Storing firearms in a locked room

[namedpipes]

To which case do you refer?

If it's the Lowell case, the improper storage counts were eventually dropped (after a long time).

If it's another case, please cite it for reference.
And I said, "May or may not"; there's no definite answer. But the cable lock example meets the requirements of law, if not sense

Lowell. I wasn't really taking you to task, just using your post to mention that case.

However, were those charges dropped before or after the victim spent thousand$ defending himself, never mind the stress that has probably shaved years off his life. I mean that literally. Stress kills.

 

[MisterHappy]

Jeez guys im not tryna start an argument im having a discussion. I was just saying how the written law could be interpreted to defend this practice. I didnt say it woukd work 100 percent of the time with all judges. And if im peter pan that must make you tinkerbell pal

The problem that you seem to be having is that you're new here (by post count), and the subject under discussion has been chewed over, many times, with good and bad outcomes.

Your thought that the Law is the Law is often not the case; an interpretation of an activist judge can royally screw over a person that thought they were in compliance. And, even though you're legally in the good, you can still be jammed up and financially bled due to aggressive prosecution.

And if it's not 100%, do you want to be one of the ones not in the "good" judge pool? When a law requires interpretation, it can be interpreted unfavorably.

 

[MisterHappy]

Lowell. I wasn't really taking you to task, just using your post to mention that case.

However, were those charges dropped before or after the victim spent thousand$ defending himself, never mind the stress that has probably shaved years off his life. I mean that literally. Stress kills.

Oh, yeah, the dude was screwed over. My point was that if you use a closet (which may or may not satisfy the law, or its interpretation), then the way to be sure is to cable/trigger lock them per MGLs, too. [eyeroll]

 

[SigSlinger508]

The problem that you seem to be having is that you're new here (by post count), and the subject under discussion has been chewed over, many times, with good and bad outcomes.

Your thought that the Law is the Law is often not the case; an interpretation of an activist judge can royally screw over a person that thought they were in compliance. And, even though you're legally in the good, you can still be jammed up and financially bled due to aggressive prosecution.

And if it's not 100%, do you want to be one of the ones not in the "good" judge pool? When a law requires interpretation, it can be interpreted unfavorably.

new to this forum but not new to guns or firearms law and legislation. As stated im not talking about that i was simply stating what the written law is not that it will be followed that way by a judge. As far as I know there is no legal standard (letter if the law NOT judicial precedent) for what an acceptable "container" is. I kniw glove comparments dont count, i know there are rulings that set some precedent but im just talking about what the law says not how it is applied practiced and misinterpreted

 

[Len-2A Training]

new to this forum but not new to guns or firearms law and legislation. As stated im not talking about that i was simply stating what the written law is not that it will be followed that way by a judge. As far as I know there is no legal standard (letter if the law NOT judicial precedent) for what an acceptable "container" is. I kniw glove comparments dont count, i know there are rulings that set some precedent but im just talking about what the law says not how it is applied practiced and misinterpreted

I hear you BUT if a judge will frequently convict someone for "meeting the black letter of the law" it (IMNSHO) isn't real important to discuss what the black letter of the law is when we know that it will lead to a prosecution and likely conviction. You may disagree, but you are looking at "what should be" while many of us look at "what is" and the differences are sadly miles apart in this shithole of a state.

 

[Rob Boudrie]

I hear you BUT if a judge will frequently convict someone for "meeting the black letter of the law"

I know of one case where a search warrant was issued because someone was suspected of having a gun in a car on college property. Curiously, the search warrant application asserted this was illegal, and omitted the 269-10j distinction of "on ones person". So, in effect, you have a search warrant issued for the suspicion of lawful activity (it was established that the driver had an LTC).'

One of the first things the district court judge did was say that he "did not want to hear about excluding the search evidence". The owner got a CWOF for improper storage (the gun was in the passenger compartment), so it was not cost effective or practical to refuse the CWOF, take the conviction; fund an appeal and risk being a PP for life instead of the CWOF period.

 

[SigSlinger508]

I hear you BUT if a judge will frequently convict someone for "meeting the black letter of the law" it (IMNSHO) isn't real important to discuss what the black letter of the law is when we know that it will lead to a prosecution and likely conviction. You may disagree, but you are looking at "what should be" while many of us look at "what is" and the differences are sadly miles apart in this shithole of a state.

