Supreme Court - NYSRPA v. Bruen - Megathread

[P51MA]

This ruling, and other posturing up is likely to make an AWB difficult to slam through. And. 1994 election level problems or worse WILL happen.

That said, my fear will likely play out. Expect to see a push not for guns in the form of an AWB, or mags, in the form of a 15rnd limit nation wide, but on ammo. Limiting sales through banks and CC company coordination, requiring a permit to purchase, stamping, making ammo sales require proof of purchase and no cash, no cross state line ammo, etc.

We’re increasingly able to route around CC processors and activist banks with bitcoin based payment systems. Strike app is a good example that is easy to use.

Federal govt can certainly try to hamper online sales but ammo is also covered under the 2nd amendment and therefor the bruen ruling.

The weakest point is probably self defense laws. The anti-gun side will push anarchotyranny and bad self defense laws, in order to make life difficult for good guys while letting their pet bad guys do as they please. Their goal being: “fine, you can all own guns, we’ll just make it so you can never use them”.

 

[Dench]

The elimination of tiers of scrutiny, intermediate scrutiny, affects ALL states.

Awesome

 

[Picton]

Haven't yet seen an answer. I was specifically asking about any changes in applications. Have seen none yet.

I think we'd need to hear from someone applying in the last two weeks, but also clued-in enough to come here and post about it AND with a decent knowledge of what the old app looked like, so that they can realize there's a difference.

That's more of a unicorn than it might seem.

 

[Mesatchornug]

I think we'd need to hear from someone applying in the last two weeks, but also clued-in enough to come here and post about it AND with a decent knowledge of what the old app looked like, so that they can realize there's a difference.

That's more of a unicorn than it might seem.

I downloaded the app recently, too help friends apply. As of last week, it's unchanged.

 

[Picton]

I downloaded the app recently, too help friends apply. As of last week, it's unchanged.

Welp, there's the answer.

 

[Mesatchornug]

Welp, there's the answer.

I'm sure it'll change, eventually. But the Commonwealth doesn't like to bend until it has to and modifying documents means getting people to do work...

 

[HorizontalHunter]

I downloaded the app recently, too help friends apply. As of last week, it's unchanged.

Same here. I‘m renewing again as well.

We are allowed to apply two months prior to expiration. My wife renewed in the spring and she applied for her renewal almost two months to the day and it took three months.

Bob

 

[SFC13557]

That charge would be in the noise compared to the other hassles the individual would have to deal with.

I agree but if it was a good shoot they could still charge him/her with license violation just to hem person up. Remember BPS Guard who shot and killed psycho attacking DR at Boston hospital, he was in limbo for months over nonsense charges by DA.

 

[JoseyWales]

I renewed in May (ante-Bruen), and they were still face diaper paranoid. So it wasn't face-to-face. I was emailed a PDF LTC app to fill out (editable on a PC). I filled it out and emailed it back to him. I have no friends (except you guys/gals) so I asked him if I need letters of reference and he said "NO, not needed". I still had to print out a letter to the Chief asking permission for an LTC . (copied a stock letter from NES.) Got my receipt and still waiting for the LTC (in the mail I guess).

 

[SFC13557]

"The court has changed, it’s not the 4 conservatives and Kennedy, there are 6 reliable conservatives on most issue, 5 on nearly all. This was the first full term for the 6 conservative block and the liberal court watchers were devastated by the term, SCOTUS didn’t take some cases because the conservatives couldn’t trust Kennedy, now they have fellow justices they trust.

Be patient, it’s a very different court."

You are correct thanks to Donald Trump. Trump will haunt the Dems long after he is gone and they know it. After the Affirmative action case is ruled on the Leftists won't be able to deny their anti-Asian racism.

 

[P51MA]

I think we'd need to hear from someone applying in the last two weeks, but also clued-in enough to come here and post about it AND with a decent knowledge of what the old app looked like, so that they can realize there's a difference.

That's more of a unicorn than it might seem.

The state app is unchanged so far, however my licensing officer seemed to be still mulling over the implications of bruen.

My BFS cert is dated 2014 lol, so he mentioned that some towns would probably have denied it, but then remarked (kinda contradicting first statement) that it still fulfills the requirement so he is required to issue it now. Although he didn’t specifically mention scotus/bruen he was obviously aware.

Very little small talk besides that, straight to business, in and out, check your mail in 4-6 weeks. It’s known to be a green town anyways. Guy seemed nice, pleasant experience even though I feel really awkward being in a police station.

 

[M1911]

I agree but if it was a good shoot they could still charge him/her with license violation just to hem person up. Remember BPS Guard who shot and killed psycho attacking DR at Boston hospital, he was in limbo for months over nonsense charges by DA.

The DA never charged him.

