Supreme Judicial Court rules possessing a switchblade knife is no longer a crime under the 2nd Amendment

chris_1001 said:
Yeah, forget the Cite, sure someone can find it, but because it can deploy the blade one handed by a feature or such... (paraphrasing)

ETA Found this while searching...

www.northeastshooters.com

Mass Knife Law

Is it true that you can only carry a 2.5" blade in MA? I looked at MGL's and then measured the folding knife my son has and it's 3" and he carries it everywhere. I don't want him to get in trouble but it seems silly to not let him carry it. He goes to private school and he can actually carry...
www.northeastshooters.com www.northeastshooters.com
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So that means anything with a flipper or thumb stud?
 
whatluck said:
So that means anything with a flipper or thumb stud?
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I don't think anything with flipper or thumb stud was ever considered to be illegal under that law (though apparently some ADAs tried to make that argument from time to time). But knives with the Emerson Wave are different because the Wave allowed them to open on the draw. Under my reading, the Emerson Wave was illegal to carry under that law. Whether this decision changes that for knives like the Emerson Wave isn't clear to me.
 
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M1911 said:
I don't think anything with flipper or thumb stud was ever considered to be illegal under that law (though apparently some ADAs tried to make that argument from time to time). But knives with the Emerson Wave a different because the Wave allowed them to open on the draw. Under my reading, the Emerson Wave was illegal to carry under that law. Whether this decision changes that for knives like the Emerson Wave isn't clear to me.
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What I find interesting about Chapter 269 SECTION 10 is the following language (bolding is mine)

"No person having in effect a license to carry firearms for any purpose, issued under section one hundred and thirty-one or section one hundred and thirty-one F of chapter one hundred and forty shall be deemed to be in violation of this section."

So anyone with a LTC is exempt from this entire section. In practice they seem to have tried to limit this to (a) where this verbage exists. But SECTION means this entire section, not just subsection (a). Two paragraphs later it says

"The provisions of this subsection shall not affect the licensing requirements of section one hundred and twenty-nine C of chapter one hundred and forty which require every person not otherwise duly licensed or exempted to have been issued a firearms identification card in order to possess a firearm, rifle or shotgun in his residence or place of business."

This clearly only impacts subsection (a).

Really curious how this happens that they try and limit the LTC exemption to just (a)...
 
M1911 said:
I don't think anything with flipper or thumb stud was ever considered to be illegal under that law (though apparently some ADAs tried to make that argument from time to time). But knives with the Emerson Wave a different because the Wave allowed them to open on the draw. Under my reading, the Emerson Wave was illegal to carry under that law. Whether this decision changes that for knives like the Emerson Wave isn't clear to me.
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This is how I thought of it all as well.

Flipper/stud good... Wave/button (on an Auto)/gravity bad...
 
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CrackPot said:
What I find interesting about Chapter 269 SECTION 10 is the following language (bolding is mine)

"No person having in effect a license to carry firearms for any purpose, issued under section one hundred and thirty-one or section one hundred and thirty-one F of chapter one hundred and forty shall be deemed to be in violation of this section."

So anyone with a LTC is exempt from this entire section. In practice they seem to have tried to limit this to (a) where this verbage exists. But SECTION means this entire section, not just subsection (a). Two paragraphs later it says

"The provisions of this subsection shall not affect the licensing requirements of section one hundred and twenty-nine C of chapter one hundred and forty which require every person not otherwise duly licensed or exempted to have been issued a firearms identification card in order to possess a firearm, rifle or shotgun in his residence or place of business."

This clearly only impacts subsection (a).

Really curious how this happens that they try and limit the LTC exemption to just (a)...
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I think the legislature didnt want carry of any of the weapons in (b) to be legal if you had a LTC.

(b) Whoever, except as provided by law, carries on his person, or carries on his person or under his control in a vehicle, any stiletto, dagger or a device or case which enables a knife with a locking blade to be drawn at a locked position, any ballistic knife, or any knife with a detachable blade capable of being propelled by any mechanism, dirk knife, any knife having a double-edged blade, or a switch knife, or any knife having an automatic spring release device by which the blade is released from the handle, having a blade of over one and one-half inches, or a slung shot, blowgun, blackjack, metallic knuckles or knuckles of any substance which could be put to the same use with the same or similar effect as metallic knuckles, nunchaku, zoobow, also known as klackers or kung fu sticks, or any similar weapon consisting of two sticks of wood, plastic or metal connected at one end by a length of rope, chain, wire or leather, a shuriken or any similar pointed starlike object intended to injure a person when thrown, or any armband, made with leather which has metallic spikes, points or studs or any similar device made from any other substance or a cestus or similar material weighted with metal or other substance and worn on the hand, or a manrikigusari or similar length of chain having weighted ends; or whoever, when arrested upon a warrant for an alleged crime, or when arrested while committing a breach or disturbance of the public peace, is armed with or has on his person, or has on his person or under his control in a vehicle, a billy or other dangerous weapon other than those herein mentioned and those mentioned in paragraph (a), shall be punished by imprisonment for not less than two and one-half years nor more than five years in the state prison, or for not less than six months nor more than two and one-half years in a jail or house of correction, except that, if the court finds that the defendant has not been previously convicted of a felony, he may be punished by a fine of not more than fifty dollars or by imprisonment for not more than two and one-half years in a jail or house of correction.
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I believe all of this stuff is legal to have in ones home.
 
