Ammo as an investment

[Lxpony]

Good idea to “buy cheap and stack deep”, but remember that you will need to pay income tax on any profit you make reselling it.

And track your sales of ammo

 

[45Badger]

My gun, ammunition and reloading habit has been completely self-funded since early 2000s. Bought cheap, stocked deep, sold into every panic on ammunition, components, plastic pistols and poodle shooters. Bought again when the panic was over and people had bills to pay. Gun owners are particularly fearful and reactive group. They get stupid in a hurry when there is a short term threat to their ability to have “enough” to last three lifetimes, one depression, two Armageddons and a Rapture.

Obama years were wonderful, Trump killed the market volatility and fear. My largest miss/regret was selling off tens of thousands (each) of 9mm, .223/5.56, .22LR and primers in the fall of 2019 in preparation for our move back east in early 2020. I made money on all of it but would have made a killing in 2020. I just broke into my overpriced ($20/1000) stash of LPPs

 

[Road_Clam]

After reading NES this week, your best bet is hanging out at the dump looking for discarded items. That is ALL profit.

Well said brother ! Stop chasing hookers 'n blow at the bars , cruise the local transfer station for golf clubs and chainsaws !

 

[Parker Schreiber]

Well said brother ! Stop chasing hookers 'n blow at the bars , cruise the local transfer station for golf clubs and chainsaws !

I recently rolled a lawnmower to the curb with a FREE sign on it. It hadn’t been started in 20+ years and wasn’t drained before storage. It was gone in less than 10 minutes. Someone is going to either have an interesting tear down and rebuild on their hands or will sell it for scrap.

Either way, it’s no longer in my garage and no longer my problem.

 

[Bt74]

This. In order to make life-changing money, the up front capital costs would be so extreme that it would take years to recovery to be back to zero, all the while you're digging a bigger hole as you accumulate more and manage it more. That said, I barter lots of ammo that I bought over the last ten years that has increased in value by maybe 50%, but even then, it's more out of convenience and cash flow management than huge profits. Another thing to keep in mind is that 9mm WWB at Walmart in 2008-ish was $20 and today New Republic at TSUSA is about $21 so if you went all in on 9mm, look at that potential return over ~15 years.

$21???????? How about -$13? Winchester White Box 9mm Luger Ammo - 500 Rounds of 115 Grain FMJ - Bulk Case - Q4172| SGAmmo.comSGAmmo.com

 

[Bt74]

The ammo I sold during covid bought me 3 veprs and a Chinese underfolder. Cases were bought at $163 a case from target and I was selling them for $500ish which was a "steal" to the buyer since 9mm was selling at almost $40 a box at the time. I had enough to wait it out. Now I'm stocking up again on 9mm at $3 more per box. Not great but well worth it for what I got.

I bought 11 crates of 5.45 7N6 from a guy a few years ago for $125 a crate, sold most of it for double, bought a Tantal to shoot the rest with some of the profit. A year later the ban hit, and cans (half crate) were selling for $450. It's all about timing.

 

[JuergenG]

Anyone else bulked up on hard to get ammo?

Yup, especially on 6.5x55 Swedish and GP11 surplus.
The Swedish were about 30 25 Cents, the GP11 about 40 Cents. Now, if some come up in private sales the 6.5 are running at 85+ Cents, the 7.5 at 1.20.
I'm not selling a single round, though.

 

[JuergenG]

Not sure what GP11 is, ....

edit: Wonky Swiss caliber.

That "wonky" caliber does everything the .308 can and was out there over 40 years before the .308 was invented.

 

[JuergenG]

Trying to get .32 ACP when there’s a drought is almost impossible.

I just got 125 .32 and 100 .25 ACP last week, both of ~50 y/o Geco manufacture. I didn't "need" them, but at 10 cpr I couldn't pass. A 50 rd box of Fiocchi .30 Mauser came with these for free.
Didn't "need" these as well as I rarely shoot my Broomhandles, but I took them anyway. Better have than need.

 

[Rockrivr1]

I just got 125 .32 and 100 .25 ACP last week, both of ~50 y/o Geco manufacture. I didn't "need" them, but at 10 cpr I couldn't pass. A 50 rd box of Fiocchi .30 Mauser came with these for free.
Didn't "need" these as well as I rarely shoot my Broomhandles, but I took them anyway. Better have than need.

I had to search pretty hard to find a supplier for 30 Mauser at a decent price. I shoot it sparingly in my Mauser C96.

 

[HARRYM]

Circa 1939/40

 

[JuergenG]

I had to search pretty hard to find a supplier for 30 Mauser at a decent price. I shoot it sparingly in my Mauser C96.

