AZ - Jose Guerena Shot 60 Times By SWAT Team

doctor_who_k9-787480.jpg

New K-9 for Bupnik
 
economist said:
I'm happy to see some portion of the mainstream media gets it.

It is hard to convey the seriousness of this without hyperbole. Abuse of government power (e.g., the patriot act) and a militarized police presence are the most important factors, right now, in undermining our liberty. Terrorism, foreign enemies, border control, fiscal solvency, and other concerns are secondary. A free society cannot withstand a police state, where men are slaughtered in their homes without rights, reason, or consequences. If we tolerate this, we are finished.
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Here it is. Thank you economist for spelling it out in short concise order. This cannot stand.
I have emailed Gov. Jan Brewer and told her that I have sent her monies in the past to help her fight for her laws and stand up to Obama. I told her that she really needs to do something about this or the bank is closed. I also told her I am way over on the east coast but the whole nation is watching this.
The government system in Arizona is unknown to me. If county government is a lot more powerful than here in Massachusetts, maybe she is at a stalemate. But, she should certainly control the budgets.
 
joeendris said:
...meaning, Dicknut, er..Dumbnut...er, Blumpkin, is going to take some time to make up a fantastic lie that will make his 'tards look good and allow a dead marine to be convicted, thereby denying any rights to the Mrs, or the kids. That way, they don't have to actually own up to a screw up. Brilliant!

Wait, didn't he already lie about Guerena shooting first? Hmmm.



I hope every house that got indirect fire sues Blumpkin and sends his ass packing.
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"I have to do what I think is right to protect the case to ensure that it has the opportunity to progress where we think it should go,
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Whaaat?
Did he just say he will do whatever he needs to do so that the case will go where they want it to go, rather than where the evidence dictates it go?

I guess I could be trying to read too much in to that statement, but the evidence so far seems to support it (i.e. "found body armor and part of a law enforcement uniform")
 
Judge Postpones Decision...

Pima County Superior Court Judge Deborah Bernini has postponed her decision on the warrant unsealing in the fatal SWAT shooting death case that left Jose Guerena, 26, dead.

Judge Bernini said during a hearing Tuesday afternoon that she needs to meet with Pima County Sheriff's Investigators to discuss why the records should remain sealed since information has already been released in the case.

>snip<

Judge Bernini hopes to have her final ruling made by the end of the week. She says there are options when it comes to making her final decision: keeping the warrants sealed, unsealing the records or unsealing the warrants with redaction.....
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http://www.kgun9.com/story/14764233/warrants-will-remained-sealed-in-the-guerena-case
 
This hasn't just gotten attention from the right. It's gotten attention from the left.

Here is an actual conversation I had with someone I know who (I think) is a registered Democrat and a self-proclaimed Liberal.

HER: This has gone on long enough. It's time people started targeting cops in retaliation for this crap.
Me: Um, what do you mean, targeting?
Her: I can hit a deer from 700 yards. I think I could hit a cop from that distance and no one would ever know who did it.
Me: You're joking right?
Her: No, I'm dead serious. I've been seriously thinking about it. This BS has got to stop. We have a police state cropping up here. It has to be stopped. Maybe when cops start understanding there's a cost, they will stop doing this sh*t.
Me: You can't be serious.
Her: I'm not there yet. I'm close, I've thought about it, but I'm not there yet. But I'm serious. If they can't be reigned in, then we need to make there be a price for them to pay.

If my LIBERAL DEMOCRAT acquaintance is thinking along these lines, we have a serious SHTF situation coming up. This crap has to stop or there WILL start to be consequences.
 
Bill Nance said:
This hasn't just gotten attention from the right. It's gotten attention from the left.

Here is an actual conversation I had with someone I know who (I think) is a registered Democrat and a self-proclaimed Liberal.
<SNIP>
If my LIBERAL DEMOCRAT acquaintance is thinking along these lines, we have a serious SHTF situation coming up. This crap has to stop or there WILL start to be consequences.
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it has been bubbling at close to a boil for some time I doubt we will have more than a year before something happens that makes the riots elsewhere in the world look tame
 
Bill Nance said:
This hasn't just gotten attention from the right. It's gotten attention from the left.

Here is an actual conversation I had with someone I know who (I think) is a registered Democrat and a self-proclaimed Liberal.