Cap'n Mike said:
I think the legislature didnt want carry of any of the weapons in (b) to be legal if you had a LTC.



I believe all of this stuff is legal to have in ones home.
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I understand their intent. The problem is that our legislators likely cannot pass a 3rd grade english test. As written the language that says this section does not apply to LTC holders would cover all of 269 10, not just 269 10 (a). Seems straight forward. Had they said subsection it would have done what they meant.
 
chris_1001 said:
This is how I thought of it all as well.

Flipper/stud good... Wave/button/gravity bad...
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Are you mixing manual button locks in with automatics? If you think manual button locks were illegal, then wouldn't you also think Axis locks, Compression locks, and Sharklocks were effectively the same?
 
drgrant said:
A lot of hyperventilating/dsp types believed that any assisted knife in mass was banned.
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This language:

or a device or case which enables a knife with a locking blade to be drawn at a locked position
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was what I read as making the Wave illegal. The Wave does allow a knife with a locking blade (e.g., Spyderco Delica) to be drawn at a locked position.
 
M1911 said:
I don't think anything with flipper or thumb stud was ever considered to be illegal under that law (though apparently some ADAs tried to make that argument from time to time). But knives with the Emerson Wave a different because the Wave allowed them to open on the draw. Under my reading, the Emerson Wave was illegal to carry under that law. Whether this decision changes that for knives like the Emerson Wave isn't clear to me.
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I guess I broke that law daily for 15 years
 
M1911 said:
This language:



was what I read as making the Wave illegal. The Wave does allow a knife with a locking blade (e.g., Spyderco Delica) to be drawn at a locked position.
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I'm guessing it means "the act of pulling the knife from a pocket can deploy it via a hook or something" Most people I know ignored it or didn't care regardless. 🤣 strictly speaking there's little difference between even a wave or anything else that could be rapidly deployed. Like i have a ZT Hinderer that has no spring in it at all that deploys just as rapidly as any of that stuff. It was all just gladys kravitz speak to try to ban knives they didn't like. 🤣
 
drgrant said:
I'm guessing it means "the act of pulling the knife from a pocket can deploy it via a hook or something" Most people I know ignored it or didn't care regardless. 🤣 strictly speaking there's little difference between even a wave or anything else that could be rapidly deployed. Like i have a ZT Hinderer that has no spring in it at all that deploys just as rapidly as any of that stuff. It was all just gladys kravitz speak to try to ban knives they didn't like. 🤣
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I used the Wave as designed on my Delica. 🤷‍♂️

But whether the Wave was faster than using a different kind of lock doesn't mean anything when it comes to legal or illegal. The question is simply whether it has "a device or case which enables a knife with a locking blade to be drawn at a locked position". A Delica Wave does have such a device. A button lock or Axis lock does not. The law doesn't say "knives which can be deployed faster than X" are illegal.

Now whether your typical Officer Barney Fife would recognize what the Wave hook does and try to jam someone up on it is a different question as well...
 
drgrant said:
A lot of hyperventilating/dsp types believed that any assisted knife in mass was banned.
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I know the folks at Amazon believed they were illegal, often while browsing knives on the site I would see “This item cannot be shipped to your location”.

Funny thing is that was a more a thing in the last few years, where assisted knife models that I had bought from them eight or ten years were now listed as prohibited shipping.

I usually purchased from other vendors anyway, but it always annoyed me that Amazon refused to ship something that was legal.

Have to send them a link to the ruling [laugh]

🐯
 
Picton said:
...this is actually pretty huge news.

Whether or not you like switchies, the SJC applying Heller is a very big deal.
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Exactly. That's huge. I assumed they would write a decision that twists Heller/Bruen into knots, pretending to apply it but actually ignoring it.
 
M1911 said:
Are you mixing manual button locks in with automatics? If you think manual button locks were illegal, then wouldn't you also think Axis locks, Compression locks, and Sharklocks were effectively the same?
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I meant an Auto with a button release...
 

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