What we really lost in Vietnam.

[Skysoldier]

I really get pissed off when I meet idiots that think "we lost" the Vietnam war!

But the more I think about it they are stupid...but they are right!

I have to admit that America did lose something in Vietnam.

America lost a generation of leaders in Vietnam.

We lost the best leaders of my generation.....and we lost quite a few heroes too.

I was never a leader, (or a hero for that matter).......sure, I served a couple of tours in Vietnam, but I was just a follower, not a leader.

But I knew leaders, and I even knew a few true heroes too!

Anybody here that also served in Vietnam will know what I mean.

The true leaders of my generation either died in Vietnam, or they died in spirit when they came home.

Now we have people like John Kerry and Jane Fonda who are worshipped as heroes of our generation.

I guess what I want to say is....

"Yeah America!..You did lose the war in Vietnam! You lost the sense of what Patriotism, Leadership and Courage is!. We didn't lose the war in Vietnam...you ****ers lost it!"

rant over.........

 

[scouter-rick]

I do love your rants Kim! Right on the money again!

 

[Boris]

... Now we have people like John Kerry and Jane Fonda who are worshipped as heroes of our generation. ...

I don't know who worships them, but those who do are none of my friends and when I talk to them, I speak slowly, use simple concepts and try to enunciate.

 

[June4th]

I have a shorter version: this nation collectively lost its balls.

 

[Skysoldier]

This all started because I stopped at my favorite bar today on the way home from work.

I met this nice young couple. He served in Iraq, and noticed the miniature CIB on my hat and commented about it.

She was clueless, and started asking questions.

I told her I served in Vietnam......and she looked at me and said...."That must be really hard, I mean... like you served in the only war we lost!"

I looked at her and asked..."What makes you think we lost the war in Vietnam?"

She had no answer.....so I asked her..."Why do you think we lost the war in Vietnam?"

She said......"Well, that's what I learned in school."

I just looked at her and said...."Your teachers are stupid, and so are you!"

Her boyfriend didn't know what to say....I just called his girlfriend stupid...and he just stood there...

I stormed out of the bar pissed off as hell....came home and had another beer trying to deal with that.......then I made this post.

I guess I can't blame her.........but I really want to kick someone's ass for making her that stupid!

I hope someday she will understand why what she said pissed me off so much.

 

[OB1Kenobi]

1 out of 10 on the meter.

Sent from my iPhone using Forum Runner

 

[In God We Trust]

We lost our entire country somewhere along the line. 58,000 guys in Vietnam, not sure how many in Korea, all the cold war crap and now our country is sliding into communism further every year. The same government that sent all those guys to their deaths is now fighting to become that which they so despised.

 

[Skysoldier]

1 out of 10 on the meter.

Sent from my iPhone using Forum Runner

???????

 

[Matt_SERE]

I guess I can't blame her.........but I really want to kick someone's ass for making her that stupid!

This about sums it up. I listen to much younger family members and can not believe some of the 'history' that is being taught. [sad2]

 

[mark056]

The US Armed Forces acquitted themselves very well in the field. The US won tactically. The NVA was consistently defeated in battle and the VC were supressed. It was the leaders in Washington that created a scenario where we could not win at the strategic level because they were always changing the objectives. Fueled by the media, the WWII generation really didn't understand Viet-Nam because it didn't involve millions of troops in set piece type battles, but no one who honorably served there should ever hold his (or her) head down. They did all they were asked to do and more.

 

[FSTC]

This all started because I stopped at my favorite bar today on the way home from work.


I stormed out of the bar pissed off as hell....came home and had another beer trying to deal with that.......then I made this post.

Kim,
You seem to have a lot of problems at this bar.

 

[ericcif]

Makes me want to break out my not Fonda Kerry bumper stickers I was rocking when he was running for president.

Sent from my BlackBerry 9810 using Tapatalk

 

[Gadsden]

This all started because I stopped at my favorite bar today on the way home from work.

I met this nice young couple. He served in Iraq, and noticed the miniature CIB on my hat and commented about it.

She was clueless, and started asking questions.

I told her I served in Vietnam......and she looked at me and said...."That must be really hard, I mean... like you served in the only war we lost!"

I looked at her and asked..."What makes you think we lost the war in Vietnam?"

