MA Gun Grab 2024: H.4885 - Passed legislature, headed to the governor

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M1911 said:
Am I the only one amazed that this bill hasn't already passed?
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You might be. It’s guaranteed to pass. It’s not that it hasn’t passed yet because it doesn’t have the votes. The fact that it hasn’t passed yet isn’t good news. There’s something mischievous at play behind the scenes. We aren’t quite sure what it is yet. But it can only spell out something even worse. Because it absolutely would pass immediately whenever they wanted to bring it to a vote.
 
not new guy said:
Even if it’s shelved it will be revived as soon as the next big shooting happens.
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As Rahm Emanuel used to say, "never let a crisis go to waste."

My concern is that not only are they going to push gun control, but they are going to go after our liberty, freedoms, rights and privacy until they control everyone and everything.
 
Freddy B said:
I asked my state senator about this. He told me it has slid down on the priority list. Immigration and energy issues are more important to them, thankfully.

We are also benefiting from the fact that Spilka and Mariano dislike each other. Anything requiring negotiation between the branches gets drawn out as a consequence.
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The one thing nobody has talked about is how much money do they want to put up for this garbage? If it's some not small pot of money things are going to "get complicated" for the
people pushing the BS, because it puts them directly at a logjam with the people who want that money to go to some other welfare bullshit. Pandering with round schools, handouts, and other stuff goes further politically than gun control does, which is basically a loser of an issue.
 
drgrant said:
The one thing nobody has talked about is how much money do they want to put up for this garbage?
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I've posted about this a few times: nothing whatsoever was appropriated for this, and there's no talk of anything getting appropriated for it. That's what tells me that whatever passes, it won't be meaningfully enforced.

If they don't fund it, they don't care about it. And if they don't care about it... why should we?
 
Picton said:
I've posted about this a few times: nothing whatsoever was appropriated for this, and there's no talk of anything getting appropriated for it. That's what tells me that whatever passes, it won't be meaningfully enforced.

If they don't fund it, they don't care about it. And if they don't care about it... why should we?
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I work for local government as do you, state and federal government pass laws/mandates all the time that they do not provide funding for but expect local government, business, industry, etc. to implement. The state/police may not be running around trying to find gun owners breaking the law but when someone does get caught up for whatever reason, I expect there will be full prosecution. And, more importantly, I have a feeling the end result will have a tremendous impact on gun shop owners, which is one of their primary targets and helps them achieve their goal of reducing the sales/availability of guns in MA over the long term. Does all this cause me concern personally, no, I don't give a shit at this point, but I do feel bad for gun shop owners and younger gun owners, and it is another nail in the coffin of peoples' rights in MA in general.
 
Woodsloafer said:
The state/police may not be running around trying to find gun owners breaking the law but when someone does get caught up for whatever reason, I expect there will be full prosecution. And, more importantly, I have a feeling the end result will have a tremendous impact on gun shop owners, which is one of their primary targets and helps them achieve their goal of reducing the sales/availability of guns in MA over the long term.
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Exactly this.

We have all read the stories, or experienced them, A gun owner is getting a divorce and the lawyer uses the lawfare tactics of a restraining order and presto….the gun owner has bigger felony problems because he has standard capacity magazines that were made on the wrong day, or an upper with the wrong features on a post ban lower. A gun owner has a medical emergency while cleaning his guns, or getting ready for a range trip, and gets their license revoked and charged with improper storage.

Then there’s the whole “mista-felony” deliberately being abused to strip residents of their 2A rights for the rest of their lives.

They are picking us off one by one and it will only get worse.
 
drgrant said:
The one thing nobody has talked about is how much money do they want to put up for this garbage? If it's some not small pot of money things are going to "get complicated" for the
people pushing the BS, because it puts them directly at a logjam with the people who want that money to go to some other welfare bullshit. Pandering with round schools, handouts, and other stuff goes further politically than gun control does, which is basically a loser of an issue.
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This is going to cost a lot with all of the data collection, dealer training/inspection/oversight, commissions and enforcement.

I don't remember any published numbers but we're definitely talking several hires of cousins or no bid contracts lost to gun hate.
 
Woodsloafer said:
I work for local government as do you, state and federal government pass laws/mandates all the time that they do not provide funding for but expect local government, business, industry, etc. to implement. The state/police may not be running around trying to find gun owners breaking the law but when someone does get caught up for whatever reason, I expect there will be full prosecution. And, more importantly, I have a feeling the end result will have a tremendous impact on gun shop owners, which is one of their primary targets and helps them achieve their goal of reducing the sales/availability of guns in MA over the long term. Does all this cause me concern personally, no, I don't give a shit at this point, but I do feel bad for gun shop owners and younger gun owners, and it is another nail in the coffin of peoples' rights in MA in general.
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Agree - they don't fund it directly but if someone with any funds gets caught up in their evil web they will extract every dime possible from that person to help pay for the programs.
 
drgrant said:
The one thing nobody has talked about is how much money do they want to put up for this garbage? If it's some not small pot of money things are going to "get complicated" for the
people pushing the BS, because it puts them directly at a logjam with the people who want that money to go to some other welfare bullshit. Pandering with round schools, handouts, and other stuff goes further politically than gun control does, which is basically a loser of an issue.
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We should all write heartfelt letters to our representatives in favor of expensive social programs. Point out it’s more important to have good schools and healthcare or whatever than expensive gun control that wouldn’t have any effect on the people actually committing crimes.
 
pastera said:
This is going to cost a lot with all of the data collection, dealer training/inspection/oversight, commissions and enforcement.