No argument there, completely understand the distinction we were making

 

[AHM]

I have an ayoob glue fume sniffing meme, I think I gotta do a Glidden one next....

Make it an Ayoob Glidden meme.
(That's where they insist you sniff the same brand of glue as Glidden).

What if I put a sign on the Armory door that says "Locked Container"...

What this web site needs is a forum thread containing prospective NES screen names
to be used as wildcard picks for people that can't decide on a cool alias.

How do gun stores with rifles on racks handle the "Locked Container" situation. It seems locked doors work for them.

Nobody has been prosecuted yet! Question amongst LE was only raised recently, my guess is that most are treating it with a wink and a nod . . . until something happens to shine a light on it and all hell will break loose.

Yeah, how's that workin' out lately?

 

[SS1]

So if the quandary is what consists of a definition of a locked container in the eye's of the law, Would these in said locked room, Since you need some storage cabinet's(these just as an example) anyway comply
If you think out of the box of norm

Global Industrial Flammable Cabinet, Manual Close Double Door, 30 Gallon, 43"Wx18"Dx44"H

Global Industrial Flammable Cabinet, Manual Close Double Door, 30 Gallon, 43"Wx18"Dx44"H. Ships in One Business Day. Buy it and Save at GlobalIndustrial.com

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West Galvanized Steel Storage Container 67 Cu. Ft., Model# Skid60 | Northern Tool

This sturdy, secure steel container offers 67 cu. ft. of storage for your valuable items and equipment. Constructed of corrosion-resistant ...

www.northerntool.com

 

[milktree]

So if the quandary is what consists of a definition of a locked container in the eye's of the law, Would these in said locked room, Since you need some storage cabinet's(these just as an example) anyway comply
If you think out of the box of norm

Global Industrial Flammable Cabinet, Manual Close Double Door, 30 Gallon, 43"Wx18"Dx44"H

Global Industrial Flammable Cabinet, Manual Close Double Door, 30 Gallon, 43"Wx18"Dx44"H. Ships in One Business Day. Buy it and Save at GlobalIndustrial.com

www.globalindustrial.com

West Galvanized Steel Storage Container 67 Cu. Ft., Model# Skid60 | Northern Tool

This sturdy, secure steel container offers 67 cu. ft. of storage for your valuable items and equipment. Constructed of corrosion-resistant ...

www.northerntool.com

Yes.

Just put a lock on it.

 

[greencobra]

if a locked room is a locked room then a locked house is a giant locked room.

 

[Len-2A Training]

Although it isn't in MGLs, no court has accepted any locked room/house/vehicle as a locked container. My IANAL belief is that if it has a window, it is unacceptable even if locked.

 

[Alien]

if a locked room is a locked then a locked house is a giant locked room.

Even though MA kangaroo courts don't agree I do!

 

[Soundwave]

What about a closet? When I redid my attic I put in a "closet" it's just a small storage area. We plan on moving soon and for various reasons the third floor is the best place for me to store things. I don't really feel like moving a safe up there etc.

 

[Ben Cartwright SASS]

Although it isn't in MGLs, no court has accepted any locked room/house/vehicle as a locked container. My IANAL belief is that if it has a window, it is unacceptable even if locked.

I wonder if my gun room would be a locked container, no windows and the only door has a outdoor keypad entry lock (Sledge) and there is a 24x7 monitored alarm on the door and motion sensor in the room. Of course inside there I have my stackon gun cabinets so the room is really overkill

 

[jasons]

I wonder if my gun room would be a locked container, no windows and the only door has a outdoor keypad entry lock (Sledge) and there is a 24x7 monitored alarm on the door and motion sensor in the room. Of course inside there I have my stackon gun cabinets so the room is really overkill

nope

 

[Ben Cartwright SASS]

BUT a glass fronted gun cabinet is a locked container, but a solid room, no windows and a wooden door is not, go figure, it is MASS

No one would think to break the glass

 

[namedpipes]

What about a closet? When I redid my attic I put in a "closet" it's just a small storage area. We plan on moving soon and for various reasons the third floor is the best place for me to store things. I don't really feel like moving a safe up there etc.

If you feel you can get to "moving day" without having SWAT raid your home, you should be fine. If you DO get raided before then, it probably, honestly, doesn't MATTER if you have the stuff in safes or just laying around in convenient corners.

