The Price Gouging/Everything Shortage Megathread

[GIXXERCON]

Anything is possible, there's no logic in the market at this point. If thats what they sold for, thats the market.. if thats list... the market will decide if thats high or low... if thats a high list, it wont sell.

Long story short: Don't check logic at the door of any deal. When government moves markets, very few people win.

The price I listed was what the bundle sold for on the 20th (if the winning bidder paid or not is another story)... Your initial response only made me wonder if there was a higher price paid (or listed) since.

 

[Hiltonizer]

The price I listed was what the bundle sold for on the 20th (if the winning bidder paid or not is another story)... Your initial response only made me wonder if there was a higher price paid (or listed) since.

Not sure I understand your post then... if you're providing data great... if you are looking for an appraisal good luck. The market is so backasswards right now that anyone quoting anything is going to look like a dolt in 18 hours.

 

[Queen Bee]

There are a few more variables to think about. With every gun shop being sold out of the Ar/AK platform. And most distributors out as well, some manufacturing companies already sold their allocation of guns being made for 2013. If you can't buy a new rifle from a store for a year are you willing to wait for it? Or are you going to hit the secondary market for a maybe new , more likely used one? Cost over time comes into play. Your hoping that prices fall like a rock but i don't think that will happen at least not for a year. So for example a 1000 dollar AR selling for 1700, at the height of the bubble, if it it drops somewhat, its not going back to 1000 , more likely it will drop slowly over time. At least on the secondary markets. If by some miracle gun makers are able to push out Rifles and flood the market with more , then prices will plummet.

 

[GIXXERCON]

Not sure I understand your post then... if you're providing data great...

Yes.
My initial post fell in line with the "Suckers"... 100 pmags for $7584 is 400% inflation (as opposed to the 200% that everyone else is selling them for)

 

[ntomsw]

What really sucks is I was going to buy a Lower as a Xmas gift for my big brother. No way ill spend what people want.

jasons ran a very cheap lower buy, as did I. You should have gotten in on 1 of those.

 

[hikerlt]

I've been having fun watching the last second "bid sniping" for 223 mags on eBay......WTF !?!?!?

Saw a single ordinary aluminum AR15 30 rd mag go for over $100....!!!!

One guy on there his ad says he has over 100 Pmags to sell, and he's selling them singly, one by one.....and they're going for %50 to $70 each....!

 

[rep308]

I agree that dealers won't be seeing much in the way of mags, ammo and new stock AR's in the near future. The channel is dry.

But higher prices could boost the supply of consignment guns. At these prices I'm thinking of selling guns and ammo. I stocked up a bit and it may make sense to monetize some of my stuff.

I think the difference between now and 94 is that people have multiple AR's, and boat loads of mags. Before all this high cap mag crap started people had one mag and a spare for a gun, that it. Now they look and say 'Crap, I only have 10 30 round mags, I need more'

AR's are unique in that the legal part of the gun, the receiver, could be had for $75. Buy a couple and save up to build later.

 

[SJan]

Stripped lowers are going for $275 to $500 on GB right now.

Good grief.

I have a handful. I should throw a matched set of two on there for a grand.

I have 2 that I'm not using, didn't plan on building them up for a while. I'm thinking about selling one. Purchased for under $100, sell for 4-500?

 

[Len-2A Training]

No, IIRC it was her mentor Reilly.

LenS please correct me if I am wrong, But if I am not mistaken the only way you can have a license to sell ammo in Ma. is if you actually have a place of business there.
So that being said, Reilly, Bastardized his interpretation of the law to suit his agenda. As in all reality the place that the sale took place, was at Midway's shop. The ammo was delivered there to Ma. by common carrier, Not by Midway. So the AG's Office knowingly violated the Commerce Claus of The United States Constitution, By making requirements (Tariffs)on businesses from another state that was not conducting sales in Ma.
A very close friend of mine called Midway with just this arguement and spoke with Mr Potterfield, at length about this issue. Mr. Potterfield told him that he did not generate that much in sales to Ma. to warrant the expense of that kind of lawsuit.
Reilly had a habit of distorting the law for his personal agenda, I believe that is how the Regs were created for the AG's gun list using the "Consumer Protection Office" of the AG.

Joe, I don't recall if it was Harshbarger or Reilly but one of the two AGs that nailed Midway and others (products shipped to minors, no adult signature required, etc.) and got them to sign "consent decrees" promising NEVER to ship certain classes of items into MA. That's a "contract" and enforceable in civil court, so yes if 10 years later they violated it they would automatically lose in court and be subject to "damages" to the state.

MA does not recognize the Commerce Clause or anything else in Fed Law that doesn't suit their purposes. Getting sued in a "foreign" state (where you don't know the rules/regs/laws) and hiring competent counsel is costly, so when "offered a deal" by the AG, it's easy to make that choice.

