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"High-Power" Rifle Decision

mac1911

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What PappyM3 said, the AR10 can't be a copy or duplicate because it pre-dates the specifically named AR15. Now if an FFL would chime in that they are willing to sell it in MA, assuming it's feature compliant. Maybe someone should do a group buy? At least that way the legal costs can be spread out, I would hope Comm2a would get on board as well.
I happen to walk in on that conversation at LGS.
Legal status aside, the owner was telling the customer he is not going to sell any semi auto with detach mags that shares any trigger or bolt parts. He went on to say if and when the AG decides to bust LGS balls no matter what the law says it cost the shop money when the AG comes poking around.
 

frenchman

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There's no doubt in my mind that the best bang for your buck in the .308 department is, right now, the Savage 110 tactical with accutrigger and accustock/accufit (street price around $580), but you will have to figure the price of a scope and rings into that. It is Pmag compatible and comes with an oversized bolt knob and an EGW 20 MOA mount.
Also, Palmetto state has an AR 10 complete upper for around $450 or so, and I think their lowers for it is ~230 bucks, so you could get into the big bore gas gun game for around $700+optic. You'll need a place in a free state tho, I guess. IMO, I'd go the Savage route. I have a Strike eagle 3-18 that's ok, but Midway is getting rid of the Leupold mark IV for $750-1100, which is a really good deal.
 

FancyGunz

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A Ruger Precision Rifle in 308 is fantastic, and can shoot 1/2 MOA consistently at 200 yards with the right ammo.

"With the right ammo" will be extremely important if you are looking for maximum precision and the smallest group sizes. If you're just blasting away at steel, cheap bulk ammo will be fine. If you get hooked by the accuracy potential of the rifle and want to chase small groups, it will cost $$$ and time.
 

andrew1220

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I have a bad habit of purchasing ammo for guns I want before I have them. As such, I am currently in possession of some .308 and need something to shoot it out of. While I have an idea of what I want and some details, I'm still lost as to what might be a good entry into larger caliber rifles. I'm currently monetarily deficient, so an all-around or best bang for buck option is what I'm after. I am also willing to save for the right choice as well, given it makes the most sense. I'll give some options, background, and parameters, and if anyone has any feedback or opinions, I'd greatly apreciate it.

Currently do not own, nor have shot anything larger than 5.56. Range I belong to is limited to 200 yds. If bolt action, I would prefer a single stack, detatchable box magazine fed platform, 10 rds. optimal. Reviews point to some of the "universal" feed magazines being gritty and rough, though I have no first-hand experience. Method of use is for range fun, SHTF fantasy, possible future long range use, and to pop my "high-power" cherry. I do not hunt, and appearance matters as life is too short to own ugly firearms. Options I am considering are:

1. Ruger precision rifle or Tikka T3 tactical. Both have far more range than I need, but appeal to me nontheless. They both prescribe to the previously mentioned parameters of bolt action. An appropriate optic would increase the price signifgantly. Both relatively attractive options.

2. Century Arms C308. Not nearly as accurate, or pretty, but accurate enough at the ranges I'm considering. Much cheaper than other options. Pre-ban mags are easily found and cheap. No optic necessary, LPVO would work well. Would like this gun and feel like it's a true EOTWAWKI firearm, but may feel like I'm settling.

3. AR-10. Familiar with platform, just bigger. More accurate than C308..? Nicely straddles bolt action and C308 for effective range. DMR comes to mind. Optic options are vast, may want bipod. Most expensive option by far, especially in MA. Somewhat attractive gun, in my opinion. Harder to find. If these were priced similarly to AR-15's, I'd already have one.

4. Springfield M1A, probably SOCOM 16, or Scout Squad. By and above the most gorgeoues rifle of all the options listed. Relatively pricey. Pre-ban mags are... available? Again, my feeling(possibly wrongly so) is that this rides somewhere between the bolt action and C308 in terms of accuracy. Iron sights are legendary, apparently, and it comes with a pic rail for something else if I desire. Action is reliable but seems vulnerable in extreme conditions(SHTF fantasy BS) and I'm a lefty and don't know about the reciprocating parts hitting my hand. This is a bucket list gun but don't know that it's worth the wait, or is it?