HER: This has gone on long enough. It's time people started targeting cops in retaliation for this crap.
Me: Um, what do you mean, targeting?
Her: I can hit a deer from 700 yards. I think I could hit a cop from that distance and no one would ever know who did it.
Me: You're joking right?
Her: No, I'm dead serious. I've been seriously thinking about it. This BS has got to stop. We have a police state cropping up here. It has to be stopped. Maybe when cops start understanding there's a cost, they will stop doing this sh*t.
Me: You can't be serious.
Her: I'm not there yet. I'm close, I've thought about it, but I'm not there yet. But I'm serious. If they can't be reigned in, then we need to make there be a price for them to pay.

If my LIBERAL DEMOCRAT acquaintance is thinking along these lines, we have a serious SHTF situation coming up. This crap has to stop or there WILL start to be consequences.
Click to expand...

When that sort of stuff actually starts happening is when I know the spirit of this country is not dead yet. Until then I still think we are going down the crapper. It's not like this type of stuff hasn't been happening for a while now - and yet nobody even really objects (except for a bunch of people like us on "fringe" web sites)

A good commentary from Karl Denninger :

(note to mods - he gives permission to post if you give full credit)


http://market-ticker.org/akcs-www?post=187197


You Won't Get The Correct Lesson From This

I guarantee it.

Bexar County Sheriff Amadeo Ortiz said the seemingly senseless and coldblooded slaying of a sergeant early Saturday on the East Side has sent a chilling statement to local law enforcement: No one is safe.

“The way it happened sends a message to the law enforcement community that we're not safe, even responding to calls and helping citizens,” Ortiz said Sunday. “Officers sometimes get hurt responding to domestic violence calls or shootings, but not while they're stopped at a red light.”​


Welcome to reality pal.

A number of years ago - before The Drug War - you would have had a posse of citizens willing to find this bastard and deliver him to the local jail (perhaps in pieces, but...)

Today? Not so much.

Why?

Well, how about this sort of incident?






Would you go help the local police track down and prosecute the guy who shot one of those cops?

Isolated incident eh? Can someone explain why the police officers involved are not in prison? They're not, you know, and the judgment (yes, there was a civil one) was paid by the very people abused, as it went against the jurisdiction's insurance. The officers involved did not pay a nickel, nor did they face criminal charges or do a single hour in jail themselves for this..

You know how it used to work, right?






That was a lesson broadcast on national television in which Sheriff Andy teaches Opie about The Fourth Amendment - something now used as literal toilet paper any time someone says the word "drugs" or "terrorist" (and boy, isn't that convenient.)

There are good cops - plenty of them. But there are lots of bad cops too, from those who are literally corrupt and "stop motorists for dollars" (aka the I-40 bandits in blue in Tennessee) to those who are so jacked on testosterone and military hardware that they will take any opportunity at all to kick down your door and deliver dozens of rounds through it - even if they shoot an innocent kid - Aiyana Jones in Detroit - sleeping on the couch.

Police work used to mean working with the community and figuring out how to apprehend the alleged perpetrator you were looking for without getting anyone killed. Now the "don't get anyone killed" part has been re-written to read "Let's use our body armor and lots of force right now because it's cool and the bad guys won't be able to kill us."

You can see the problem with that approach; the cops still have to go to the store and drive around, and can't always clear the entire place of everyone else (and their dogs, shooting them of course) first. Eventually, after enough of this sort of thing, the bad guys decide to get preemptive, and maybe the guy who saw something got an unjustified $200 ticket yesterday.

Will he come forward and help bust this murderous jackass? Maybe not.

The fundamental reality is that society exists in a peaceful state mostly because the people are good. A society comprised of mostly psychopaths doesn't survive long as everyone kills each other off; you then have nothing. The police primarily exist to investigate and prosecute after the fact.

Fifty years ago you could buy guns through the mail. One hundred years ago you could buy machine guns through the mail. Were we a "more violent" society? No, except when we tried to criminalize consensual consumption of alcohol. Then we provided lots of firepower for criminal gangs, which was then turned into justification for jackbooted police tactics.

Who created the violence? The government, with Prohibition.

You'd think we'd learn, but we did not. We instead repeated our idiocy in the 1970s and 80s with the "drug war", which has now turned into a profit center for banks (laundering money and being fined when caught rather than prosecuted) and murderous gangs of thugs in the US and Mexico, along with the rest of the world. Oh, and it appears our own government is actually arming those thugs in Mexico via "walking" guns. Isn't that special?

The statist response to the very violence the state creates is predictable - kick down more doors and abuse more citizens.

Now some thug who decided he'd get preemptive blasted a cop at a red light. Whoever did it deserves the noose, which we of course call "barbaric" and thus won't give to him.

