Torn about doing business with the perceived enemy.

[Ripach]

Cool, I didn't know that you were working with BPS Corporate. That's good to know. As I've been under the impression that it's not over yet. But what do I know.

Cpher,
I know people peed in your wheaties before by repeatedly questioning your facts, but please keep us updated if you hear anything worthwhile regarding to this issue.

 

[reks]

Of course, the irony is that it's probably better to just mind your own business.

1. The AG will find out if another dealer is doing something he's not supposed to eventually. The longer the naughty dealer is naughty, the more money in fines he's going to be paying. From a profit perspective, fines are pretty brutal. Not to mention that you can't sell anything if you lose your license to do so.

2. No one gets mad at a guy who minds his own business.

It seems to me that calling the AG is pretty short-sighted and you can probably do better in the long run by focusing on your own business.

 

[vellnueve]

I was down in North Attleboro for a few minutes after leaving the Milsurp shoot. Thought about going to NET, but decided just to stop at AFS to buy some ammo. Not sure I can walk into that store, even though I'm not nearly as mad as some others here are.

 

[calsdad]

Of course, the irony is that it's probably better to just mind your own business.

1. The AG will find out if another dealer is doing something he's not supposed to eventually. The longer the naughty dealer is naughty, the more money in fines he's going to be paying. From a profit perspective, fines are pretty brutal. Not to mention that you can't sell anything if you lose your license to do so.

2. No one gets mad at a guy who minds his own business.

It seems to me that calling the AG is pretty short-sighted and you can probably do better in the long run by focusing on your own business.

The world is full of people who don't seem to be able to mind their own business. Like you said - in the end, getting involved usually just messes up what would have turned out even worse for the offender - and causes you: the intervener , issues too.

This is a lesson some people never learn unfortunately.

 

[dwarven1]

It's time for Ted to speak for himself. Perhaps he should be invited as guest speaker at the next NES get together, with the topic being "The dealer's role in the law enforcement process".

You may want to frisk the attendees for tar and feathers before they get anywhere near the speaker...



It's ironic, really... NET has nothing to fear from BPS. I was there yesterday, and while it's true that they have about 5 metric tons of guns, their prices are no bargains, and neither are the prices on accessories. Just as an example, the price on a factory Ruger 10/22 magazine is about $2 over list.

Still a great place to visit, though, with lots to see and buy. (their beef jerky is pretty good!)

 

[bostonasphalt2]

Yet that same demonic presence donated a gun to GOAL's latest raffle, organized and ran the action pistol matches at 2 clubs for years and created a dealers group to represent firearms interests.

How "anti" is that?

even if he did that, he did some rather "anti" things. ASking someone to deny that is a bit crazy.

 

[Scrivener]

even if he did that, he did some rather "anti" things. ASking someone to deny that is a bit crazy.

No-one is asking or expecting anyone to "deny" anything. The issue is acting on a decision based upon review of his total track record; not one incident.

 

[bostonasphalt2]

No-one is asking or expecting anyone to "deny" anything. The issue is acting on a decision based upon review of his total track record; not one incident.

the way I see it, in such a tough state to maintain a second amendment, any small thing that is good, is good; any small thing that is bad, is VERY bad, and he contributed to the wrong pot on that one.

 

[gene]

These guys lose more business to close by, free states and people that have reletives that can be mailed the stuff Mass bans just have their stuff sent to those free states.

Mass has banned or regulated about every item a person could want for self defense and some not to inlude:

Mace - tasers - stun Guns - bullets - reloading powder - automatic knives - double edged knives - bayonet holders - flash hiders - protruding pistol grips- and god know what else from transfats to (proposed) marshmellow fluff.

Next it will be following California lead ammo and microstamping! Does anyone know if their are any Condors in MA?

Be afraid! Be very afraid! especially if a Democrat get the White House. The only thing that stands between a Class A/B license holder at the moment and a firearms permit is the attitude of the COP and that can change with retirement!

 

[gene]

The way things are going they will be telling you to buy a bullet proof back pack or one of those bright light mugger scratchers or what ever they tell women to carry on their keys if you really want personal protection!

 

[dwarven1]

Does anyone know if their are any Condors in MA?

No, just a bunch of vultures that roost on Beacon Hill in Boston.

 

[clinotus]

No-one is asking or expecting anyone to "deny" anything. The issue is acting on a decision based upon review of his total track record; not one incident.

You are completely failing to acknowledge that his 'incidents' have overshadowed and harmed many more than his good acts. If the stories are to all be believed he is personally responsible for some of the mail restrictions that we face and has likely been selling firearms owners up the river for quite some time.

 

[ArmedMainer]

You are completely failing to acknowledge that his 'incidents' have overshadowed and harmed many more than his good acts. If the stories are to all be believed he is personally responsible for some of the mail restrictions that we face and has likely been selling firearms owners up the river for quite some time.