PPU would be your best bet, unless you run into old stock of Fiocchi.

 

[MickeyD’s]

I have a box of 17 WSM

No lowball I know what I have !

 

[fencer]

I guess I look at ammo a little differently. I am constantly thinking, "if I need to arm and supply the people I care about, in a true SHTF situation, what do I need on hand?"

That ammo is never touched, and essentially segregated for quick, easy load out. My loved ones know, if the SHTF, within 5 minutes, they will have 2k green tips, 3k 9mm, 500 -308 or 30-30, 500 12ga and the guns to shoot them, along with 3 months of food and 6 months worth of iodine tablets, loaded in their vehicles.
And I am already thinking about grandkids that I don't even have yet...
Each kid got a bug out bag with extensive first aid and survival gear when they moved out.
I hope they would want to come home and hunker down here, but you never know.

I don't give a frogs fat ass, what I paid for it, what it's worth now, or what the current availability is, because if ever really needed, my only concern is "will it be enough?"
Yes, my wife has asked me what the hell I need this stuff for, and I told her that I don't know, but if the day ever comes that we are grabbing it, she will know exactly why.

 

[weekendracer]

That "wonky" caliber does everything the .308 can and was out there over 40 years before the .308 was invented.

Except just walk into literally ANY gun store and buy a box. But yeah, it's not wonky.

Like finding 32 SnW for my FIL's revolver during Covid.

 

[rogersmithiii]

It's not great as a pure monetary investment but compared to the shitty guns and other things people usually buy it stores value incredibly well vs time.

According to catholic doctrine, selling guns or ammo will send you straight to hell. Just a warning.

You don’t want to upset God, do ya?

 

[MickeyD’s]

I guess I look at ammo a little differently. I am constantly thinking, "if I need to arm and supply the people I care about, in a true SHTF situation, what do I need on hand?"

That ammo is never touched, and essentially segregated for quick, easy load out. My loved ones know, if the SHTF, within 5 minutes, they will have 2k green tips, 3k 9mm, 500 -308 or 30-30, 500 12ga and the guns to shoot them, along with 3 months of food and 6 months worth of iodine tablets, loaded in their vehicles.
And I am already thinking about grandkids that I don't even have yet...
Each kid got a bug out bag with extensive first aid and survival gear when they moved out.
I hope they would want to come home and hunker down here, but you never know.

I don't give a frogs fat ass, what I paid for it, what it's worth now, or what the current availability is, because if ever really needed, my only concern is "will it be enough?"
Yes, my wife has asked me what the hell I need this stuff for, and I told her that I don't know, but if the day ever comes that we are grabbing it, she will know exactly why.

Stuff won’t last once you pass away

It’ll get dumped off by your wife and kids.

 

[JuergenG]

Except just walk into literally ANY gun store and buy a box.

Or use your once fired PPU brass and roll your own - with .308 components and load data.

Like finding 32 SnW for my FIL's revolver during Covid.

Different markets: .32 S&W long is cheap and plentiful over here as pretty much no one shoots them any longer.
Same with the "old style" Walther GSP's in .32 S&W/ .22 lr which were the no. 1 pistols the .32 was used with for several decades.
Lots of these come up cheap in private sales.

 

[fencer]

Stuff won’t last once you pass away

It’ll get dumped off by your wife and kids.

Who cares?
So will the house, 401k, IRA and portfolio.

I hope the ammo never gets used.

 

[weekendracer]

Or use your once fired PPU brass and roll your own - with .308 components and load data.

Different markets: .32 S&W long is cheap and plentiful over here as pretty much no one shoots them any longer.
Same with the "old style" Walther GSP's in .32 S&W/ .22 lr which were the no. 1 pistols the .32 was used with for several decades.
Lots of these come up cheap in private sales.

I found 2 boxes in my online searches. He only wanted one box, but I grabbed both after 2-3 days of hitting every major online retailer. It was a mom and pop or table top FFL somewhere in the Midwest. Maybe it's a round that's kept in box stores, but online, in the middle of Covid, it was unobtanium.

Lots of places had it 'listed', but when I clicked it into a checkout, it was backordered. I went to every online retailer I could get info on. Maybe there was a run on it by fudds like my FIL, but it was scarce.

 

[Happy feet]

If the OP sells the ammo and makes $5000 profit he should sell now take his profit invest in a CD hopefully at 4.5 or 5% and he will make more money than if he holds the ammo for 5 more years taking up locked storage space and the hassle of selling the ammo will be be in the past…. I’m not an investment advisor but pretend I am on nes

 

[mu2bdriver]

$21???????? How about -$13? Winchester White Box 9mm Luger Ammo - 500 Rounds of 115 Grain FMJ - Bulk Case - Q4172| SGAmmo.comSGAmmo.com

I was speaking in terms of 100rd boxes. I'm still salty on SG after what he did to CT shooters a few years ago and TSUSA greatly filled that void.