“There was no equipment in the world that would have saved Kenny from what this person did,” said Kilcrease, who grew close to Vann when they were neighbors and rode horses together. “This is dangerous for us all.”​


Then stop being *******s - nationally. Recognize that citizens have a right to self-defense - everywhere and anywhere. That you must honor the 4th Amendment - everywhere and anywhere. That "Serve and Protect" doesn't mean Service (as in "from behind") where revenue generation (otherwise known as stealing money from the citizens) becomes your primary interaction with the local citizen. Stop with the bull**** no-knock and violent raid-style "warrant execution" which all too often turns into just simple execution of people who have not been tried and convicted of anything, and often are entirely innocent - such as Aiyana Jones, who is now dead.

There's only one justification for such a raid: When the alleged perpetrator has hostages and is threatening to kill them.

Got a holed-up drug suspect who you think might flush the drugs? Shut off the water to the house. Is it hot (or really cold)? Shut off the power. Got a guy who you really want to arrest? That's cool - wait for him to go to the store, then arrest him. Does he have a bunch of other people living there but no hostage situation? Prevent them from going out and returning - now he has no supplies, and eventually, with no water and no power, he'll come out. Stop the bull**** raids that are simply used as a pretext to civilly forfeit the entire residence and contents; if you actually want to arrest someone instead of steal property then arrest him!

In short, respect The Constitution and treat the citizens as your neighbors rather than treating everyone as "targets" and "perps" - because most of us aren't perps. When your own "boys in blue" refuse to respect The Constitution? Bring charges against them as the common street thugs that they are.

The coming years are unlikely to get better in terms of societal pressures. We have serious economic problems and stresses which are going to produce more and more people that decide they'd rather do things "their way" than "the legal way." By giving passes to certain people, including banksters who rip off the public while handing common law-abiding citizens $200 tickets like toilet paper the police forces have done a hell of a job of destroying the very trust among the citizens they need in order to be effective.

If the various law enforcement agencies want our help and respect they're going to have to earn it.

So far they're not.
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Last edited by a moderator:
Bill Nance said:
.............................

Here is an actual conversation I had with someone I know who (I think) is a registered Democrat and a self-proclaimed Liberal.

HER: This has gone on long enough. It's time people started targeting cops in retaliation for this crap.
Me: Um, what do you mean, targeting?
Her: I can hit a deer from 700 yards. I think I could hit a cop from that distance and no one would ever know who did it.
Me: You're joking right?
Her: No, I'm dead serious. I've been seriously thinking about it. This BS has got to stop. We have a police state cropping up here. It has to be stopped. Maybe when cops start understanding there's a cost, they will stop doing this sh*t.
Me: You can't be serious.
Her: I'm not there yet. I'm close, I've thought about it, but I'm not there yet. But I'm serious. If they can't be reigned in, then we need to make there be a price for them to pay.......................
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She sounds nice.
 
Bill Nance said:
This hasn't just gotten attention from the right. It's gotten attention from the left.

Here is an actual conversation I had with someone I know who (I think) is a registered Democrat and a self-proclaimed Liberal.

HER: This has gone on long enough. It's time people started targeting cops in retaliation for this crap.
Me: Um, what do you mean, targeting?
Her: I can hit a deer from 700 yards. I think I could hit a cop from that distance and no one would ever know who did it.
Me: You're joking right?
Her: No, I'm dead serious. I've been seriously thinking about it. This BS has got to stop. We have a police state cropping up here. It has to be stopped. Maybe when cops start understanding there's a cost, they will stop doing this sh*t.
Me: You can't be serious.
Her: I'm not there yet. I'm close, I've thought about it, but I'm not there yet. But I'm serious. If they can't be reigned in, then we need to make there be a price for them to pay.

If my LIBERAL DEMOCRAT acquaintance is thinking along these lines, we have a serious SHTF situation coming up. This crap has to stop or there WILL start to be consequences.
Click to expand...



She has company.

Even the auto writers are getting pissed off.


http://www.lewrockwell.com/peters-e/peters-e54.1.html


Miriam Leverington, a nurse in Colorado, was stopped by Officer Duaine Peters (author’s note – absolutely no relation) who had been running a radar trap to catch “speeders.” Like so many victims of these snatch and grab operations, Leverington was not happy about being stopped for no good reason – and dared to tell the cop exactly that. As she was handed her piece of payin’ paper, she said that she hoped she never had to have him as a patient.

This affront to the Person of the cop was not acceptable. The prickly “public servant,” his dignity wounded, took the special effort to find out where Leverington worked, then called the hospital and got her fired – claiming Leverington “threatened” him.

Is it not amazing how easily some of these burly “heroes” feel threatened by helpless, non-violent citizens, often females half their size and older people three times their age? And more, how disproportionate their response? (See in this vein the recent and largely ignored by the media body-slamming and choke-holding of people visiting the Jefferson Memorial in DC who dared to dance).