 

[SFC13557]

The DA never charged him.

Correct but his life was in limbo for months because they dragged their feet in clearing him. I believe his permit/license was suspended for months meaning he couldn't work I believe.

 

[Picton]

Correct but his life was in limbo for months because they dragged their feet in clearing him. I believe his permit/license was suspended for months meaning he couldn't work I believe.

His case is the one that comes to mind, for me, when running through these kinds of scenarios and practicing situational awareness. He was a squeaky-clean Good Guy who did everything right in a case where his actions were an absolutely clear-cut case of lifesaving intervention... and still they "investigated" him for six months. And his town's CoP could have ganked or restricted his license at any time if he disagreed with the DA's decision not to charge.

Shameful. It's nice, I guess, that the CoP no longer has that ability. But intervening on a stranger's behalf remains something I'm hesitant to do, mostly because of what happened to that guy.

 

[vicorjh]

Another Heller lawsuit on ammunition limits:


View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1rRERcado9o

 

[Dench]

Another Heller lawsuit on ammunition limits:


View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1rRERcado9o

One day the left makes fun of people for being untrained and the next they want to take the ability to train away.

 

[Hoover]

"The court has changed, it’s not the 4 conservatives and Kennedy, there are 6 reliable conservatives on most issue, 5 on nearly all. This was the first full term for the 6 conservative block and the liberal court watchers were devastated by the term, SCOTUS didn’t take some cases because the conservatives couldn’t trust Kennedy, now they have fellow justices they trust.

Be patient, it’s a very different court."

You are correct thanks to Donald Trump. Trump will haunt the Dems long after he is gone and they know it. After the Affirmative action case is ruled on the Leftists won't be able to deny their anti-Asian racism.

3 of the NYSRPA were W and HW bush nominees. The effort to change the courts in a result of many. McConnell and other senators, the federalist social, many conservative groups and trump. McConnell and GOP senators only confirmed one or two Obama appeal court nominees and didn’t even have a hearing for garland. That meant dozens of openings on courts the day trump took office.

If the GOP takes the senate, they’ll do the same again and hopefully give a GOP POTUS in 2025 dozens of openings to fill.

 

[SFC13557]

3 of the NYSRPA were W and HW bush nominees. The effort to change the courts in a result of many. McConnell and other senators, the federalist social, many conservative groups and trump. McConnell and GOP senators only confirmed one or two Obama appeal court nominees and didn’t even have a hearing for garland. That meant dozens of openings on courts the day trump took office.

If the GOP takes the senate, they’ll do the same again and hopefully give a GOP POTUS in 2025 dozens of openings to fill.

Cocaine Mitch blocked Garland in a huge gamble which paid off and thanks to Nasty Harry Reid Trump appointed many lower court judges. The Dems have only themselves to blame for the courts. "Elections Have Consequences", who said that? If Corrupt Hillary had won there would be 6 liberal judges on the court so they leftists should direct their anger at her not on Trump picks. Some one of these CSers is going to get killed soon harassing Justices and Republicans and it can't happen soon enough. Bidens DOJ has declared open season on Trump appointees and former admin staff members and after their defeat in the midterms the GOP will open hearings on the Hunter/Joe connections and all hell will break loose. Keep your powder dry my friends, the left is imploding, and desperate folks do desperate things. If I was ever confronted in a restaurant by these pathetic leftists I sure as hell wouldn't be running out the back door. Did anyone read the story of this group "shut down DC" calling for restaurant servers to text them if any Conservative SCJ's show up at their restaurants? That's a call to arms and war.

 

[fshalor]

But the standard dictated in NYSRPA says text and history, those regulations won’t comply with that. All the modern ideas for gun control were not what was used in 1791 or around the ratification of the 14th amendment.

I want to be optimistic but I as an engineer can't see the connection to ammo with text and history. Speaking explicitly. Hollow point vs Geneva convention allowed/proscribed FMJ.

Text and history, to my eye makes full auto kit be on the table. But potentially nixes hollow point defensive rounds (or at least doesn't implicitly include).

 

[KBCraig]

It could be awhile.

I'm sure that when SCOTUS ruled in Brown v Board of Education, a lot of people thought segregation was going to end NOW! But that was in 1954, and there were still years of struggle ahead. Hell, "liberal" Boston didn't get its schools fully desegregated until the 1980s! And de facto school segregation still exists in a lot of places.

I think we should look at Bruen the same way. This is as huge for our movement as Brown was for anti-segregationists. But it will take years for the effects to be fully realized. So no need to get up early.

Taxed and redistributed.

 

[pastera]

Shameful. It's nice, I guess, that the CoP no longer has that ability. But intervening on a stranger's behalf remains something I'm hesitant to do, mostly because of what happened to that guy.