 

[Sterg]

When I shoot I go for whatever I have left of Blazer, Fiochi, and Sellier, and replace it with Speer. I think it’s superior, I could be wrong. Seems cleaner anyway.

 

[drgrant]

When I shoot I go for whatever I have left of Blazer, Fiochi, and Sellier, and replace it with Speer. I think it’s superior, I could be wrong. Seems cleaner anyway.

If you're talking about stuff like CCI Lawman, sure, if you're a low volume shooter, but frankly writing off stuff like Fiocchi, S&B, PMC or Aguila is
silly. it's all quality stuff.

 

[MetalliCorey]

Except just walk into literally ANY gun store and buy a box. But yeah, it's not wonky.

Like finding 32 SnW for my FIL's revolver during Covid.

I have a box of 32 s&w bought at the tail end of shmovid. My online experiences were about the same, but one day i strolled into an LGS thats more like bait and tackle shop and asked and the guy pulled out from under the counter a box that must be from 1985. Didnt pay an arm n a leg either

 

[weekendracer]

I have a box of 32 s&w bought at the tail end of shmovid. My online experiences were about the same, but one day i strolled into an LGS thats more like bait and tackle shop and asked and the guy pulled out from under the counter a box that must be from 1985. Didnt pay an arm n a leg either

It wasn't crazy expensive for me either, but smack mid Kung Flu? Nothing was 'open' to just walk in. New Orleans is walking a fine line of chaos on any given day, the 'Vid made things even more touchy. My FIL has an old 357 and that 32, it helped that he thought a single box was sufficient for a SHTF scenario.

My BIL and I built an AR and I contributed a case of 223 and a couple of mags. I'm sure I'll get the ammo back at the estate disbursement.

 

[Dennis in MA]

I've got 2 cases of GI '06 in en bloc clips I bought from teh CMP. . . . 20 years ago. I'm thinking that, plus my case of 308 match grade ammo, is my retirement plan. LOL

Oh, and I probably have 3 cases of x39. That'll buy me my boat or health care in retirement.

 

[TheRoland]

I didn’t read every post so if someone has done this, well, sorry. But “Ammo As An Investment” is a math question with an objective answer. MATH!

Let’s say it’s 2015. You buy, let’s say, $10,000 worth of M193 5.56, which you can pretty much sell whenever you want (everyone wants M193, always. ARs gotta eat.). In 2015, let’s pretend you scrounged and wheeled and dealed and put in a ton of effort, and found the best price you could. That’s about 31,000 rounds of 5.56, considering you likely have to buy in batches of 1000.

Now it’s today! How much is your 31,000 rounds worth? Well, it’s gonna take some effort to move that much inventory direct-to-consumer, and you’re going to take a wash wholesale… But let’s pretend it’s best case. Someone like Reptile shows up and posts an article suggesting Trump is going to ban all ammo, NES goes into a panic and you get full Cabela’s price on all 31,000 rounds. (Holy shit!) You sell the lot for around **$18,000.** You can’t get this price on NES today, but let’s pretend.

Over the same period, if you put $10,000 into the S&P500, today you’ve got $29,000 if you took out all the dividends. If you reinvested the dividends, you have $34,000 or so. And, you put in zero effort other than trying to remember your brokerage password.

Ammo is a shit investment.

 

[In God We Trust]

I don’t shoot a lot and don’t have a lot of ammo stored. The last time I bought an ammo can (1000 rds. LC green tip) I paid about $300 for it I think. This was around 2010?

Doesn’t really make sense for an investment unless you are getting pallets of it.

 

[Reptile]

Ammo really isn't an investment...

Unless you have investment grade Winchester Lake City XM193 5.56.

It'll take years for the price to move and it'll be hard to sell when the time comes.

Kind of like buying silver.

Price doesn't move anywhere up for a decade but it feels good to own it.

I wish I owned lots of ammo.

Imagine staring at stacks of brand new USGI ammo cans filled with your favorite ammo in fresh boxes inside.

That would make me feel wonderful even if the price wont go up for years.

There was that one guy who I know who made 10 trips to Walmart to take his ammo home. He bought out three stores when the ammo when on clearance and paid 10 cents on the dollar. 5.56 Winchester for 15 cents a round. Walmart sold all the good stuff on clearance and this guy bought it all. Probably still in his basement. That guy was smart but it was a once in a lifetime wind fall.