She had no answer.....so I asked her..."Why do you think we lost the war in Vietnam?"

She said......"Well, that's what I learned in school."

I just looked at her and said...."Your teachers are stupid, and so are you!"

Her boyfriend didn't know what to say....I just called his girlfriend stupid...and he just stood there...

I stormed out of the bar pissed off as hell....came home and had another beer trying to deal with that.......then I made this post.

I guess I can't blame her.........but I really want to kick someone's ass for making her that stupid!

I hope someday she will understand why what she said pissed me off so much.

You can't blame her, man. I'm betting you could have gave her your perspective and at least made her think, maybe even come around to see your point.

 

[ColdDayInHell]

Sorry to hear that this upset you so much. Thank you for your service. Vietnam has always been very interesting to me and I HATE the liberals that say that we lost the war and we should have never been there, etc. Shut your f#%#^& mouth and be thankful and proud that they served our country. I hope your week gets better.

 

[joe1231913]

Skysoldier,

Thank you for your service. My dad was in the air cav in Vietnam. It is because of Vietnam vets and the way they were treated that soldiers now get the "welcome home" you guys should have received. I have never met a more proud, close knit group of guys than vets of that era. Hold your head high above the ignorance of comments like hers in that bar. Again, thanks for your service, and welcome home.

 

[FrugalFannie]

I really get pissed off when I meet idiots that think "we lost" the Vietnam war!

But the more I think about it they are stupid...but they are right!

I have to admit that America did lose something in Vietnam.

America lost a generation of leaders in Vietnam.

We lost the best leaders of my generation.....and we lost quite a few heroes too.

I was never a leader, (or a hero for that matter).......sure, I served a couple of tours in Vietnam, but I was just a follower, not a leader.

But I knew leaders, and I even knew a few true heroes too!

Anybody here that also served in Vietnam will know what I mean.

The true leaders of my generation either died in Vietnam, or they died in spirit when they came home.

Now we have people like John Kerry and Jane Fonda who are worshipped as heroes of our generation.

I guess what I want to say is....

"Yeah America!..You did lose the war in Vietnam! You lost the sense of what Patriotism, Leadership and Courage is!. We didn't lose the war in Vietnam...you ****ers lost it!"

rant over.........

We lost so many good men. We lost our national pride and our cohesion.

 

[bigtig50]

People's ignorance just shatters my mind. If someone was against the Viet Nam war they should have taken their gripes out on Washington, and NOT the poor soldiers who gave up life, limbs, and sanity trying to do what our leaders asked of them. Some of these people say they love our country but would not fight for it, so instead they rationalize their unwillingness and/or fear by chastising those who took that step. did I want to go fight in a war? No! Would I have gone if called? Yes! Do I support and appreciate those who did? Of course I do, with all my heart. Skysoldier is absolutely correct. We last more than can ever be put into any numbers or statistics.

 

[MrsWildweasel]

This about sums it up. I listen to much younger family members and can not believe some of the 'history' that is being taught. [sad2]

When my son was in high school he would correct his teacher all the time. His teacher told him he should be teaching the class. At parent teacher conference the teacher even told us this, that our son knew more about history than he did.

 

[MrsWildweasel]

The US Armed Forces acquitted themselves very well in the field. The US won tactically. The NVA was consistently defeated in battle and the VC were supressed. It was the leaders in Washington that created a scenario where we could not win at the strategic level because they were always changing the objectives. Fueled by the media, the WWII generation really didn't understand Viet-Nam because it didn't involve millions of troops in set piece type battles, but no one who honorably served there should ever hold his (or her) head down. They did all they were asked to do and more.

What Mark said. So very true.

 

[Dench]

 

[Scarecrow]

I don't know who worships them, but those who do are none of my friends and when I talk to them, I speak slowly, use simple concepts and try to enunciate.

This.

ETA:

The US Armed Forces acquitted themselves very well in the field. The US won tactically. The NVA was consistently defeated in battle and the VC were supressed. It was the leaders in Washington that created a scenario where we could not win at the strategic level because they were always changing the objectives. Fueled by the media, the WWII generation really didn't understand Viet-Nam because it didn't involve millions of troops in set piece type battles, but no one who honorably served there should ever hold his (or her) head down. They did all they were asked to do and more.

And this x10.

Support the soldier, regardless of your feelings on the administration or the war.

