Model 41 sideways stovepipe

kiver

kiver

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I am having issues with my M41. The majority of the time I have no problems but maybe once in five magazines I will have an empty case jam sideways over another round being fed. This is a used gun. Anyone else have this problem and how to fix it? It seems to do best with CCI ammo SV and Mini Mags. If I put bulk stuff in it it no longer becomes fun to shoot.

Thanks
 
M1911 said:
A friend of mine has a 41 and his is also sensitive to ammo.
Click to expand...


I personally have never owned a model 41. (it is a fine gun)

But from the many people I have know who do own one; it can be finicky with regards to ammo brands.

Google the issue and I am sure you will find what brands work best in that particular handgun.

Good Luck...

And Enjoy shooting your model 41
 
stencil said:
Talk to Smith&Wesson and they will tell you never to shoot anything but CCI Standard Velocity in a Model 41. But hey, it's your pistol.
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I've owned a Model 41 since the early 80's and I probably have more rounds through it than any other gun I've ever owned.
I always knew that the recoil spring wasn't calibrated for high velocity ammo, so I pretty much only used standard velocity stuff.
My favorite load was the Federal Champion Standard Velocity, but I can't seem to find it anymore. Most of the cheap stuff is marked high velocity these days.
I developed the sideways stovepipe problem the OP speaks of, it turned out to be a worn extractor claw.
I removed it and did a little file work to sharpen up the rounded off tip, which worked fine for a few years, but the problem eventually returned. I then called S&W and they sent me a new extractor claw. That cured the problem.
The rounded tip of the extractor wasn't grabbing under the rim very well, and was losing it's grip on the shell before hitting the ejector at the end of the slides rearward travel. The spent shell wasn't being thrown clear of the ejection port before the slide came forward and stripped the next round from the magazine. The spent shell was now jammed between the bottom of the barrel extension and the side of the fresh round, which was only partially into the chamber. This isn't an easy type of jam to clear, often requiring removal of the barrel. It also usually results in bending or denting of the fresh round which was stuck partially in the chamber.
The extractor claw may be OK, but it's very important to remove all the accumulated crud from around and under it with a pick, as well as the entire case head recess in the bolt face.

The extractor is part #7 on this diagram:

M41slide_explview.jpg
 
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Stovepipes are mainly caused by the spent cartridge slipping off the extractor hook prior to hitting the ejector. This could be caused by a few things like

A) the velocity is too low and the spent cartridge gets bumped off prematurely by the next round in the mag.

B) the extractor tension is too loose and or fowling has built up in the extractor area.

C) a dirty chamber has caused the spent case to drag in the chamber and slow the cycle rate down to the point of causing "A"


clean the barrel and chamber well and or try a drop of oil on the first round in a fresh mag after cleaning and get back to us.
 
I would give it a very good cleaning as recommended. I have a early model 41 I got used. It had similar issues. I gave it a really good cleaning. Been useing aquilla 1200fps target ammo from the cmp since. Shoots great.
 
I think it may be the crud under the claw. Thanks guys. I took a tooth pick and got a good amount of stuff out. I never noticed all the crud there in prior cleanings. I'll let you know how it goes tomorrow. If this fixes this I will be an extremely happy camper. Thanks
 
In my 41, I've shot about every type of 22 lr ammo that I have except the hyper vel stuff. All of the standard, target and high vel rounds cycled including the bulk Winchester, Remington and Federal. The only stuff that didn't cycle reliably were the subsonic rounds.
 
I went 2-3 today in competition. I had a side pipe first magazine with CCI standard velocity and lost that round. Second round same ammo I had no FTE and took the round. Third round I had a side pipe and lost. I then switched to CCI mini mags. Won the first round and lost the second (a$$got kicked) but no FTE. I am wondering if a spring change and new extractor may help.
 
kiver said:
I went 2-3 today in competition. I had a side pipe first magazine with CCI standard velocity and lost that round. Second round same ammo I had no FTE and took the round. Third round I had a side pipe and lost. I then switched to CCI mini mags. Won the first round and lost the second (a$$got kicked) but no FTE. I am wondering if a spring change and new extractor may help.
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I have a 70s or maybe 60s Model 41 as well and the advise over at the S&W forum was to replace the springs as with an old unknown firearm the springs could be fatigued. I only shoot CCI SV and probably have a FTF every 30 or so shots. Since it is just a plinker for me, I don't care and haven't replaced the springs yet.

Chris
 
got my extractor and spring today and swapped them out. Did a function test and it seems she is ready to roll. We will see. Spring was pretty much compressed so I am hoping this was the issue. The old extractor looked OK but was showing some wear at the corner.
740c7a0e.jpg

c5142d38.jpg
 
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Had the same problems with an early 1970's model 41 i got. Changed every spring in the gun, problems went away.
 
Still having issues. I'll give it a good soaking, take it out and see if there is any improvement , then off to a gunsmith....DANG it
 
Have never had an extractor work straight out of the package for my model 41.
I need to take off a lot of material so the “claw” touches the casing and doesn’t rest on the barrel when the slide is closed.
Usually takes a few tries and a lot of filing. Then I’m good for a few more years.
 
Joe - Mine is going back to the factory shortly. Let me know if you want to go for a group rate. [grin] One of the guys on the Friends of NRA committee is in customer service.
 
Woodstock said:
Joe - Mine is going back to the factory shortly. Let me know if you want to go for a group rate. [grin] One of the guys on the Friends of NRA committee is in customer service.
Click to expand...

I have a competition this Sunday but I have no problem sending it after that. That and I still have to get those reloading books back to you
 
If the issue persistrs after you have cleaned the chamber, barrel and slide and lubed the slide well then change your ammo. The S&W Model41 is designed to function with SV ammo. I have used CCI SV, Aguilla SE SV, and Wolf Match Target ammo without any issues.
 
Zappa said:
Hey Kiver, you left us hanging here, did you ever resolve your issues with the 41 ????
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I soaked it in diesel for a day and did a complete cleaning. Changed the main spring an extractor. Still had issues. The gun was either on or it sucked. The last pin and plate I did it was smooth for the first four rounds then stove pipe after stove pipe. I contacted S&w and they had me drop it off. As of right now it is still in the shop
 
I experimented with recoil springs in both of my 41's. When I dropped to 6 lbs. they ran much better, and are very reliable with 1080 FPS ammo. I also use Eezox pretty liberally on the extractor.
 
SOB. You guy that get free service are lucky. Just got a bill from S&W for $92. They replaced the sear and ejector. Hopefully this fixes the issues I was having
 

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