Mass ok AOWs?

[seanc]

Getting the itch to put myself through the NFA ringer again.

I am thinking of a 20g aow. I currently have a 12g Ithaca (AOW). Is there anything out there 870, mossberg-ish that is OK in mass?

 

[Twigg]

No AOW's in MA.

No fun allowed.

 

[gerrycaruso]

I have a Mossberg 590A1 AOW and the ATF required a copy of my machinegun license before they'd approve the transfer. I've been told that others have gotten AOW's without a machinegun license. Maybe they required it in my case just because I have one. Once I sent the copy of the license, they approved the transfer. The 590A1 is a ball. I use it at the shotgun range to break clay birds and it works . I usually do this when no one else is there so I won't look too dumb when I miss. Get one. You'll love it.

 

[Twigg]

I stand corrected.

 

[seanc]

yes, they definitely are OK in mass.. I have an ithaca Aow. It's a 12g 13".
When I purchased it, I only need an LTC and a cleo sign off (on the nfa forms).

To clarify, are there any 20g aows out there that are ok in mass?

 

[Rob Boudrie]

When I purchased it, I only need an LTC and a cleo sign off (on the nfa forms).

The problem occurs when you try to find a dealer to transfer it, and the dealer concludes (quite possibly correctly) that the AOW short barrel shotgun meets the MA definition of "firearm" (handgun) and is unable to transfer it to you because it is not on the lab tested or target roster.

 

[seanc]

The problem occurs when you try to find a dealer to transfer it, and the dealer concludes (quite possibly correctly) that the AOW short barrel shotgun meets the MA definition of "firearm" (handgun) and is unable to transfer it to you because it is not on the lab tested or target roster.

I got mine before all of this crap started. But I did have both the green card and LTC. But, the dealer that sold it to me, at the time, said that technically all you needed was the pistol permit and have the cleo sign off..
I would suspect things have changed at this point. But, assuming it's treated as straight NFA will I run into issues on finding/ buying a new piece??

 

[Rob Boudrie]

But, assuming it's treated as straight NFA will I run into issues on finding/ buying a new piece??

NFA status of an item classified by the state of MA as a firearm (handgun) does not exempt a dealer sale from the requirement that the gun be on the lab tested or target roster and comply with the AG's regulations.

 

[seanc]

NFA status of an item classified by the state of MA as a firearm (handgun) does not exempt a dealer sale from the requirement that the gun be on the lab tested or target roster and comply with the AG's regulations.

Rob,
Thanks for the response.. But just so I am clear...
So, this would in effect mean that any AOW would have to have been in the state prior to the ban (roster, etc) to be transferable in Mass? The same way that pistols are now regulated.

But, on the upside, it should not get caught up in the whole short bbl shotgun mass issue as it is considered a smooth bore pistol..

Is that your take on it?

 

[gerrycaruso]

Just to clarify, a short barreled shotgun is not the same as an AOW. An AOW must not have a buttstock and it must have been manufactured that way. If it ever had a buttstock it can never be classified as an AOW.

 

[Rob Boudrie]

So, this would in effect mean that any AOW would have to have been in the state prior to the ban (roster, etc) to be transferable in Mass? The same way that pistols are now regulated.

There are rare ways to legally transfer a gun into MA without going through an FFL (bequest, moving into state, manufacturing it yourself), however, I believe advance approval from the ATF is requried to move an AOW or SBS between states.

Just to clarify, a short barreled shotgun is not the same as an AOW. An AOW must not have a buttstock and it must have been manufactured that way. If it ever had a buttstock it can never be classified as an AOW.

Serbu (www.serbu.com) makes a couple of really nice SBS's on commercial receivers that have never had stocks and sells them as the Serbu Super Shorty. An interesting novelty at $750 ($755 with the AOW tax), but I can't think of any practical application. I am not aware of any regulation that says a gun must have a practical application to be fun to use .

 

[seanc]

There are rare ways to legally transfer a gun into MA without going through an FFL (bequest, moving into state, manufacturing it yourself), however, I believe advance approval from the ATF is requried to move an AOW or SBS between states.


I am assuming an instate aow, either a mossberg or a 870 witness.


Serbu (www.serbu.com) makes a couple of really nice SBS's on commercial receivers that have never had stocks and sells them as the Serbu Super Shorty. An interesting novelty at $750 ($755 with the AOW tax), but I can't think of any practical application. I am not aware of any regulation that says a gun must have a practical application to be fun to use .

It is my understanding that the serbus are specifically NOT ok in mass. (and pretty much confirmed by a few emails to serbu directly).


It is my understanding that, in Mass, ONLY "factory made" non altered AOWs are acceptable, thus Mossberg/ remington/ Ithaca from factory are all ok. But A serbu gun (or if I were to buy a virgin receiver and form 1 it) are not ok.

And further, I have been told, that my ithaca 13" Aow, is not (mass) legally alterable from it's present configuration (I can not put a 9" bbl on it).


Obviously, I am not a lwayer. And all of this info has been collected over the years from reasonably knowledgable persons. But, that being said, it may be old, outdated or flat out incorrect at this point..

Serbu (www.serbu.com) but I can't think of any practical application. I am not aware of any regulation that says a gun must have a practical application to be fun to use .

That is exactly what I have wanted for years, (in 20g). And I feel that pumpkins and zombies are more than enough justification for getting one.. As soon as I get the hell out of mass I will have one!!!

 

[drgrant]

I doubt the handgun compliance BS is going to become a real issue in transferring an AOW into MA.

The real problem is going to be the knuckleheads down at the NFA branch that decide every other month that they think something is illegal in MA that
really isn't.

-Mike

 

[Rob Boudrie]

It is my understanding that the serbus are specifically NOT ok in mass. (and pretty much confirmed by a few emails to serbu directly).

Correct, as they are handguns and cannot be transferred by a dealer.

And further, I have been told, that my ithaca 13" Aow, is not (mass) legally alterable from it's present configuration (I can not put a 9" bbl on it).

Do you have any more authorative into than "I have been told"

 

[seanc]

Correct, as they are handguns and cannot be transferred by a dealer.


Do you have any more authorative into than "I have been told"

Paul Alphonse, Jeff Slamin and Clarence all told me so??

 

[Rob Boudrie]

Paul Alphonse, Jeff Slamin and Clarence all told me so??

I was thinking of a reference to MGL, so we can understand where this prohibition comes from. It may very well be the case, however, fully understanding it requires knowledge of the law, not just the names of people who assert their interpretation of it.

 

[securityboy]

I was thinking of a reference to MGL, so we can understand where this prohibition comes from. It may very well be the case, however, fully understanding it requires knowledge of the law, not just the names of people who assert their interpretation of it.

If you want to know look up the mass. definition of sawed off shotgun, you will find your answer, I don't know the MGL off hand. From that definition "long ago" ATF decided that only FACTORY SBS's or "shotgun like" (my words not theirs) AOW's were legal in MA. That means that if it left remington with a 14 inch barrel fine, but if it left mossberg as even a bare reciever and serbu (or anyone for that matter) put that same 14inch barrel on it (or worse yet cut down a FACTORY barrel) it was a no go.

However in a recent thread on THIS BOARD, a recent internal ATF memo came to light that basicly said "we can't keep track of how a gun left the factory, so no more transfers of SBS's or "shotgun like" AOW's will be approved to civi's in MA"...

 

[Twigg]

Live and learn, great info.