FFL Refuses Transfer Because Address on LTC not matching DL address

[dgrafton]

never bring the ATF into your life

Yeah, normally I would agree. But not this time.

I’m sick of all the bullshit in this state, not just regarding guns.
If people never stand up and cause pain and inconvenience for the people causing the bullshit, then nothing gets better!

Yes, it will probably be a pain for the OP and take a little longer for a final outcome, but maybe it will save the next person from dealing with the same crap.

The problem is NOBODY is willing to suffer a little pain to improve matters down the road, especially if it’s just going to others that benefit.

 

[Grendizer138]

Yeah, normally I would agree. But not this time.

I’m sick of all the bullshit in this state, not just regarding guns.
If people never stand up and cause pain and inconvenience for the people causing the bullshit, then nothing gets better!

Yes, it will probably be a pain for the OP and take a little longer for a final outcome, but maybe it will save the next person from dealing with the same crap.

The problem is NOBODY is willing to suffer a little pain to improve matters down the road, especially if it’s just going to others that benefit.

“Nobody?” I drive an hour and a half each way to support a couple of shops at the Mill that I think do God’s work. And I’m not the only one.

Once the dealer is outted then people need to vote with their $. No need to involve the Man.

 

[slap shot]

Thanks guys. I will out him as soon as my pistol is out of his possession.

And for those that are curious... it's a P365 (MA compliant, unfortunately).

I’m disappoint. He’s probably pissed because he’s got 3 in the case

 

[Toe Knee]

subscribing for the big reveal.

 

[dgrafton]

“Nobody?” I drive an hour and a half each way to support a couple of shops at the Mill that I think do God’s work. And I’m not the only one.

Once the dealer is outted then people need to vote with their $. No need to involve the Man.

The dealer isn’t going to have any clue that you’re not using his business if you don’t inform him of why.

Don’t kid yourself, you go to the mill because it benefits you, not because it benefits the gun community in this state. And that’s fine, that’s why those of us go to the mill. And I’m pushing two hours and go there often enough, or send others.

 

[wildwest]

Curious how much the OP *thought* he was going to save w/ shipping/ FFL transfer on such a common firearm.

 

[Grendizer138]

The dealer isn’t going to have any clue that you’re not using his business if you don’t inform him of why.

Don’t kid yourself, you go to the mill because it benefits you, not because it benefits the gun community in this state. And that’s fine, that’s why those of us go to the mill. And I’m pushing two hours and go there often enough, or send others.

Yes and no. I don’t price shop and I’ve developed a good relationship with two or three FFLs and I use them exclusively. If they don’t/won’t get what I want I go to the Mill. I don’t buy from online vendors because I think it’s important to keep good FFLs in the state.

Old timer gun shops like this one believe they are experts in the law and will never admit to being wrong.

And f*** being a rat.

 

[CMEBoston]

This is why you made my list of great ffls

Alright do tell what Shop so I can go there and buy something

 

[Marty McFly]

Alright do tell what Shop so I can go there and buy something

@cstockwell is fts guns in New Bedford. He's awesome

 

[CMEBoston]

@cstockwell is fts guns in New Bedford. He's awesome

Well then good thing a fisherman has always got an excuse to go to New Bagdad
Gonna have to swing by

Thanks!

 

[Mountain_Dad]

Alright ya'll...here's the update. I spoke to folks at the State Firearm Records Bureau, several other FFLs, and the local PD. All have verified that a valid DL is all I need for the FBI background check (form 4473). This guy is telling me :

"You will need to produce two forms of picture ID that match your current address. A list of acceptable secondary documentation is available on the ATF form 4473 Section C question 26.A and 26.B."

Now, I know he is incorrect in his interpretation of form 4473 Section C question 26.A and 26.B. It states clearly that a DL is all I need. But I also offered tax documents, car registration, and even a copy of my LTC validation certificate straight from the MERCS portal. All of those documents are valid forms of supplemental identification per the ATF. He still refused. In fact, he rudely told me on the phone that he his just going to ship it back to the original sender and then hung up.

WHAT A ROYAL PAIN IN THE ASS!!!!

And for those that want to know who he is... His name is Peter DiAngelis and his store is North Falmouth Hardware and Marine. Nothing but rude from the moment I walked through the front door.