I don't remember any published numbers but we're definitely talking several hires of cousins or no bid contracts lost to gun hate.
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I, personally, believe the state, and other states, are on the cusp of borrowing/spending money like the federal government. MA is supposed to have a balanced budget, and not exceed actual revenues, but at some point they will just say fruck it, let's borrow to get all these great programs, etc. funded and, like you said, hire all their buddies/family to run it all.
 
HorizontalHunter said:
Exactly this.

We have all read the stories, or experienced them, A gun owner is getting a divorce and the lawyer uses the lawfare tactics of a restraining order and presto….the gun owner has bigger felony problems because he has standard capacity magazines that were made on the wrong day, or an upper with the wrong features on a post ban lower. A gun owner has a medical emergency while cleaning his guns, or getting ready for a range trip, and gets their license revoked and charged with improper storage.

Then there’s the whole “mista-felony” deliberately being abused to strip residents of their 2A rights for the rest of their lives.

They are picking us off one by one and it will only get worse.
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Yes they are doing exactly that.

We the people need to utilize the same strategies to remove them from public office and disqualify them for life. Being a tyrant is a lot worse than some legislated mista-felony. There has to be a way to use the law against them, all of them. The Constitution is the law.
 
Woodsloafer said:
I, personally, believe the state, and other states, are on the cusp of borrowing/spending money like the federal government. MA is supposed to have a balanced budget, and not exceed actual revenues, but at some point they will just say fruck it, let's borrow to get all these great programs, etc. funded and, like you said, hire all their buddies/family to run it all.
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The difference is that states don't have a legal ability to counterfeit money...
The federal government can extract taxes from our savings and value from our possessions simply by printing new monies.
States must obtain actual credit or impose new taxes to raise funds.

However, Mass is not shy at all about raising taxes and fees so it doesn't really slow them down
 
Woodsloafer said:
Doesn't surprise me a bit, I have been saying right along it will be passed near the end of this session and we won't hear much if anything before then.
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Agree, that is when most of the work gets done, right at the end of the session, in the middle of the night. Spilka and Mariano will be horse trading in the wee hours to get this pushed through.
 
pastera said:
The difference is that states don't have a legal ability to counterfeit money...
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Yet, which is what I said, but wait until the next downturn when they don't have the money to pay state employees, house/feed homeless, run the MBTA, etc. The time is coming when they will change the rules.
 
Woodsloafer said:
Yet, which is what I said, but wait until the next downturn when they don't have the money to pay state employees, house/feed homeless, run the MBTA, etc. The time is coming when they will change the rules.
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...how?

I mean, I get that this is the internet and we can just spew shit out without backing it up, but the Constitution explicitly bans states from minting their own money, reserving that power to Congress exclusively. So... if "they will change the rules," that'll take a constitutional amendment. THEN there'd need to be a series of laws that would all have one effect: destabilizing the dollar.

If there's one thing TPTB care about, it's a stable dollar.
 
bigred460 said:
Agree, that is when most of the work gets done, right at the end of the session, in the middle of the night. Spilka and Mariano will be horse trading in the wee hours to get this pushed through.
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They will appropriate some token small amount just to get this thing off the ground so to speak. They know that it won't be enough. After it rolls out they'll say that there isn't enough $$$ to do everything needed to keep you all safe. They'll create a special tax for gun purchases, dealer license fee hikes etc. Most of the sheep in MA will go right along because, you know, the children and "public" safety and all. If this forces gun sales out of MA then one of their big goals will be met.

Edit: I forgot that the special tax on guns sales will likely be siphoned off to some extent to keep the general fund on life support.
 
drgrant said:
The one thing nobody has talked about is how much money do they want to put up for this garbage? If it's some not small pot of money things are going to "get complicated" for the
people pushing the BS, because it puts them directly at a logjam with the people who want that money to go to some other welfare bullshit. Pandering with round schools, handouts, and other stuff goes further politically than gun control does, which is basically a loser of an issue.
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This. State spending hundreds of millions on housing the illegals. Anything leftover??
 
Picton said:
...how?

I mean, I get that this is the internet and we can just spew shit out without backing it up, but the Constitution explicitly bans states from minting their own money, reserving that power to Congress exclusively. So... if "they will change the rules," that'll take a constitutional amendment. THEN there'd need to be a series of laws that would all have one effect: destabilizing the dollar.

If there's one thing TPTB care about, it's a stable dollar.
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They've already bypassed the constitution by having the federal government borrow money for them (look at all the billions just in borrowed COVID money that the state and other states received). You really don't think MA is running on only it's money even now, a lot comes from the Federal government and much of that is borrowed/printed. And that is the same for all states, some more so than others, their budgets are being supplemented by federal monies in some way, shape, or form, and the feds are borrowing it.
 
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voidoid said:
What, you never heard of BerkShares? Western MA has all your counterfeiting and laundering needs covered.

View attachment 882644
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BerkShares | Currency of the Berkshires Region

berkshares.org berkshares.org
Our local currency for the Berkshire Region, BerkShares are used at participating businesses in the area, like cash, to keep money in local circulation. Fully backed by US Dollars on reserve with our community banks, BerkShares paper notes are exchangeable for US Dollars at nine branch offices of three area banks, and are accepted at over 350 locally-owned participating businesses. BerkShares are free to acquire, accept, and spend, and can be redeemed to U.S. Dollars for a 1.5% exchange fee.
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So they are essentially local purchase tokens that cost a business 1.5% to convert back to currency.

When using them you are purchasing an item that participating businesses have agreed to exchange at a predetermined rate for other goods - they are not currency.

The question is if you would be charged for printing your own
 
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