Thanks in advance.
If I had to pick from that list I'd go with the RPR or Tikka.
 

PappyM3

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I happen to walk in on that conversation at LGS.
Legal status aside, the owner was telling the customer he is not going to sell any semi auto with detach mags that shares any trigger or bolt parts. He went on to say if and when the AG decides to bust LGS balls no matter what the law says it cost the shop money when the AG comes poking around.

Yup, which is why I don’t expect it would be likely to get an FFL to transfer one despite the fact that they are legal. It doesn’t make business sense. But for an individual with an 80% lower, it’s a different risk assessment.
 
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edmorseiii

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I have had a variety of semi auto 308's and I could care less about any of them except the 308 Saiga I converted (I do wish I would have kept that one). At this point in my realistic gun owning life a good bolt gun is the only 308 I need/want.

Having said that, I do still want a 308 Garand, but can surely live without.
 
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Yeah, it’s an amazing deal. But I don’t think the $650 field grades have a new criterion barrel. Those are the $1050 special grades I think. Still a good deal for either though.



Yup, that’s an important first step.

The CMP rack grade specials are $650 right now and come with a new criterion. Can’t beat it with a bat!
 

edmorseiii

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Where does everyone see Criterion barreled M1's for $650? CMP's site shows nothing of the sort.

ETA: 308 M1's for $650
 

citoriguy

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Hey OP - this may be a great purchase:

WTS - Ruger Precision Rifle 308 WIN ($750)

I have no connection to the buyer whatsoever, but I do peruse the classifieds at least once a day, and I just noticed this. If the scope is included, then $750, in my mind only, seems like a great deal. If I had the space in the safe or the funds for it, I'd consider this for my own collection.
 

mac1911

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Where does everyone see Criterion barreled M1's for $650? CMP's site shows nothing of the sort.

ETA: 308 M1's for $650
No 308 right now , check often as they are supposed to be coming

Right now its $650 for 30-06 new stock and new barrel
Product code
RM1SPECIALRACK

They where running a ammo deal along with a rifle purchase would be wise to see if thats still current also
 

widnerkj

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There's no doubt in my mind that the best bang for your buck in the .308 department is, right now, the Savage 110 tactical with accutrigger and accustock/accufit (street price around $580), but you will have to figure the price of a scope and rings into that. It is Pmag compatible and comes with an oversized bolt knob and an EGW 20 MOA mount.
Also, Palmetto state has an AR 10 complete upper for around $450 or so, and I think their lowers for it is ~230 bucks, so you could get into the big bore gas gun game for around $700+optic. You'll need a place in a free state tho, I guess. IMO, I'd go the Savage route. I have a Strike eagle 3-18 that's ok, but Midway is getting rid of the Leupold mark IV for $750-1100, which is a really good deal.

I'm going to have to agree with the Frenchman. Savage rifles get looked over pretty often. But they are great rifles for not much invested. The barrels are famous for being great shooters. And the accutrigger is really good out of the box. You mentioned that money is tight, so you could go the route of a savage axis. You'd get the accutrigger, good barrel, and a good shooting rifle in a floppy plastic stock for very little money. My 6.5 creedmoor started that way. I simply swapped out the cheap plastic stock for a boyds stock. And it's just right. If you are feeling the need, the stock can be sent to CDI and inletted for their bottom metal, so that it would accept AICS mags. I'm very satisfied with this setup. And I didn't go the CDI route, but I'm also less than $400 invested into this whole rifle package.

I am working on building an AR-10 right now as well. And even living in AZ, the parts are much more expensive than I'd like. I've also had a PTR-91. And though it's a really fun rifle, they didn't mention you will pour through .308 ammo pretty quickly. Also the fluted chamber will crinkle the brass pretty well. It "is" reloadable a few more times. (if you can find it.) The running joke in the german army was the G3 threw brass so far on design so that you can fight in two directions at the same time.
 