One last thing... I will be making sure a gunsmith looks over the pistol thoroughly to make sure he didn't mess with it. If he did, I WILL sue him into oblivion.

 

[Mountain_Dad]

Curious how much the OP *thought* he was going to save w/ shipping/ FFL transfer on such a common firearm.

Brand new for $499...shipping was free. I thought that was a great price. I've purchased and sold many firearms through GunBroker, never had a problem until this guy. I do prefer doing business in person, but as far as I know there aren't any MA compliant P365's available near me right now. Also, since I'm planning for this to be my new carry pistol I wanted it to be MA compliant (aka on the roster).


I don't think this is a normal issue for buying guns online. This guy is just a lunatic.

Lesson learned. I should have just went with the FFL I trusted more. Thought this would be easier since he is so close to me (5 min down the road).

 

[Grendizer138]

Alright ya'll...here's the update. I spoke to folks at the State Firearm Records Bureau, several other FFLs, and the local PD. All have verified that a valid DL is all I need for the FBI background check (form 4473). This guy is telling me :

"You will need to produce two forms of picture ID that match your current address. A list of acceptable secondary documentation is available on the ATF form 4473 Section C question 26.A and 26.B."

Now, I know he is incorrect in his interpretation of form 4473 Section C question 26.A and 26.B. It states clearly that a DL is all I need. But I also offered tax documents, car registration, and even a copy of my LTC validation certificate straight from the MERCS portal. All of those documents are valid forms of supplemental identification per the ATF. He still refused. In fact, he rudely told me on the phone that he his just going to ship it back to the original sender and then hung up.

WHAT A ROYAL PAIN IN THE ASS!!!!

And for those that want to know who he is... His name is Peter DiAngelis and his store is North Falmouth Hardware and Marine. Nothing but rude from the moment I walked through the front door.

One last thing... I will be making sure a gunsmith looks over the pistol thoroughly to make sure he didn't mess with it. If he did, I WILL sue him into oblivion.

What made you chose this FFL?

 

[Mountain_Dad]

What made you chose this FFL?

Quick google search showed that he is only 5 minutes from me. So I thought " Well, isn't that convenient". I was very wrong.

 

[Joeldiaz]

And for those that want to know who he is... His name is Peter DiAngelis and his store is North Falmouth Hardware and Marine. Nothing but rude from the moment I walked through the front door.

Can you confirm if it’s the same guy?

I'll wait to see how this guy makes out. I'm not looking to out a shop and be right and cause an issue for this guy somehow.

 

[Grendizer138]

Quick google search showed that he is only 5 minutes from me. So I thought " Well, isn't that convenient". I was very wrong.

You need to talk to the Mayor of the Cape next time, @Marty McFly

 

[Joeldiaz]

I hope you leave a salacious review on all of his shop’s social media platforms (Google, yelp, Facebook, etc.)

 

[dgrafton]

@cstockwell is fts guns in New Bedford. He's awesome

The first time I met Charlie was epic!

 

[SJan]

Did you speak to the FFL ahead of time and arrange for the transfer before having it shipped there?

 

[Mountain_Dad]

Did you speak to the FFL ahead of time and arrange for the transfer before having it shipped there?

I did. He didn't mention any store policies. Just said "No problem, send it over".

 

[dgrafton]

Yes and no. I don’t price shop and I’ve developed a good relationship with two or three FFLs and I use them exclusively. If they don’t/won’t get what I want I go to the Mill. I don’t buy from online vendors because I think it’s important to keep good FFLs in the state.

Old timer gun shops like this one believe they are experts in the law and will never admit to being wrong.

And f*** being a rat.

I don’t consider it being a rat. I consider it using all your available resources to handle an a**h*** and making said a**h*** regret it.

 

[Mountain_Dad]

I hope you leave a salacious review on all of his shop’s social media platforms (Google, yelp, Facebook, etc.)

I don't normally do that sort of thing, but I'm thinking I'll make an exception for this guy. I am also thinking for filing some sort of formal complaint with the ATF. I'm not pro ATF, but they are the ones that deal with FFLs and this guy is clearly making up his own rules and refusing to accept what the ATF clearly says is acceptable. We'll see how much time I want to devote to this.