+1000 Clearly he was involved with at least one face to face and many phone calls with the AG. To say he only had one incident even after he himself has admitted to more is totally false and nothing more than damage control.

 

[Scrivener]

You are completely failing to acknowledge that his 'incidents' have overshadowed and harmed many more than his good acts. If the stories are to all be believed he is personally responsible for some of the mail restrictions that we face and has likely been selling firearms owners up the river for quite some time.

Nonsense. What part of "total track record" do you not understand?

Further the "the mail restrictions that we face" are almost certainly the result of the Sportsmans' Guide fiasco, as has been posted here many times before, along with the time line regarding the use of "consumer protection" statutes to cripple gun rights. Claims that this dealer had "face to face discussions" with the AG are of dubious credibility, to put it charitably.

Buy where you wish, from whom you wish. But make the decision based upon facts and logic, if only for the sheer novelty of the act.

 

[GaryO]

I must be missing something when i go to NET, they have been extremely helpful and friendly. As for the ammo mail order I can't believe that he torpedoed the ability to buy ammo by mail all by himself. Massachusetts is loaded with anti gun crusaders that would gladly outlaw water guns for "the good of the public". Somehow we all end up with all the ammunition we need.

 

[Scrivener]

Well, there you go again. Cluttering up a perfectly good jihad with facts.

 

[Dirtypacman]

Off topic but after a week or so of consideration I vote Scrivener's Avatar the best on the board. Sorry I could not help myself she was just wishing me to finally say something.

Back on track.

 

[clinotus]

Nonsense. What part of "total track record" do you not understand?

Further the "the mail restrictions that we face" are almost certainly the result of the Sportsmans' Guide fiasco, as has been posted here many times before, along with the time line regarding the use of "consumer protection" statutes to cripple gun rights. Claims that this dealer had "face to face discussions" with the AG are of dubious credibility, to put it charitably.

Buy where you wish, from whom you wish. But make the decision based upon facts and logic, if only for the sheer novelty of the act.

Based upon facts and logic....sounds fair.

Facts:
Even you acknowledge that he has acknowledged that he made the call to the AG.
Others and he have stated that he has done likewise in the past.
Items 1 and 2 are harmful to the shooting sports community in this particular state.

Conjecture:
A newer member stated that said dealer scuttled ammo sales in the state.
You introduce this was the sportsmans guide fiasco...which may be unrelated.
Ted has his own ladder that he drives around town in to resuce kittens from trees; and has done so for the last 5 years.


Clearly from this side of the internet the facts bear a heavier weight.

You ask me if I have a failing to understand total track record, and assure you I understand it completely. Although perhaps not from your point of view, its like you are defending a priest at a touchers trial. "Yeah but hes done so much good in the community...this incident with Timmy means nothing...".

 

[madmarc0]

Based upon facts and logic....sounds fair.

Facts:
Even you acknowledge that he has acknowledged that he made the call to the AG.
Others and he have stated that he has done likewise in the past.
Items 1 and 2 are harmful to the shooting sports community in this particular state.

Conjecture:
A newer member stated that said dealer scuttled ammo sales in the state.
You introduce this was the sportsmans guide fiasco...which may be unrelated.
Ted has his own ladder that he drives around town in to resuce kittens from trees; and has done so for the last 5 years.


Clearly from this side of the internet the facts bear a heavier weight.

You ask me if I have a failing to understand total track record, and assure you I understand it completely. Although perhaps not from your point of view, its like you are defending a priest at a touchers trial. "Yeah but hes done so much good in the community...this incident with Timmy means nothing...".

AMEN, one bad apple is one too many in the shooting community. Your post was clearly understood by me.
Of all of the good things folks can do for the shooting community by far the worst thing is to think that you should be involved with the policing of other enthusiasts and that means starting an investigation or being part of one.
It's better to shut the hell up and let the professionals handle it.
Like the org. GOAL and the lawyers that work with them who are supposed to look out for our best interests and not theirs.

 

[Moderator]

Scriv, Any chance you have a bias opinion about NET.

 

[ArmedMainer]

Read this post This seems to lead in the direction that NET was indeed connected with the AG long before the BPS incident. I wouldn't know personally if he had a storefront when this all took place.

Nonsense. What part of "total track record" do you not understand?

Further the "the mail restrictions that we face" are almost certainly the result of the Sportsmans' Guide fiasco, as has been posted here many times before, along with the time line regarding the use of "consumer protection" statutes to cripple gun rights. Claims that this dealer had "face to face discussions" with the AG are of dubious credibility, to put it charitably.
.

Total track record ?? Let's take a quick look at the total track record shall we ? We're talking about many NES'ers, not one person complaining about NET betraying gun owners. Ted himself has admitted calling the AG's office to MANY posters here at NES. The act of betrayal affects us all as gun owners more than the three good things you posted as part of his total record. I would imagine the gun given to GOAL although a nice gesture was done at least in part for advertising purposes. I know for a fact that at some of the gun club functions he helped put on he also sold ammo at them. Both of these are something any businessman would do to get their name out there and make more sales. To imply he did these things because he cares about gun owners rights more than the bottom line borders between insulting and laughable. I personally don't know "qmmo" whose post you said was of "dubious credibility" but his post seems to back up all the other members here who said they confronted Ted personally about this subject. Gun owners in this state don't need "friends" like Ted helping us out.