 

[dustoff22]

I guess it's one reason I don't wear anything that'd associate me with Vietnam. It isn't that I'm not proud as could be to have served in Vietnam, it's that so many don't know the real story and show their ignorance as was pointed out by Skysoldier.

If I were to point to any one point in time which sealed our fate, it would be the 1965 meeting of the Joint Chiefs with President Johnson. If you care to read about the meeting from a first hand attendee, here it is. Read it and weep.


http://extendedremarks.blogspot.com/2006/12/vietnam-1965-day-it-became-longest-war.html

 

[bigtig50]

I guess it's one reason I don't wear anything that'd associate me with Vietnam. It isn't that I'm not proud as could be to have served in Vietnam, it's that so many don't know the real story and show their ignorance as was pointed out by Skysoldier.

If I were to point to any one point in time which sealed our fate, it would be the 1965 meeting of the Joint Chiefs with President Johnson. If you care to read about the meeting from a first hand attendee, here it is. Read it and weep.


http://extendedremarks.blogspot.com/2006/12/vietnam-1965-day-it-became-longest-war.html

Wow! Enlightening read! LBJ wanted the war to continue to distract from the cover-up of his assassination of JFK. JMO ( don't take me too literally on this! )

 

[mark056]

Wow! Enlightening read! LBJ wanted the war to continue to distract from the cover-up of his assassination of JFK. JMO

Whatever the reason, he had a tremendous ego, and did not want to go down in history "as the first president to lose a war." That is why he did not seek re-election (he served less than two years of Kennedy's term, so he theoretically could have been president for a little more than nine years if he had run again).

Sometimes I wish people who harbor many strong feelings about that war, would read Robt. S. MacNamara's memoirs, the Pentagon Papers and the accounts of others like dustoff posted. It wasn't the hippies, it wasn't the media, it was the leadership of our own .gov that sealed the US fate. The hippies, the anti-war media were simply an effect, Lyndon Johnson and his henchmen were the real cause. In many ways MacNamara was a lot like Donald Rumsfeld.

 

[Skysoldier]

As expected from you.....

 

[Fixxah]

She blond?

 

[mikem317]

The US gov should have never put a single US solider in Vietnam. Then we wouldn't have lost any war.

 

[dustoff22]

Sometimes I wish people who harbor many strong feelings about that war, would read Robt. S. MacNamara's memoirs, the Pentagon Papers and the accounts of others like dustoff posted. It wasn't the hippies, it wasn't the media, it was the leadership of our own .gov that sealed the US fate. The hippies, the anti-war media were simply an effect, Lyndon Johnson and his henchmen were the real cause. In many ways MacNamara was a lot like Donald Rumsfeld.

McNamara's "In Retrospect" was one of if not THE most pitiful whiney point-the-finger books I've ever had the displeasure of reading. Seems that everyone one but himself was to blame. Truth be known, McNamara and his Ford "whiz kids" were without question the least qualified group ever occupying the most important liason position between CIC and the military. He had zero, nada clue what he was doing and 58K later lives and untold maimed and scarred for life veterans later, he attempts to pen his thoughts on what happened. Too many fuc$ing lame excuses and zero substance.

To compare Rumsfeld to McNamara is like comparing Howdy Doody to Hitler in my opinion. Rumsfeld was totally benign comparitively speaking.

 

[Gak44]

We lost our entire country somewhere along the line. 58,000 guys in Vietnam, not sure how many in Korea, all the cold war crap and now our country is sliding into communism further every year. The same government that sent all those guys to their deaths is now fighting to become that which they so despised.

This is so true, and heartbreaking at the same time.

 

[FPrice]

The list of people whom I wish to have/had gone to hell is short - but it has just increased by one.

Texans everywhere should be ashamed of that man.

I guess it's one reason I don't wear anything that'd associate me with Vietnam. It isn't that I'm not proud as could be to have served in Vietnam, it's that so many don't know the real story and show their ignorance as was pointed out by Skysoldier.

If I were to point to any one point in time which sealed our fate, it would be the 1965 meeting of the Joint Chiefs with President Johnson. If you care to read about the meeting from a first hand attendee, here it is. Read it and weep.


http://extendedremarks.blogspot.com/2006/12/vietnam-1965-day-it-became-longest-war.html