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I'm going to have to agree with the Frenchman. Savage rifles get looked over pretty often. But they are great rifles for not much invested. The barrels are famous for being great shooters. And the accutrigger is really good out of the box. You mentioned that money is tight, so you could go the route of a savage axis. You'd get the accutrigger, good barrel, and a good shooting rifle in a floppy plastic stock for very little money. My 6.5 creedmoor started that way. I simply swapped out the cheap plastic stock for a boyds stock. And it's just right. If you are feeling the need, the stock can be sent to CDI and inletted for their bottom metal, so that it would accept AICS mags. I'm very satisfied with this setup. And I didn't go the CDI route, but I'm also less than $400 invested into this whole rifle package.

Agree. I think the discount Remington 700 are perfect for this as well. Worked for me. Watch for the discounts this fall.
 

Ultimate Shield

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PTR-91 VS. C308

Much of a difference? From what I understand it's the same stamped receiver. Though I am still somewhat uninformed on the matter and probably couldn't tell the difference if you put them side by side. However, the HK variant would seem to carry a higher price tag due to import laws? But it's the same gun?

I'm not sure on the newer C308's but older Cetmes are a basket of scary and were to be avoided. I hear the new ones once they partnered with PTR have been pretty good, but the PTR-91 is the true US made Hk quality Hk-91/G3 clone without having to pay Hk prices. PTR-91's also come with a lifetime warranty on the internals last I knew so you'd be set to go for a hell of a long time were anything to go screwy. I just looked at their website though and IDK if they make my model anymore (PTR-91F, got mine when they were still in CT) without the top welded picatinny rail unless you get the GI model and I'm pretty sure you cant get a conventional G3 port buffer on with it there unless someones made one that attaches to the rail

This is a nice looking setup. Is that an aftermarket cheek pad/riser?

Sorta, it's a Hk G3 SG1 stock with the heavy buffer. You can sometimes find them online at Hk surplus stores. Makes the thing feel like shooting a AR, maybe even less on the recoil scale. I also swapped out the plastic lower for a metal Hk91 lower because I like the look and grip better. Break is a PWS FSC 91

I thought C308's and PTR-91's were banned?

AFAIK Roller-locks aren't effected by Maura's tyrannical "look at me its an election year" bullshit. But her since her bullshit doesn't have any real legal standing under the definition of law anyway... :rolleyes:
 

SKumar

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If you want to get into 308 just for the sake of it, go with a G3 clone. The receivers are stamped, but that's what brings the price down.

Socom16 is an option, but you'd probably want something in 18".

Ruger Precision is awesome. You're probably not going to fire 308 rapid fire anyway. So much bang for the buck.
 

widnerkj

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The only complaint I have about my $600 110 6.5 rifle is the magazine fit.

I agree. I had fit issues with the Boyds stock. But a little love in the magwell area with a die grinder on that laminated wood made it just right. In hindsight, I probably should have had the stock sent to CDI. $209 is pretty fair to be able to just use AICS mags.
Detachable Box Mag Systems - Bottom Metal - cdiprecisiongunworksstore.com

95EC62CB-D9A6-4B70-82DA-9CCE81285116.jpeg

My goal was a straightforward AZ hunting rifle. And this one is about perfect for my area and pursuits.

Same rifle is $329 at cabelas right now.
Savage® Arms AXIS Bolt-Action Rifles : Cabela's
 
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rebut

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If bolt action, I would prefer a single stack, detatchable box magazine fed platform, 10 rds. optimal

Maybe a Ruger Gunsite Scout rifle? Bolt Action, 10 round box magazine. Barrel is only 16" but you're on a 200 yard range so it should be fine.

I bought a Win Model 70 Featherweight 308 early in '14 to use for a hunt when I lived out west...never happened due to...something came up. Been thinking of turning it over and picking up the M77 Scout for range shooting...I like the long eye relief option and 10 round box mags.
 
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teamRR

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I saw comments about MA law here, maybe those guys know you but I never caught the part about you being in MA.

If you aren't in MA an AR10/LR/308 variant in a DPMS pattern is the easy thing you can upgrade over time if desired, I like Aero and have a few of their M5s..

Else pick your bolt gun, I don't know squat about those and can't comment...