 

[Mountain_Dad]

I don’t consider it being a rat. I consider it using all your available resources to handle an a**h*** and making said a**h*** regret it.

I agree. This guy is essentially violating my rights by refusing to do the transfer and citing made up Federal rules. Now, if he said that it was just his store policy that the LTC card match the DL, then I would have said "OK, that is unfortunate, but I understand". Instead, he is telling me that it is a Federal requirement to produce two forms of picture ID with matching address, which is simply not true. We already know that.

MA gun laws are already a bureaucratic nightmare as it is. We don't need guys like this making it worse. Everything on my end is completely up to par. I've been nothing but polite to him, My LTC is valid, my DL is valid, I'm a home owner, no criminal record, I work my ass off for a living, I have a PhD in Biology, I've even taught multiple firearms safety courses, instructional courses, blah blah blah... this guy has no excuse for behaving the way he did.

I'm not ratting him out, I'm outing him for being a rude POS so that none of you have to deal with his shit like I did.

 

[johngalt2]

Brand new for $499...shipping was free. I thought that was a great price. I've purchased and sold many firearms through GunBroker, never had a problem until this guy. I do prefer doing business in person, but as far as I know there aren't any MA compliant P365's available near me right now. Also, since I'm planning for this to be my new carry pistol I wanted it to be MA compliant (aka on the roster).


I don't think this is a normal issue for buying guns online. This guy is just a lunatic.

Lesson learned. I should have just went with the FFL I trusted more. Thought this would be easier since he is so close to me (5 min down the road).

So then, you have done many transactions through GunBroker. Why did you pick this idiot FFL this time, instead of the ones that have worked well all these other times? Do you like to just try new FFLs to keep the spice in life alive?

 

[CMEBoston]

Alright ya'll...here's the update. I spoke to folks at the State Firearm Records Bureau, several other FFLs, and the local PD. All have verified that a valid DL is all I need for the FBI background check (form 4473). This guy is telling me :

"You will need to produce two forms of picture ID that match your current address. A list of acceptable secondary documentation is available on the ATF form 4473 Section C question 26.A and 26.B."

Now, I know he is incorrect in his interpretation of form 4473 Section C question 26.A and 26.B. It states clearly that a DL is all I need. But I also offered tax documents, car registration, and even a copy of my LTC validation certificate straight from the MERCS portal. All of those documents are valid forms of supplemental identification per the ATF. He still refused. In fact, he rudely told me on the phone that he his just going to ship it back to the original sender and then hung up.

WHAT A ROYAL PAIN IN THE ASS!!!!

And for those that want to know who he is... His name is Peter DiAngelis and his store is North Falmouth Hardware and Marine. Nothing but rude from the moment I walked through the front door.

One last thing... I will be making sure a gunsmith looks over the pistol thoroughly to make sure he didn't mess with it. If he did, I WILL sue him into oblivion.

I know the bridge makes life tough, I live right on the other side but..
I’ve been to GT Arms in wareham a few times, the owner has always been super nice every time I’ve gone in. I think he said his transfer fee is $30 FWIW

 

[fred6052000]

Thank you for your insight. I will out him once my pistol is returned.

Maybe you should provide us the store name or location to stay away from them.

 

[Jenska22]

Lesson learned. I should have just went with the FFL I trusted more. Thought this would be easier since he is so close to me (5 min down the road).

Legit reason to give it a try, but maybe not without sounding them out a bit; which wouldn't necessarily prove they were a*h*'s

 

[Grendizer138]

So then, you have done many transactions through GunBroker. Why did you pick this idiot FFL this time, instead of the ones that have worked well all these other times? Do you like to just try new FFLs to keep the spice in life alive?

OP passed on his usual FFL that he trusted, because this one either had a cheaper transfer fee or saved gas money.

Fortunately it sounds like a lesson was learned. Hopefully it gets squared away easily from here.

 

[fred6052000]

This sounds maybe stupid, but as you know I am new in MA and NES. What is Mill or where is Mill?

 

[Grendizer138]

This sounds maybe stupid, but as you know I am new in MA and NES. What is Mill or where is Mill?

I want to answer you but wish you didn’t have a bot name.