 

[Scrivener]

Scriv, Any chance you have a bias[ed] opinion about NET.

ALL opinions are biased. The issue is how much and why.

My bias?

1. I think the whole "He met with the AG to stop mail order sales" accusation is bunk. That nonsense biases me against those who make their decisions based on it.

2. I think the incident with BPS was poorly thought out; however, the knee-jerk defense of BPS is almost as ill-reasoned. See # 1.

3. Naturally any business publically donating to any charitable enterprise is looking for favorable publicity/name recognition. That does not make the donation any less useful to the charity or the raffle winner/high bidder/other recipient. Ergo, claiming that these acts - we are not talking just one donation here - don't count is absurd.

4. I've been doing business there for years, including before the store opened. That experience also weighs into - biases, if you will - my assessment.

So - what are your biases?

As for this thread generally:

 

[Tiktock]

I don't buy the whole "he donated some guns and sponsored some matches so he's a good guy" line of thinking. Any act that benefits or hurts a group is not equal in impact. Even if this guy donated 10 guns a year and sponsored 5 matches a year or more, I don't think those small self-serving (though beneficial to the recipients) acts serve to wash away even one single act that hurts gun owners as a larger group in a state like MA.

Giving someone a lollypop then filling their gastank with sugar as you walk away is not a "wash."

People can shop where they want and associate themselves with who they want and explain why in a million different ways on both sides and we will still be where we are right now; standing around a pile of poop arguing over which part of it stinks more (or less.)

 

[NFD9]

its like you are defending a priest at a touchers trial. "Yeah but hes done so much good in the community...this incident with Timmy means nothing...".

OUCH!!
That ones gotta hurt.

 

[Tiktock]

OUCH!!
That ones gotta hurt.

No one got hurt to begin with. A donation in the amount of $1 to the abused children foundation washed the slate clean long ago in that toucher trial...plus I know the toucher personally and he's a super-duper guy and once let someone cut in front of him in heavy traffic without swearing once!

 

[Mooney]

Just for the record....

Ted (AFAIK) did not SPONSOR matches, he RAN matches at two clubs for years (not once or twice as others have said).

There IS a difference. One is self serving. The other is not.

 

[Scrivener]

Just for the record....

Ted (AFAIK) did not SPONSOR matches, he RAN matches at two clubs for years (not once or twice as others have said).

There IS a difference. One is self serving. The other is not.

Are you trying to clutter up a good rant with FACTS?! What are you thinking?

 

[News Shooter]

ALL opinions are biased. The issue is how much and why.

My bias?

1. I think the whole "He met with the AG to stop mail order sales" accusation is bunk. That nonsense biases me against those who make their decisions based on it.

2. I think the incident with BPS was poorly thought out; however, the knee-jerk defense of BPS is almost as ill-reasoned. See # 1.

3. Naturally any business publically donating to any charitable enterprise is looking for favorable publicity/name recognition. That does not make the donation any less useful to the charity or the raffle winner/high bidder/other recipient. Ergo, claiming that these acts - we are not talking just one donation here - don't count is absurd.

4. I've been doing business there for years, including before the store opened. That experience also weighs into - biases, if you will - my assessment.

So - what are your biases?

As for this thread generally:

What do you call a school of sharks swimming around a drowning lawyer?



Professional courtesy!!!!

 

[drgrant]

You are completely failing to acknowledge that his 'incidents' have overshadowed and harmed many more than his good acts. If the stories are to all be believed he is personally responsible for some of the mail restrictions that we face and has likely been selling firearms owners up the river for quite some time.

+1... I think what most here are pissed about is if he was willing
to call the AG about BPS, and then practically "gloated with
glee" about it, how many other phone calls has he made?
(for example, he may not have STARTED the ammo jihad by the
AG, but he probably aided and abetted it; eg, ratting on dealers
that would ship to joe consumer... and him being one of the more
prominent dealers, would stand to benefit from blocking out
internet ammo sales from MA. Not to mention the fact that
most people don't have an "NH/RI/CT wallhack" to get around
the problem, or don't want to take the time to set it up.

-Mike

 

[ArmedMainer]

Just for the record....

Ted (AFAIK) did not SPONSOR matches, he RAN matches at two clubs for years (not once or twice as others have said).

There IS a difference. One is self serving. The other is not.

Him selling ammo at a place other than his business wasn't in his personal interest? He didn't make any money on the ammo or make any contacts that increased his sales? There's no crime in trying to improve yourself or your business but as others have said it doesn't give him a license to stab the rest of us in the back.