DickWanner
Banned
Yes, but what are your chances of winning and not looking like a Grade-A d.bag?
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F_k you and your automatic rifle!
- Thread starter law dawg
- Start date
Dumbasses
To bad he wasn`t able to kill the brother. I`d like to know what happened to him.
*****
To bad he wasn`t able to kill the brother. I`d like to know what happened to him.
dwarven1
Lonely Mountain Arms
Depends where you file suit, I guess.
It'd be an interesting trend, though... can you picture the headlines? "Man acquitted of murder by verdict of self-defense sues estate of assailant for legal costs arising from his defense of the murder charges".
I'm probably dense, but why do you need to run? Why does a victim need to take all venues to show they are a victim? Since when does "self defense" involve running away to be self defense? Just can't buy this concept.
I don't think your dense - I think it has to do with "getting away" with defending yourself. I think you have to remember that if you are going to be dealing with a MA jury - if you were to just turn around and shoot the guy, which is enough of a defense that it would work in the rest of the country (you might not even get arrested) - it would in all likelihood NOT work here in MA. By running you demonstrate - as Ayoob testified - that YOU are most definitely a victim. This is something even a moonbat jury could understand. Especially if you played it up on the jury stand. I think you have to realize the way OTHER people think - and use that your advantage.
The scumbags see you as a victim by running - and this only makes them thirsty for blood.
The moonbats will be more likely to see you as a victim when you run - and more likely to see the other guy as nothing but an aggressor - especially if they chase you for 22 miles. After all - who chases somebody for 22 miles? That's like crazy movie or TV show lunatic stuff.
It's your responsibility to stay alive and walk out of the incident as unscathed as possible - that includes taking care of the attackers during the incident - and the subsequent legal drama afterwards.
Make the attackers use their own desires against themy by provoking their attack response - and make them do something so stupid that it looks like a reasonable act on your part to shoot them.
I am not saying that in a perfect world you couldn't just shoot these guys at first sign of them wanting to attack you - I'm saying we don't live in that perfect world. Especially here in MA.
I honestly think that this guy screwed up a little - the incident would have been more perfect if he could have shot BOTH of them. That would have avoided some of the future incidents he had to deal with.
I guess the simple way of saying this is that I think you would be really smart to know all of the parameters you are dealing with and use them to your advantage as much as possible - and set these guys up to get shot with maximum effect.
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J
Jose
Way to fight back in court........
![[rolleyes]](/xen/styles/default/xenforo/smilies.vb/042.gif "Roll Eyes [rolleyes]")
J
Jose
You better buy it because there are still many states where "stand your ground" is not the law. Ohio is one of them. Up until this September, Ohioans had a duty to make a reasonable attempt to retreat from any confrontation outside the home before the use of deadly force could become legal. Now we do not have to retreat if we are in our homes OR vehicles, but still must do so if out on foot.
In any case, every trainer I have studied with has told me the same thing: even if it isn't your legal duty where you are, attempt to retreat and de-escalate if reasonably possible.
Well, look at the scenario.
He wasn't in his home, so Castle Doctrine doesn't apply. FWIW, at home, I would stand and fight, not run, I feel no "moral obligation" to avoid a conflict in my residence.
He was in a public area. So, now, he may incur a moral obligation to avoid the conflict.
So, if you're ambushed in a public place, do you wish to fight where your opponent chooses, or where you choose? Me, I'd go with where I choose.
Then, there's the hassle of trial defense. Why not make it an easy choice for the jury? Especially when the jury may be loaded with Liberal Moonbats?
+1
The trainers I have studied with have said the same thing.
Swallow your pride. Run away if possible. De-escalate if possible. You really don't want to go through the aftermath of using deadly force if you can avoid it.
Lawful Shooting
The scariest part of the whole scenario is the cost of defending yourself. I sure as hell don`t have the kind of money to hire a very good attorney and pay for expert witnesses.
**********
The scariest part of the whole scenario is the cost of defending yourself. I sure as hell don`t have the kind of money to hire a very good attorney and pay for expert witnesses.
Earlier this year Aware had a seminar on the use of deadly force. Two of the speakers were prominent MA defense attorneys. One is Kevin Reddington, who has successfully defended a number of self defense cases. I can't remember the name of the other fellow, but he'd been an ADA in Suffolk County for 13 years, supervising over 100 other prosecutors at one point.
They both said that they charge about $100k for defending against a murder charge, and that is a significant discount from their usual hourly rate.
Personally, that is not the scariest part of the scenario for me. To me, the scariest part is life without parole.
I agree. Ever hear of the Harold Fish shooting incident?
http://www.kvoa.com/Global/story.asp?S=5034336&nav=menu216_2
The guy wasn't perfect, but it's a chilling reminder that carrying a legal gun doesn't mean the jury will love you no matter what you do.
I'm all for retreating and forgetting pride, 100%. What I meant in my earlier post is that I think it's sad that many people won't see you as the victim unless you run 22 miles first.
F
Finalygotabeltfed
Here's a clue..........If I ever have the absolute need to use a gun and a full auto is all I have available at the time, guess what Holmes.....you're gonna get f***ing hosed......bank on it. Anyone who thinks differently will be in a morgue sooner than they think.
And for all the do gooders and fudds out there who think that its such a terrible thing.....F' You and you defeatist, pacifist, spineless, victim mentallity.
I refuse to be a victim and I'd rather spend the rest of my life defending my actions and be alive than be dead and buried under a headstone in the cemetery at the hand of some two bit thug for obeying some insane regulation thought up by some incompetent political hack.
When its life or death, my life and safety trumps any law dreamed up by some overpaid a**h*** on Beacon Hill.
And for all the do gooders and fudds out there who think that its such a terrible thing.....F' You and you defeatist, pacifist, spineless, victim mentallity.
I refuse to be a victim and I'd rather spend the rest of my life defending my actions and be alive than be dead and buried under a headstone in the cemetery at the hand of some two bit thug for obeying some insane regulation thought up by some incompetent political hack.
When its life or death, my life and safety trumps any law dreamed up by some overpaid a**h*** on Beacon Hill.
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