Supreme Court - NYSRPA v. Bruen - Megathread

[Hoover]

If SCOTUS is reversing roe, I feel pretty good about SCOTUS finally making real pro 2A decisions, including mag limits and AWB.

 

[general disorder]

I'm pretty sure the price of heating oil,food,and gas is going to pretty much "Trump" most any thing else short of a nuclear war right now.

 

[Waher]

If SCOTUS is reversing roe, I feel pretty good about SCOTUS finally making real pro 2A decisions, including mag limits and AWB.

An opinion which includes reversing Miller resulting in the NFA being abolished? Woah woah woah a man can only dream so much about things other than women.

 

[Mesatchornug]

An opinion which includes reversing Miller resulting in the NFA being abolished? Woah woah woah a man can only dream so much about things other than women.

looks in crystal ball -

THOMAS: The key question in this case is “whether the Second Amendment allows the government to prohibit ordinary law-abiding citizens from carrying handguns outside the home for self defense.” [...] This court finds that the Second Amendment prohibits any restraint on the right of the People to keep and bear arms. In keeping with this finding, all laws of the US and the several States with respect to the manufacture, possession, or carry of weapons are Unconstitutional and are hereby repealed.

 

[Rob Boudrie]

SCOTUS is backed into a logical wall: To uphold the NY licensing scheme, it must declare that some people are more equal than others. That is a totally separate issue from the 2A, but logic points in the same direction towards a favorable 2A decision.

The question may become "is it more palatable to the system to elevate the rights of the commoner to that of the elite, or to start treating the elites like commoners when it comes to gun licensing"?

 

[cathouse01]

If SCOTUS is reversing roe, I feel pretty good about SCOTUS finally making real pro 2A decisions, including mag limits and AWB.

Unfortunately, I don’t feel so positive about a broad 2A decision in NY State Rifle & Pistol Assn. v. City of NY, particularly if they end up reversing Roe. After overturning Roe they may feel they have to throw the left something and therefore issue a very narrow opinion in the case, only striking down the arbitrary way of determining just cause for being issued a carry permit.

Even in Heller, the SJC said that certain restrictions on firearm possession were reasonable as long as they didn’t fundamentally prevent a citizen in good standing from owning firearms to protect themselves. Then look at MA. I live in MA, rigorously obey all the firearms related laws and yet still own everything from a pre ban AR (with all the evil features) to a .50 BMG and several handguns. From the SJC’s point of view, my ability to own firearms for selfdefense has not been significantly infringed. They don’t care that, from my point of view, licensing requirements, Assault Weapons Bans, magazine limits, arbitrary “suitability” requirements, ridiculous “Consumer Protection” requirements, etc all infringe on my Right to Keep and Bear Arms. They look at it and ask “Can he get a handgun?” Yup, as long as he lives in a “green" town (and a narrow finding in NY State Rifle & Pistol Assn. v. City of NY would probably force the State to more rigorously codify its arbitrary “suitability” requirement and enforce a standard application process, thus eliminating the concept of a “green” town). They ask “Can he get a modern rifle?” Sure, he can get a Mini 14, even the big 2A supporters say that the Mini 14 is just as lethal as the AR 15.

Hopefully I’m wrong and they will take this opportunity to declare that any law infringing on the 2A must undergo “strict scrutiny” and be narrowly tailored to achieve a compelling state interest. But I’m afraid the Roe reversal actually will make this less likely.

 

[Chevy 2 65]

SCOTUS is backed into a logical wall: To uphold the NY licensing scheme, it must declare that some people are more equal than others. That is a totally separate issue from the 2A, but logic points in the same direction towards a favorable 2A decision.

The question may become "is it more palatable to the system to elevate the rights of the commoner to that of the elite, or to start treating the elites like commoners when it comes to gun licensing"?

Should be NO "gun licensing" NONE. That will never come from SCOTUS.

 

[Dench]

Unfortunately, I don’t feel so positive about a broad 2A decision in NY State Rifle & Pistol Assn. v. City of NY, particularly if they end up reversing Roe. After overturning Roe they may feel they have to throw the left something and therefore issue a very narrow opinion in the case, only striking down the arbitrary way of determining just cause for being issued a carry permit.

Even in Heller, the SJC said that certain restrictions on firearm possession were reasonable as long as they didn’t fundamentally prevent a citizen in good standing from owning firearms to protect themselves. Then look at MA. I live in MA, rigorously obey all the firearms related laws and yet still own everything from a pre ban AR (with all the evil features) to a .50 BMG and several handguns. From the SJC’s point of view, my ability to own firearms for selfdefense has not been significantly infringed. They don’t care that, from my point of view, licensing requirements, Assault Weapons Bans, magazine limits, arbitrary “suitability” requirements, ridiculous “Consumer Protection” requirements, etc all infringe on my Right to Keep and Bear Arms. They look at it and ask “Can he get a handgun?” Yup, as long as he lives in a “green" town (and a narrow finding in NY State Rifle & Pistol Assn. v. City of NY would probably force the State to more rigorously codify its arbitrary “suitability” requirement and enforce a standard application process, thus eliminating the concept of a “green” town). They ask “Can he get a modern rifle?” Sure, he can get a Mini 14, even the big 2A supporters say that the Mini 14 is just as lethal as the AR 15.

