Molle Gear, African Carry, and a 1-5x scope

[60 buckscash]

I am thinking about when the "Zombies" come. After looking at a bunch of high speed low drag rigs out there I think I have a direction to head towards with a vest. Tell me if this sounds stupid.

Front
Strong side low vertical pistol holster
high pistol mags (4)

Weak side low Ar mag pouches (2-2x)
high 1 single ar pouch

Rear
middle upper camel back
strong lower mini med kit
weak lower 1 ar and 1 pistol mag (last ditch mags)

I am thinking of having a 2 point sling on my rifle which would allow me to use african carry, hasty sling, and throw it up over my neck/weak arm(a secure african carry?) if needed to stow to transition to pistol to keep zapping zombies.

Are any of you using a 1-5x scope on your carbines? I have a 2x red dot but am looking to get a little more versatility out of my optic.

Am I looking to take a carbine class? yes. look cool? yes. be functional? yes. Be an operator? no.

What do you guys think?

 

[ChevyGuy91]

This should get interesting.

As far as the optics go, I am looking at one of the Trijicon Accupoint 1-4x for my AR. I have read good things, and are a lot cheaper then the S&B Shortdot's.

 

[M1911]

Use a two-point sling like a Vicker's.

As far as the optics go, I am looking at one of the Trijicon Accupoint 1-4x for my AR. I have read good things, and are a lot cheaper then the S&B Shortdot's.

I'm looking at those, too. Shortdots are supposed to be the bee's knees, but the price is breathtaking.

 

[ChevyGuy91]

At the risk of sounding like the MAGPUL fan boy I am, an MS2 allows you the flexibility to go 1 point or 2 point. I have one, and I like it.

 

[KMM696]

I don't I like the idea of having the handgun on your vest. When the zombie shows up while you've taken the vest off to refill the camelbak/hung it on a tree/took it off to drive/whatever, having at least one weapon that's still where it's supposed to be would be nice. Maybe one pistol mag in a non-vest pocket would be good, too. The rest of the mags can stay on the vest.

I wouldn't want the zombies to get my camelbak - it may be the most important piece of gear I have.

The molle vest is a nice base, since you can move pieces around as you figure out what does/doesn't work.

 

[ChevyGuy91]

Mounting a pistol holster on the upper body is not a good idea as noted. While in the Navy they made us qual with a cross draw holster on a float vest, the powers that be realized the idea was garbage as it went against all the other training we received prior, and we wound up removing the holsters from the vests and went with drop leg holsters, which were almost as annoying to me.

If I were really training for some kind of rambo commando scenario, I would train with the pistol close to where I normally carry. Eliminate training scars before they happen. My low speed high drag opinion.

 

[economist]

I'm looking at those, too. Shortdots are supposed to be the bee's knees, but the price is breathtaking.

I have a S&B Shortdot. And I just put a Nightforce 1-4x24 NXS on an AR. While the Nightforce has very nice glass, the lighted reticle is a little washed out in sunlight. A friend has a Trijicon 1-4x on a hunting rifle, and I think it is a very nice scope. The glass seems to be a little inferior to the Nightforce 1-4x, but still pretty nice. And that fiber optic triangle is very bright in daylight (as is the ShortDot lighted reticle). Bottom line, the S&B is the best, with unbelievably clear glass, but also the most expensive. The Nightforce seems to be slightly better, clearer glass than the Trijicon. And the Trijicon wins over the Nightforce with a much more visible aiming point in daylight. For simplicity (no batteries) and value, the Trijicon is a serious contender in the 1-4x market. All, naturally, just my opinion.

 

[60 buckscash]

I typically carry strong side so this would be a slight move onto the vest and would take weight off of the waist and onto the shoulders, but point taken and one less thing to buy.

I suppose "african carry" can also be called "muzzle down support side carry", for all of you PC high drag guys.

 

[jar]

I have a Meopta K-Dot 1-4x on my nearly complete NES AR. I haven't shot with it yet, since I'm still waiting on the barrel and bolt carrier from the white oak buy. The glass seems quite good and the illumination is fully visible in daylight. I haven't seen a short-dot, but many people have said that the meopta is 90% of the short dot at 30% of the price. The K-dot lists at $800, but I found one NIB for $600 on gunbroker.