Anyhow. The slighted cop got Leverington fired from her job, costing her thousands in lost pay in addition to the hundred dollar-plus ticket. She decided to go to court to see whether her free speech rights counted for squat anymore.

Of course, they don’t.

The court ruled that only statements expressing (wait for it) “public concern” fall under the tattered remnants of the First Amendment’s protections. And of course, “public concern” does not include criticism of things the public might actually be concerned about, such as being fleeced by useless eaters in costumes running radar traps. In other words, mouth off to a cop and it’s open season – on you – and the courts will rubber stamp their approval of pretty much whatever the cop does.

Meanwhile it’s ok – protected free speech – to screech that “God Hates Fags” at private funerals. Because no affront to the Person of a government flunkie is at issue.
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Bill Nance said:
Her: I can hit a deer from 700 yards. I think I could hit a cop from that distance and no one would ever know who did it.
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She's good... I couldn't even SEE a deer at 700 yards. Certainly not without a scope.

Ambush-style police deaths are still so rare that experts don't know what's causing them, said Smith, who refers to the trend of people going into the community and “hunting police officers” as the country's “war on cops.”
Read more: http://www.mysanantonio.com/news/lo...ng-sparks-new-worry-1400829.php#ixzz1O1pHzciV
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I could give them a good place to start looking for what's causing them... like googling "cops raid wrong address" and "cop shoot dog". [rolleyes]

“These kinds of deaths shock us to our roots,” he said Sunday. “Every officer in Texas and the U.S. knows there's a guy who could pull up next to them and kill them. How do you stop that sudden assault?”

Read more: http://www.mysanantonio.com/news/lo...ng-sparks-new-worry-1400829.php#ixzz1O1pHzciV
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Stop using no-knock warrants, stop bashing in the wrong doors, and stop shooting innocent citizens and dogs? I mean, it's just a wild guess here. [thinking]
 
Wow...just....wow.

Note to self...don't serve my country, come home and then try to defend my home from anyone.

Memo received...thanks government.
 
joeendris said:
http://www.gazette.com/opinion/view-104991-government-amendment.html

There's an actual vote as to whether Miriam should've been able to back-talk to the pi...er, cop. Wuss couldn't handle his dignity bruised, so he hunted down where she worked and had her fired. I guess I shouldn't be suprised...it was his dignity, after all.
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I'm not sure it had anything to do with his dignity or the fact that she used her position as a nurse to make an obscure threat against the cop. I have a feeling most employers would fire or at least repremand you if you used your position at their business to threaten someone and then gloated about it.
 
Pete85 said:
I'm not sure it had anything to do with his dignity or the fact that she used her position as a nurse to make an obscure threat against the cop. I have a feeling most employers would fire or at least repremand you if you used your position at their business to threaten someone and then gloated about it.
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Unless, of course, that 'business' happens to be the police dept.
 
dwarven1 said:
Interesting - and long - writeup on SWAT team tactics and an analysis of this particular Mongolian clusterf*ck here: http://confederateyankee.mu.nu/archives/316833.php
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A bit long, but definitely a good read.

Police officers may use deadly force when there is an imminent threat of serious bodily injury or death to them selves or another. It cannot be a possible threat that might manifest itself within the next few minutes. It must be obvious, real and about to happen at the instant that deadly force was used. If these conditions exist, an officer may use whatever force is necessary to stop the bad guy from doing whatever gave the officer justification to use deadly force in the first place. If the bad guy dies as a result of the application of that force, bad for him, but the police always shoot to stop, never to kill. If they shoot effectively—and SWAT teams are supposed to always shoot effectively and with the minimum expenditure of ammunition—the bad guy will usually be killed, but he will surely be stopped.
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I think Prima County and Blumpkin missed something in training...
 
calsdad said:
When that sort of stuff actually starts happening is when I know the spirit of this country is not dead yet. Until then I still think we are going down the crapper. It's not like this type of stuff hasn't been happening for a while now - and yet nobody even really objects (except for a bunch of people like us on "fringe" web sites)
Click to expand...

What if somebody found a way to show you and everyone else that we may not be as fringe as you think?
 
Pete85 said:
I'm not sure it had anything to do with his dignity or the fact that she used her position as a nurse to make an obscure threat against the cop.
Click to expand...

Please tell me exactly what threat was made? She said, according to the newspaper article, "I hope you are not ever my patient." She could have very easily been saying just that - that she didn't want to ever have to take care of him.

The cop, in this case, is a jerk and should lose HIS job.
 

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