Hopefully I’m wrong and they will take this opportunity to declare that any law infringing on the 2A must undergo “strict scrutiny” and be narrowly tailored to achieve a compelling state interest. But I’m afraid the Roe reversal actually will make this less likely.

Heller and Mcdonald go completely ignored.

 

[Coyote33]

I’ve been quite surprised at the low level of reaction by people. No big marches or anything. Am I just out of touch and not paying attention?

You might be out of touch. It is all over the news and media.

SCOTUS is backed into a logical wall: To uphold the NY licensing scheme, it must declare that some people are more equal than others. That is a totally separate issue from the 2A, but logic points in the same direction towards a favorable 2A decision.

The question may become "is it more palatable to the system to elevate the rights of the commoner to that of the elite, or to start treating the elites like commoners when it comes to gun licensing"?

Well put!

 

[Hoover]

SCOTUS is backed into a logical wall: To uphold the NY licensing scheme, it must declare that some people are more equal than others. That is a totally separate issue from the 2A, but logic points in the same direction towards a favorable 2A decision.

The question may become "is it more palatable to the system to elevate the rights of the commoner to that of the elite, or to start treating the elites like commoners when it comes to gun licensing"?

A lot of the arguments focused on the unequal treatment and several justices ask the NY solicitor general what other constitutional rights are subject to government approval.

I think it may even be 7-2, 8-1 to strike down the NY state licensing scheme. The dictates beyond that, what standard of review should be used in 2a cases will be 6-3 or 5-4

 

[Hoover]

Unfortunately, I don’t feel so positive about a broad 2A decision in NY State Rifle & Pistol Assn. v. City of NY, particularly if they end up reversing Roe. After overturning Roe they may feel they have to throw the left something and therefore issue a very narrow opinion in the case, only striking down the arbitrary way of determining just cause for being issued a carry permit.

Even in Heller, the SJC said that certain restrictions on firearm possession were reasonable as long as they didn’t fundamentally prevent a citizen in good standing from owning firearms to protect themselves. Then look at MA. I live in MA, rigorously obey all the firearms related laws and yet still own everything from a pre ban AR (with all the evil features) to a .50 BMG and several handguns. From the SJC’s point of view, my ability to own firearms for selfdefense has not been significantly infringed. They don’t care that, from my point of view, licensing requirements, Assault Weapons Bans, magazine limits, arbitrary “suitability” requirements, ridiculous “Consumer Protection” requirements, etc all infringe on my Right to Keep and Bear Arms. They look at it and ask “Can he get a handgun?” Yup, as long as he lives in a “green" town (and a narrow finding in NY State Rifle & Pistol Assn. v. City of NY would probably force the State to more rigorously codify its arbitrary “suitability” requirement and enforce a standard application process, thus eliminating the concept of a “green” town). They ask “Can he get a modern rifle?” Sure, he can get a Mini 14, even the big 2A supporters say that the Mini 14 is just as lethal as the AR 15.

Hopefully I’m wrong and they will take this opportunity to declare that any law infringing on the 2A must undergo “strict scrutiny” and be narrowly tailored to achieve a compelling state interest. But I’m afraid the Roe reversal actually will make this less likely.

The case was argued in early November, the vote on the case to assign who write it, etc was probably done prior to the Mississippi abortion case was even heard (December 1st). I don’t think this courts conservative majority (Barrett, Kavanaugh, Alito, Thomas and Gorsuch) care about public pressure. They’ve already accepted an affirmative action case for next term (Asian students suing Harvard and UNC). It’s very likely affirmative action in college admissions is ruled unconstitutional, Roberts has always wanted that, so even he won’t go squishy there.

The left is going to go bananas over affirmative action going bye bye. That reaction will be much more angry than the abortion ruling. If they were meek, they wouldn’t take all these hot button issues.

 

[Talon3]

NC will have constitutional carry when they get a GOP governor, especially if it’s the current Lt governor.

Its one of the reasons I bought land in NC, in an incorporated area, Brunswick County. 20 min to Myrtle Beach SC.

 

[Waher]

Heller and Mcdonald go completely ignored.

Ditto for Caetano.

 

[Lank]

SCOTUS is backed into a logical wall: To uphold the NY licensing scheme, it must declare that some people are more equal than others. That is a totally separate issue from the 2A, but logic points in the same direction towards a favorable 2A decision.

The question may become "is it more palatable to the system to elevate the rights of the commoner to that of the elite, or to start treating the elites like commoners when it comes to gun licensing"?

I mean this is a generally curious way- is the second statement above pure sarcasm, or the truth?

 

[Hoover]

Ditto for Caetano.