 

[oldsoldier29]

Back OT....
You ever consider a chest rig & separate gun belt? Single stack chest rig, you could fit 5 magazine, and a double pistol mag pouch. Belt rig, another rifle mag, 2 more pistol mags. Ever try driving a car with SAPI plates, and mags on top of that? My legs arent long enough....a chest rigs allows you flexibility.
Now, back to Africa....isnt it filled with pirates? I would think a cutlass would be the weapon du jour....maybe a couple of flintlocks stuck in a sash!!!

 

[op4guy]

Are you actually planning on going to Africa or any other combat zone for that matter? If not then armor is a moot point for the most part. Even if you are an armor package needs to be considered for the baseline. What is the mission? What is required?What is authorized? What is the threat? I own 3 armor configurations and I can tell you none of them are cheap. A standard OTV, an IOTV and a DBT plate carrier w/ IIIA backers.

Though each setup is completely different they all share some common bond. Generally I run a belt rig with as little on my chest as possible. Like Oldsoldier said, trying to drive with a metric ton of crap strapped to your body as cumbersome at best. Not to mention the weight adds up real quick. Carrying 12 mags on top of armor, water, med kit, radios pistol and ammo and other kit will quickly add up to 60+ lbs. Trying to move in all of that sucks.

As far as forces using slings in Africa goes, sure I saw a lot of them but it was always military forces. I didn't see many natives using them at all. Personally I use a Vickers but I prefer 2 point slings rather than a single.

 

[60 buckscash]

I do not plan on going into combat, or carrying armor. This would be a non plate carrying vest. It would get used for a carbine class and for extended days on the range. This would also function as the gun part of a bug out kit. I am looking to hold 5-6 ar mags, 5 pistol mags, some water, and a small med kit. I don't know how I turned into a super slick operator ready to take on the world.

As for "african carry" here is what I am talking about http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6wn4kCmmDu4

 

[ChevyGuy91]

I don't know how I turned into a super slick operator ready to take on the world.

You asked a question about tactical gear on NES. There is no tolerance for that here, and jokes about BMI, chest rigs with plates that can take multiple hits from a .338 Lapua, mall ninja's, and Gecko45 will always be the result of interest in cool guy gear.

 

[op4guy]

There is a lot of wasted motion in that carry technique. When moving dynamic, you would find that long gun coming off your shoulder quite a bit. I am going to assume you are going to use a 2 point sling and if you look at a Vickers demo on good sling routing techniques you will find them to be a lot more secure.

I personally don't run a single point as it is a huge pain in the balls when you are moving dynamic. If you have ever been slapped in the junk by a 9# swinging rifle you will know what I am talking about. aside from using a weapons catch there is no good way to hold the gun to your body securely while moving.

If you are looking for gear for mainly carbine classes and oh shit scenarios there is a lot out there. I have run several setups over the years but one that I really liked is the BFG Ten Speed chest rig. It was very low profile and allowed for 6 mags on the chest with everything else being carried on the belt. The more you put things on your chest the harder it is to prone out and move that upper body.

I also use a 5.11 bag as a BOB. It can easily carry another 4 loaded mags and other stuff, easily slung and easily jettisoned if need be. Body type can play a huge part in efficiency of movement. There is so much info and diversity it is damn near staggering.

 

[M1911]

As for "african carry" here is what I am talking about http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6wn4kCmmDu4

Too slow and convoluted.

Put a two-point sling like a Vickers on your AR. Put the sling over your shoulder. Get in your fighting stance. Let go of your AR. It drops to your chest in front of you. Draw your handgun and shoot. Optionally, trap the AR against your chest with your weak hand.

 

[jkeeley1]

This would also function as the gun part of a bug out kit.http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6wn4kCmmDu4

I'm not going to knock this, because I think being prepared for the worst is the best idea you can have (Si vis pacem, para bellum), but I have found myself agreeing more and more lately with the school of thought that says your bug out kit should look as civilian as possible, be easily seen at long distances and contain the ability to camoflague itself (i.e. a como colored rain cover). the reason for this is that you probably dont want to be seen as a lone authority figure in a lawless situation and most bug out situations are probably not a hiding situation but more of a waiting to be found situation (but the camo packed away gives you the option to hide).

