this, a loss of about 20% of the population would be devastating enough that our technological society would be thrust into the dark ages. Forget the constitution when it's everyone out for themselves for whatever food or fresh water is left.
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? Where does this come from, natural or man made?
 
just jim said:
? Where does this come from, natural or man made?
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Natural, man made, outer space it doesn't matter. The thawing arctic tundra is exposing bacteria and other viruses that have either been dormant for thousands of years or never able to claim a foot hold (free from people). If we create a man made virus that goes out of control we might not have the smarts to come up with a cure fast enough before people start dropping. Natural could also be transmitted by the food chain (foods we eat such as an infected animal), or airborne (probably less likely) and it infects stopping the disease from going crazy is probably going to be very hard.

Could there be a caldera explosion at Yellowstone and wipe out the USA? Maybe I would say probability low. Will global warming roast the planet? Not likely or very long term, probability low. Nuclear war? I hope not, probably low to medium. But a virus? With all the international travel it could spread quickly. Bird flu spread very quickly and that isn't some science fiction style lab creation. I think we will find that nature could shake off the human race from this planet like a bad case of fleas.
 
My biggest concern is a long term loss of the power grid. We are dependent on over a dozen types of "utilities" in the US (electric, gas, water, sewer, communications, transportation, food production,...) they all depend on electricity. If power goes out over half the country for even 1-2 months we would literally start to see mass starvation.

You might think we could never have a large scale power outage that lasted more than a week. See the first article below. A coordinated attack on 9 key substations could take out the entire country for 9-18 months. The big transformers cost upwards of $10million and no spares exist. Getting new ones made takes months, and that's with things running normally. Without the grid, everything stops, including food refrigeration, production and transportation.

http://www.utilitydive.com/news/coul...r-grid/241192/
http://electronicdesign.com/blog/how-kill-transformer

I don't know how long the grid could be down from a super-massive solar flair or an EMP attack, but I'm going to guess even longer.
 
Don't forget that if the US goes down a large part of the world dependent on our trade (China would collapse without our business), and very importantly our exported food supply, goes down with us.

A The Stand or Last Centurion scenario with a virus and civilization is totally boned. The Dark Ages weren't dark from the fall of the Roman Empire so much as from the devastation to trade and knowledge the black plague wrought.
 
just jim said:
Does anyone have a scenario that they believe is going to happen?
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I think the top 3 likely scenarios are:

.1 Severe financial depression. Not a full collapse, but damn close to it. This will lead to massive civil unrest and martial law in the cities.

The suburbs and far boonies will not have .gov troops because they will be spread too thin. Neighborhood militias will be formed.

2. Some sort of pandemic like a superflu or some such. It's really just a matter of time as we see things like Ebola and new shit like Zitka every year.

3. A more localized event like a meteor strike, severe earth quake or a rogue nuke lit off by the religion of peace.
 
In God We Trust said:
I think the top 3 likely scenarios are:

.1 Severe financial depression. Not a full collapse, but damn close to it. This will lead to massive civil unrest and martial law in the cities.

The suburbs and far boonies will not have .gov troops because they will be spread too thin. Neighborhood militias will be formed.

2. Some sort of pandemic like a superflu or some such. It's really just a matter of time as we see things like Ebola and new shit like Zitka every year.

3. A more localized event like a meteor strike, severe earth quake or a rogue nuke lit off by the religion of peace.
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I'm not a tinfoil kind of guy, but I believe that the financial system is too precarious to survive an -almost- full collapse. I suspect that when things slide past a certain point it will be completely unrecoverable. Things are just too "virtual" and interconnected these days. It's a total house of cards.

And my biggest fear is that the religion of peace in your #3 will set off the pandemic in your #2. Way easier than getting their hands on a nuke.
 
If money is involved, there are people manipulating it.

Anyone who thinks Wall Street is above board is tripping.
 
VetteGirlMA said:
I think the most likely scenario for a collapse of our society is a deadly viral pandemic. Something that spreads very quickly and kills quickly. There is a point I would imagine where soldiers, police, doctors, etc would stop showing up for work out of fear for their own lives or to simply protect their own families.

Plus if you think about it, some personnel, for example, the people responsible for operating power plants and keeping electricity flowing, how many of those could the country afford to lose to a deadly plague before the electric grid began to fail. It's probably highly unlikely that there are more than a tiny handful of people in this country who would know how to keep Hoover Dam functional for example.

From what I have read on this, a loss of about 20% of the population would be devastating enough that our technological society would be thrust into the dark ages. Forget the constitution when it's everyone out for themselves for whatever food or fresh water is left.
Click to expand...

Absolutely, forgot about that one, the most likely of the planet killer scenarios.

In a global sense it would be a good thing - the world cannot sustain 8, 10, 12 billion humans, so something has to give.
 
just jim said:
Good book, I bought two copies to loan out to friends. They should have made a movie about this book....
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I think one of these event tv series would do it justice, two 10-episode seasons would about tell the story. Season 1 leads up to Hammerfall, season 2 covers the events after.
 
Varmint said:
The only way it goes Mad Max, Walking Dead etc is if the power grid goes down for an extended period, say entire US for a month. Also people will likely behave better if they think everything will go back to normal soon.

So what could cause this? Some kind of natural disaster (meteor, massive solar flare etc). Some kind of attack with multiple nukes or EMP nukes. Some kind of massive cyber attack. All 3 are pretty unlikely.

What's much more likely IMO is another Great Depression as the US collapses under bad debts, financial engineering and decades of artificial economic expansion contracting back to the mean.
Click to expand...

What could be more interesting to us individually is what happens when we default on the loans from China and they come to collect.
 

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