MA contends that you need a MA Ammo Dealer's License (state permit, issued by a local police chief) in order to sell ammo into MA (violation of Commerce Clause). At one time (number of years ago) Ron Glidden told me that a specific police chief in MA was willing to issue said licenses to non-MA companies wishing to obtain it. I did pass that info on to a few of these companies that had suddenly stopped shipping to MA, but none were interested in pursuing it. In more recent years, I have seen (unsure if it was Email or printed somewhere) where EOPS has "determined" (another interpretation ) that ALL dealers who sell ammo/components in MA MUST obtain a separate MA Ammo Dealer's License for EACH CITY/TOWN they do business in!!!!!!! The implication of this would be a MA Dealer who works the gun show circuit (Marlboro, Big E, Wilmington, Plymouth, etc.) would have to get said license from each of these towns PLUS the one in the town they have their brick & mortar store in! Totally absurd and I guarantee you that no dealer has done this! [But the intimidation factor of such "interpretations" has the desired effect of shutting down many/most out of state dealers from ever thinking about doing business in MA! This is why Midway responded like they did . . . they've been told that to sell in MA essentially they would have to get said licenses in up to 351 cities/towns . . . many would refuse to issue it and it costs $100/pop!]

 

[Gillham]

AR's are unique in that the legal part of the gun, the receiver, could be had for $75. Buy a couple and save up to build later.

Not necessarily true. It was covered in another thread. In the previous ban (no one can predict what a new one might state), the lower must have been completed and built with all the 'killy' features prior to the ban to be considered preban. So if you load up on lowers now, and don't complete them as a rifle prior to a ban put in place, they not a preban lower.

So the solution? Get an upper, get all your lowers together, slap your upper on, one at a time and fill out your FA-10's one by one.

 

[alphawolf]

Watching the price gouging from the sidelines makes me laugh even on NES. Here is a Gun worth 800 but I will sell it for 2 grand because everyone is in a panic. What a joke.

 

[Oldarmy]

Joe, I don't recall if it was Harshbarger or Reilly but one of the two AGs that nailed Midway and others (products shipped to minors, no adult signature required, etc.) and got them to sign "consent decrees" promising NEVER to ship certain classes of items into MA. That's a "contract" and enforceable in civil court, so yes if 10 years later they violated it they would automatically lose in court and be subject to "damages" to the state.

MA does not recognize the Commerce Clause or anything else in Fed Law that doesn't suit their purposes. Getting sued in a "foreign" state (where you don't know the rules/regs/laws) and hiring competent counsel is costly, so when "offered a deal" by the AG, it's easy to make that choice.

MA contends that you need a MA Ammo Dealer's License (state permit, issued by a local police chief) in order to sell ammo into MA (violation of Commerce Clause). At one time (number of years ago) Ron Glidden told me that a specific police chief in MA was willing to issue said licenses to non-MA companies wishing to obtain it. I did pass that info on to a few of these companies that had suddenly stopped shipping to MA, but none were interested in pursuing it. In more recent years, I have seen (unsure if it was Email or printed somewhere) where EOPS has "determined" (another interpretation ) that ALL dealers who sell ammo/components in MA MUST obtain a separate MA Ammo Dealer's License for EACH CITY/TOWN they do business in!!!!!!! The implication of this would be a MA Dealer who works the gun show circuit (Marlboro, Big E, Wilmington, Plymouth, etc.) would have to get said license from each of these towns PLUS the one in the town they have their brick & mortar store in! Totally absurd and I guarantee you that no dealer has done this! [But the intimidation factor of such "interpretations" has the desired effect of shutting down many/most out of state dealers from ever thinking about doing business in MA! This is why Midway responded like they did . . . they've been told that to sell in MA essentially they would have to get said licenses in up to 351 cities/towns . . . many would refuse to issue it and it costs $100/pop!]

See, I told you all so!

 

[one-eyed Jack]

I am in MA, have an FFL and Midway will not ship anything they "think" might be restricted to me. No muzzle loaders....no components of any kind, etc. They aren't the only ones that won't ship to a FFL holder in MA either. They all have some sort of cranial/rectal dysfunction I guess....

It helps to have a son in nh with a FFL. Jack.

 

[MassMark]

For you bargain hunters....Two bids!!! ACT NOW!

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Colt-pre-ba...549?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item4abfcc5235

 

[Rob Boudrie]

Remember, it's only "price gouging" if it's done by a person or business trying to sell you something. When you do it, it's called "market pricing".

If you wouldn't sell you house for a "fair" markup based on purchase price and years owned, you really don't have any moral right to criticize someone for marking up any other product that has appreciated in market value.