But honestly if I was more of a controlled environment paper range shooter and not a pit shooter where I dump mags, smash up concrete at closer ranges etc etc then Id be looking at 6.5 creedmoor. It's more pricey but flies better.
 

92G

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this thread reveals how few people have experience with longer range shooting. purpose of the .308 is to provide 30 caliber "power" at decent ranges (realistically up to 800 yards) while still being portable.

to put in perspective,
168 gr SMK with MV of 2650 ft/s
at 500 yards, velocity 1770 ft/s with 1172 ft-lbs energy
at 800 yards, vel 1350 ft/s with 690 ft-lbs energy

in other words at 800 yards it's still got more juice than a 357 magnum at the muzzle

--
the target that is getting hit does not know what rifle the projectile came from...it only knows whether or not it got hit. therefore the goal here is to be able to connect with the target. forget about what type of rifle. those priorities are backwards.

#1 barrel - do your homework
#2 optic - do even more homework
#3 magazine system - preferably something easily procured like an AICS or DPMS pattern
#4 rifle - bolt action allows one to put the weight where it matters (barrel, optic) without building a 13 lb monstrosity. i love my autoloading .308's but opt for bolt guns most of the time for many reasons and being a fudd is not one of them. my Howa short action gets more range time than any other 308.

good luck
 
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edmorseiii

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this thread reveals how few people have experience with longer range shooting. purpose of the .308 is to provide 30 caliber "power" at decent ranges (realistically up to 800 yards) while still being portable.

Truth.

I have what I have, but if I were looking for a rifle to burn up some 308 ammo, it would be a pretty basic bolt gun to see if I liked it enough to want some kind of precision rifle. Most semi auto 308's are expensive toys for turning money into noise.

Also,
Maybe a Ruger Gunsite Scout rifle? Bolt Action, 10 round box magazine. Barrel is only 16" but you on a 200 yard range so it should be fine.
a 16" 308 will do a whole lot more then be fine at 200 yards.
 

H-minus

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50wt

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Maybe i missed it, but the OP is shooting out to 200yds and never mentioned long range precision.
 

edmorseiii

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Maybe i missed it, but the OP is shooting out to 200yds and never mentioned long range precision.

You did.

Method of use is for range fun, SHTF fantasy, possible future long range use, and to pop my "high-power" cherry. I do not hunt, and appearance matters as life is too short to own ugly firearms. Options I am considering are:

1. Ruger precision rifle or Tikka T3 tactical. Both have far more range than I need, but appeal to me nontheless. They both prescribe to the previously mentioned parameters of bolt action. An appropriate optic would increase the price signifgantly. Both relatively attractive options.
 

Tinkermatic

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Maybe i missed it, but the OP is shooting out to 200yds and never mentioned long range precision.

This is correct.
While I completely understand that a .308 and or any thing larger than a .22 is largely wasted at 100-200 yards on paper, there’s a reason I own a motorcycle and that sports cars exist. The purpose of said vehicles is not to drive at 180 mph all the time, but to have that power in reserve should you
“Need” it. They’re impractical and a hell of a lot of fun.
This is my same line of thinking in wanting a larger caliber rifle. Not because I need it, but because I want to explore options and have the ability to expand upon my experiences with firearms. My options seem largely entry level, RPR not withstanding, and others have made great suggestions like the Savage 110. At this point I’m leaning heavily towards bolt action, if only to slow the consumption of ammo and toy with different rounds/bullet weights. The ability to shoot accurately out to 800 yards is highly appealing and at some point I’d like to pop my 1000 yard cherry. As such, a rifle to grow into like a Tikka, Savage, or RPR, means I have a platform that I can add to(bipods, ridiculous glass) and not feel like a total dork punching holes in paper at 100 yards. Which is difficult, because I am by and large a total dork.

I appreciate all of the info, options, and opinions. Keep ‘em coming.
 

mac1911

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Maybe i missed it, but the OP is shooting out to 200yds and never mentioned long range precision.
Right, If you know tour only plinking out to 200 The best 22lr ammo is half the price of cheap 308 and a sako quad range would do well at 100-200 yards
 
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