My hesitancy also includes the fact that most people in Mass would push for my prosecution if it were not them or their loved ones that were the third party that was protected by my use of force.

An openly anti-2a person at work commented that he knew that I would protect him with my gun if the situation arose. He was amazed when I told him that I would not only stand by and watch but would also inform the person that I would not interfere if he was to rob, assault or murder the anti.

 

[pastera]

I want to be optimistic but I as an engineer can't see the connection to ammo with text and history. Speaking explicitly. Hollow point vs Geneva convention allowed/proscribed FMJ.

Text and history, to my eye makes full auto kit be on the table. But potentially nixes hollow point defensive rounds (or at least doesn't implicitly include).

I believe that ammo and magazines are addressed in passing on either Heller or McDonald - would need to reread to point out the exact wording.
However, a plain reading of Heller, McDonald or Bruen would make it clear that for one to have the right to bear arms it must extend the right to all items necessary for the use of those arms.

 

[CatSnoutSoup]

Another Heller lawsuit on ammunition limits:


View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1rRERcado9o

That is cool for DC, truly.
Poke me when we get a new mag limits suit in MA.

 

[drgrant]

I understand but I meant some restricted LTC holder who had to defend himself with his/her licensed pistol getting charged with carrying with a restricted LTC.

That’s a non starter if you have to defend yourself thats always been a 1000x bigger deal than ignoring the dumb restrictions. Even before Bruen.

 

[drgrant]

Is this case still beyond useless or has something changed?

It’s not useless. it might take a couple years for the ActuallyGreat(tm) stuff to come out of it though. Peons are or soon will be able to get new LTC in shit towns with no restrictions though, thats a huge thing by itself.

 

[drgrant]

And just think that the left is now obsessed with it's own version of segregation and de facto caste systems.

Back and forth we go. Or maybe more like a circle? Or swirling around something? Like a drain? Dunno.

I'd be pretty thrilled at this point if the US just got it over with and broke up into several countries.



For sure. which is one of the reasons why I didnt want it heard. The win is... well.. you know and the loss is an actual legit loss. It was nothing more than an easy near consequence free 2A case for SCOTUS. I was saying that as soon as this case got granted cert. It was an easy way for SCOTUS to claim it sorta occasionally cares about 2A cases.

If I was an anti gun person I'd be thrilled with this case. We just blew out load on a complete waste of time. Any anti with a brain knows it.

Antis hate this case though, it just f***ed up a lot of their playbook…. I also don’t think this court is done yet with 2A cases, there are still more in the “federal slow colon” that haven’t been shat out yet.

 

[Lank]

Correct but his life was in limbo for months because they dragged their feet in clearing him. I believe his permit/license was suspended for months meaning he couldn't work I believe.

This- 6 + months I believe

 

[Mesatchornug]

I believe that ammo and magazines are addressed in passing on either Heller or McDonald - would need to reread to point out the exact wording.
However, a plain reading of Heller, McDonald or Bruen would make it clear that for one to have the right to bear arms it must extend the right to all items necessary for the use of those arms.

Right.
A sword is an arm on its own.
Firearms are a system that functions only with ammunition. To protect that as an arm, one must include its fuel.

Heller, Caetano, and Bruen all made it clear that modern firearms are protected. Modern ammunition would naturally follow. That hollow points are constrained under Geneva only affects the wartime uses of arms. These recent decisions hinge on the right of the individual beyond membership in the unorganized militia.

 

[VetteGirlMA]

My hesitancy also includes the fact that most people in Mass would push for my prosecution if it were not them or their loved ones that were the third party that was protected by my use of force.

An openly anti-2a person at work commented that he knew that I would protect him with my gun if the situation arose. He was amazed when I told him that I would not only stand by and watch but would also inform the person that I would not interfere if he was to rob, assault or murder the anti.

I've had lefties say the same thing to me, that because I'm armed I'm going to protect them. I told them flat out the only thing I'm doing is whipping out my cell phone to capture your dying moment. In this state if you think I'm going to go to jail for some leftie then someone is smoking the wrong stuff. I can imagine the scenario, save a lefty from a violent bipoc attack, stop imminent death and afterwards they say "you didn't have to kill the poor little dindunuffin" and with that testimony I'm facing life in prison. The less liberals on this planet the better this planet will be. There's nothing to gained saving the life of arrogant cowards. Thank goodness the left is sterilizing itself (vasectomies, tube ties and sex reassignment surgeries) into oblivion. In a few hundred years they will all be gone.

 

[DarthRevan]

Thank goodness the left is sterilizing itself (vasectomies, tube ties and sex reassignment surgeries) into oblivion. In a few hundred years they will all be gone.

You’re a little too optimistic.
They have a funny way of recruiting enough to still piss in the pool with regularity.