What stinks with Massachusetts vs NY, NJ, IL, etc is the 1st circuit court of appeals is horrendous. If the NYSRPA case goes well and SCOTUS dictates the standard to follow for 2A cases the 2nd, 3rd and 7th are much more likely to follow the dictates than the 1st.

 

[cathouse01]

I mean this is a generally curious way- is the second statement above pure sarcasm, or the truth?

Though many will disagree with me, I consider the second statement the truth. If there is a narrow finding, I can see MA feeling that they have to get their licensing more standardized. The idea of having “green” towns shows that the licensing process in MA is not consistent across the entire state. If that’s the case, I don’t see the MA legislature reducing the requirements to the “least common denominator”. I see them upping the requirements to match that of the most extreme town. Must have live fire training, must pass a live fire qualification test, must have two letters of reference, must have a certificate of mental health. They’re not going to make it easier for the “plebs” to get a license, they’ll just make it harder for everyone.

 

[DarthRevan]

The Left is all marched out. And I think the majority of even their "base" understands that this was a bad ruling to begin with and it was due to change.

Lol the Facebook women in my life are all up in arms about it. They were all voting D anyways so I’m not surprised.

 

[Bonesinium]

think it may even be 7-2, 8-1 to strike down the NY state licensing scheme.

But do you really?

 

[Hoover]

But do you really?

On the arbitrary nature of the current licensing scheme. I think kagan and Breyer may find the current unconstitutional but be ok with a different scheme. Won’t matter because they certainly won’t want to go as far as the 5 or 6 in the majority.

 

[ridleyman]

I'll agree with that. But you're talking the 10% that is far-Left. Most of the "Left" in the past is real centrist. And they aren't marching. They're marched out. From Occupado de la Estrada de Pared to P-hat Parade to BLM to Antifa to NoPoliceNoPeace - they're all marched out. In fact, there are a lot of marchers who are wondering WTF they were doing. Screw me once, shame on you. Screw me twice, well, maybe I'm a bit thick. Screw me a 3rd time. . . hey wait a second - maybe EVERYHTING you say is a lie!

That's not good for the Lefti

I wish that it was only 10% I think it's more like 20-25, as more of these scum become radicalized, and they're driving the party...hopefully to its ruin.

 

[Rob Boudrie]

The competing interests between "ban the guns" and "treat people equally" could be difficult for liberal justices to resolve.

 

[safetyfirst2125]

If SCOTUS is reversing roe, I feel pretty good about SCOTUS finally making real pro 2A decisions, including mag limits and AWB.

Fingers crossed.

 

[Coyote33]

The competing interests between "ban the guns" and "treat people equally" could be difficult for liberal justices to resolve.

Another "WELL PUT"!!!!!

 

[cathouse01]

The competing interests between "ban the guns" and "treat people equally" could be difficult for liberal justices to resolve.

Not really, they just want to ban the guns for everyone. That certainly is treating people equally.

 

[Rob Boudrie]

Not really, they just want to ban the guns for everyone. That certainly is treating people equally.

But the elite, whose opinions and influence actually matters to those in power, will not stand for it.

 

[cathouse01]

But the elite, whose opinions and influence actually matters to those in power, will not stand for it.

I not sure about that, as long as there is a carveout for “security personal” they’ll be happy. The truly elite don’t carry themselves, they just hire people for that (look at Bloomberg).

 

[SFC13557]

The Left is all marched out. And I think the majority of even their "base" understands that this was a bad ruling to begin with and it was due to change.

They were until the leak from Supreme Court on abortion.

 

[SFC13557]

If SCOTUS is reversing roe, I feel pretty good about SCOTUS finally making real pro 2A decisions, including mag limits and AWB.

I agree but I hope the Conservative Justices have armed security. I wouldn't put it past these fanatics to try to take out Kavanaugh in a suicide mission knowing Dementia Joe would get another pick. Greatest accomplishment of Trumps Presidency was 3 Supreme Court Justice's and the left will NEVER forget it.

 

[Waher]

I agree but I hope the Conservative Justices have armed security. I wouldn't put it past these fanatics to try to take out Kavanaugh in a suicide mission knowing Dementia Joe would get another pick.

Federal Marshalls guard SCotUS Justices like the Secret Service guards the President.

 

[Hoover]

I agree but I hope the Conservative Justices have armed security. I wouldn't put it past these fanatics to try to take out Kavanaugh in a suicide mission knowing Dementia Joe would get another pick. Greatest accomplishment of Trumps Presidency was 3 Supreme Court Justice's and the left will NEVER forget it.

@Waher answered it. You’ll see video on the news some time of justice Roberts leaving his house in the morning. He gets into an SUV and someone is holding a door for him, they are his security. At the court, there is a parking area under the building, a retractable bollard security gate, etc.

It’s beyond asinine a liberal group published the justices addresses.

Beyond SCOTUS, there were dozens of conservative judges out on the 2nd highest court, the circuit courts of appeals. Over 1/2 of them have a major of GOP nominated judges now.