 

[Madball13]

I just picked up some gear from Tactical Tailor and ATS. I decided on the MAV 2-piece with the X-harness.
http://www.tacticaltailor.com/mavvestbody2piece.aspx
http://www.tacticaltailor.com/xharness.aspx
And some mag pouches that hold either 3 AR mags or 2 M1A mags. I will mainly keep only mag pouches on the chest rig and i decided on the two piece so it's only 2 clips to free the vest to go prone. From ATS i bought the war best with suspenders and on that i plan to mount a TT 1911 holster, 3 mag pouch and a dump pouch. I got everything in multi cam which looks slick and i can use everything out hunting if need be.
http://www.tacticaltailor.com/modularholster.aspx
http://www.tacticaltailor.com/triplepistolmagpouch.aspx
http://www.tacticaltailor.com/roll-updumpbag.aspx
http://www.atstacticalgear.com/cgi/commerce.cgi?preadd=action&key=ST-2603

I spent weeks looking for companies that made gear for decent prices and solid reviews.

I have all the TT gear in hand and it seems pretty tough and durable.

 

[ChevyGuy91]

Did someone clean this thread out?

 

[Admin]

I did

 

[Admin]

I spent weeks looking for companies that made gear for decent prices and solid reviews.

I have all the TT gear in hand and it seems pretty tough and durable.

There is a lot of crap out there, if the prices seems too good to be true it is.

 

[ChevyGuy91]

I did

Cool.

 

[ChevyGuy91]

I am a fan of the batman or "battle" belts more so then chest rigs.

I actually just ordered one from US Grunt Gear that only has MOLLE on your support side and the back to facilitate pouches and such, but the weapon side is just 1.75" belt so you can mount a kydex holster directly to it with out modifying it to work on MOLLE. I will post a picture of it when it comes in.

 

[Madball13]

There is a lot of crap out there, if the prices seems too good to be true it is.

TONS!! I decided on Multicam so that made decisions a little easier plus most crappy companies won't spend the money for true Mulitcam fabric to work on. ATS and TT seem solid from all the reviews i checked out on AR15 and M4Carbine. First thing i noticed about TT in the plastic used on the buckles, very solid. I have a shooting pad / gun case from either Condor or MOLLEgear and i snapped a buckle just by squeezing it.

 

[60 buckscash]

Thanks Derek!

@edmorseiii, I do like the idea of a belt and will be looking into that. My primary thoughts are to keep weight off of my waist and put it on my shoulders. But I do like that belt......

 

[Madball13]

Thanks Derek!

@edmorseiii, I do like the idea of a belt and will be looking into that. My primary thoughts are to keep weight off of my waist and put it on my shoulders. But I do like that belt......

Check out my link above for the ATS War Belt. The belt is $40, inner belt $20 and the suspenders $17. I figure i can load up my belt and disperse the weight better.

 

[ChevyGuy91]

For me, I don't see a need to carry more then 3 rifle mags on me, plus a belt is a lot easier to throw on quickly if that is something you desire.

 

[op4guy]

Belts can be a simple set up and easily ditched if needed. I run an ATS Warbelt setup:

On there is my ALS, BFG Ten Speed shingles, Max Rolly Polly, TT 3x Magna pistol pouches and a 5.11 aid kid that doesn't always live there. It simple enough to put on and off as needed and the ALS is on a 1.25" drop and routed through the bottom on a TT duty belt.

Don't think there isn't cheap multi-cam stuff out there because there is. Look for good companies like ATS, Blue-Force gear, Tactical Tailor, etc. Dealing directly with ATS, SKD Tactical, Tactical Tailor or Grey Group will ensure you are getting quality kit. Me personally it's easy to go to TT as they are about 15 miles from my house!

 

[MassMark]

The battle-belt suggestions are great....If you're looking to have one rig that will pack more stuff and will still be accessible, comfortable and modular - look into Arktis Classic M173 Noorloos, (used to be the 1624)...It has room for mags, VOK, food, water, etc. This is a post that guided me into an Arktis by someone who actually used it professionally and I'm glad I did. The beauty of this rig is that everything is there where you need it - no additional pouches to buy unless you need them and it's adjustable enough to toss over armor if you decide to plate-up...

http://www.m14tfl.com/upload/showpost.php?p=208012&postcount=7

 

[ShadeWPI]

Op4guy,

That's a nice looking belt-rig. My only question though - it seems like the rifle mags will end up on your strong side. Is that correct or am I missing how this wraps on the body?

I've always considered support side, slightly rear of center-line to be a better location for rifle mags so they can be accessed with the support hand, but again, am I missing something?

 

[ChevyGuy91]

I noticed that as well, but by the looks of the length of that belt, real estate maybe a premium.

I have one of these and an extra single AR mag pouch, great retention, low enough profile and keeps all my mags on one side.

Eagle Double M4, Quad 1911 Magazine Pouch

When I get home and get my new belt I will post pictures if this thread is still alive.