If your closet is windowless and has a secure lock, I wouldn't worry too much about it and not at ALL if you also have trigger or cable locks on the guns. If you we going to do that long term, you 'd maybe want to think about it a bit.

 

[namedpipes]

Question for anyone actually familiar with the inner workings of police stations.

Do the fuzz have individual safes like most of us have or do they have a secure gun room and keep their guns / rifles racked in there?

I know Sheriff Taylor had a simple wooden gun rack in the office, but I'd expect modern police stations are little more elaborate.

 

[jasons]

BUT a glass fronted gun cabinet is a locked container, but a solid room, no windows and a wooden door is not, go figure, it is MASS

No one would think to break the glass

It’s much worse than that. The gun laws here are designed to f*** over the people. You could have a fully welded titanium safe with guard dogs and an on-duty cop watching over everything. If you’re a defendant you’ll lose.

 

[Len-2A Training]

BUT a glass fronted gun cabinet is a locked container, but a solid room, no windows and a wooden door is not, go figure, it is MASS

No one would think to break the glass

I disagree with jasons on the legality of your proposed setup.

 

[Soundwave]

If you feel you can get to "moving day" without having SWAT raid your home, you should be fine. If you DO get raided before then, it probably, honestly, doesn't MATTER if you have the stuff in safes or just laying around in convenient corners.

If your closet is windowless and has a secure lock, I wouldn't worry too much about it and not at ALL if you also have trigger or cable locks on the guns. If you we going to do that long term, you 'd maybe want to think about it a bit.

This will probably be a year or so but yes cable locks and trigger locks

 

[EJFudd]

I disagree with jasons on the legality of your proposed setup.

Now I'm confused. So a locked glass-front gun cabinet does not meet the requirements of the MA safe storage law?

It's not my cup of tea, but I always heard that as long as it was locked, it was good to go... glass or not. That's wrong?

 

[whacko]

Now I'm confused. So a locked glass-front gun cabinet does not meet the requirements of the MA safe storage law?

It's not my cup of tea, but I always heard that as long as it was locked, it was good to go... glass or not. That's wrong?

For home storage you could put a cable or trigger lock on the gun and your good anyway. Where in mgl does it say anything about a locked container IN THE HOME for storage.

 

[EJFudd]

Where in mgl does it say anything about a locked container IN THE HOME for storage.

"Section 131L. (a) It shall be unlawful to store or keep any firearm, rifle or shotgun including, but not limited to, large capacity weapons, or machine gun in any place unless such weapon is secured in a locked container or equipped with a tamper-resistant mechanical lock or other safety device, properly engaged so as to render such weapon inoperable by any person other than the owner or other lawfully authorized user."

 

[whacko]

"Section 131L. (a) It shall be unlawful to store or keep any firearm, rifle or shotgun including, but not limited to, large capacity weapons, or machine gun in any place unless such weapon is secured in a locked container or equipped with a tamper-resistant mechanical lock or other safety device, properly engaged so as to render such weapon inoperable by any person other than the owner or other lawfully authorized user."

Right.....but....
After the highlighted part it says OR other safety device engaged as to render the weapon inoperable by any person other than the owner or other lawfully authorized use.

So.....you can by law use a locked container OR a trigger or cable lock. Both are not required. Period end of story. You can put a cable or trigger lock on your favorite rifle and hang it over the mantle. Legal......according to mass storage law.

 

[jasons]

I disagree with jasons on the legality of your proposed setup.

Might be time to polish your crystal ball. The law is what the commonwealth says it is and if there was a charge and you’re not Charlie Baker’s son something will stick regardless of what some words on a page say.

 

[Rob Boudrie]

Although it isn't in MGLs, no court has accepted any locked room/house/vehicle as a locked container. My IANAL belief is that if it has a window, it is unacceptable even if locked.

However, the EOPS has stated that a locked trunk is a locked container and done so on the web giving tangible evidence of such estoppel.

 

[namedpipes]

I disagree with jasons on the legality of your proposed setup.

Just for the sake of clarity, are you saying the locked, windowless room with a strong door and good lock are compliant, or are you saying the locked, glass front cabinet is not?

 

[DJBrad]

Yup and LE can keep loaded rifles on the back seat of their cruiser. In plain view but not us plebs.