 

[warwickben]

I know lol. I went green the day after buying a s&w lower from fs 130$ ish . My brother didnt want one at the time. then after I bought all my gifts for every one else then your buy started, i couldn't get the funds in time and he wanted one then but didnt have the cash to spare cause he just bought a house.

I have horrible timing .

 

[1903Collector]

Huh? The gun shop IS your friend. YOU want a gun. THEY want money. YOU give them money and THEY give you a gun. If you were not better off for doing the transaction, then you wouldn't do it.

All this talk of getting "taken advantage" and "gouging" and "fairness" is jargon that's usually reserved for anti use. Free markets work.

I agree with you but I don't think you understood what I was saying. What I meant was a lot of people think of gun shops "they're one of us, they shouldn't jack up their prices. Which may be idealistic but a load pf crap, at the end of the day they are a business and they are "in business" too make money. Believe me I'm not on the Gouging bandwagon at all...supply and demand and if you don't like the price don't buy it. Trust me if things keep going the way they are I may be selling some things at current market prices

 

[jtorbin88]

My delton AR is 2000$ on gunbroker.

 

[henchmen77]

Sportsmans den quincy has some muzzleloaders and gear for them.

 

[HKdrummer]

I dont particularly mind the auctions. When people are dictating themselves what they're going to pay for it, I just feel like they're completely ****ing retarded. These people are gonna feel particularly stupid in 6 months when that case of ammo they paid 1200 for is sitting on the shelf at their local gunshop for $400.00.

 

[mpkeelee]

I spent 2k on my pre-ban colt and im happy. I dont plan on reselling it for profit, its not going anywhere. If i can buy newer AR's off people who only bought because of the scare i will, i wont feel bad if they take a loss. If they wanted to buy high then they shouldnt complain when prices drop. If prices do drop i plan on buying up everything i can find

 

[jpdeal]

Midway will not ship any firearms, parts, ammunition or components to customers in Massachusetts; in fact they will not even ship to an FFL. They make this very clear in the shipping information section of the web site. In fact, I tried to order some gas checks earlier this summer and a pop-up immediately appeared informing me they would not ship the item to Massachusetts. Nothing in state law prohibits ammo and components, but most major retailers completely avoid dealing with loony-bin states like MA.

 

[sweed]

Where are these $500 lowers? I see stripped lowers for 135ish. I was just looking at a few places last night, just checking out prices.

 

[Business]

I dont particularly mind the auctions. When people are dictating themselves what they're going to pay for it, I just feel like they're completely ****ing retarded. These people are gonna feel particularly stupid in 6 months when that case of ammo they paid 1200 for is sitting on the shelf at their local gunshop for $400.00.

Yup i saw a complete lower today for $500 and all I could think of was man are you gunna be pissed in a few months when its worth $150

 

[Reptile]

Where are these $500 lowers? I see stripped lowers for 135ish. I was just looking at a few places last night, just checking out prices.

GB has Noveske Gen 2 lowers selling for $600+.

A month and a half ago, a couple dealers had them in stock for $260. That was retail and a fair price for such a lower.

If I had a crystal ball, I would have bought 50 of them on credit card to sell on GB.

 

[KirkVN]

Gotta love that Keltec KSG auction, starting bid 2999.99 WTF!

 

[hy2rogen]

Have you seen the NES classifieds? Crazy prices. I'm glad I got my lowers when did... Ordered in March, arrived in Nov.

 

[calsdad]

Does anyone get the impression that there will be a lot of people who bought $500 lowers or $2000 AR's in about 3 months who will be very unhappy when they cannot sell them for even half that when the scare is over and no gun control is enacted? I spent today watching the idiots on the Sunday news programs and it seems highly unlikely anything is legitimately going to happen. Normally I think Chuck Todd is a baffoon but he laid out a pretty convincing argument for why this will all be off the radar in a month... and I am pretty sure he's no Romney supporter.

The gun buying spree is a good thing.

The fact that you guys don't recognize this is the problem.

- - - Updated - - -

Anything is possible, there's no logic in the market at this point. If thats what they sold for, thats the market.. if thats list... the market will decide if thats high or low... if thats a high list, it wont sell.

Long story short: Don't check logic at the door of any deal. When government moves markets, very few people win.

There's absolutely "logic" in the market.

People think the government is going to ban guns - or certain types of guns. They're applying the same logic that gets applied to machine guns after those got banned for further production.

Scarcity = price increases

 

[sweed]

Feeler for group buy lowers btw. I'm hoping this goes through to get one. Reptile, I saw GB, and the ones I was looking at were a little more than what I posted, any others over 200, I just ignored, lol. I think stag had those cheaper lowers.

 

[atilla]

isn't there an ultrathread about this all?